Culture (border interaction)

[Ryika]

I like the idea of "border friction", but any system that has borders move based on culture should be based on a more active approach (imho). Having Tiles flip (or not flip) semi-randomly just isn't interesting gameplay and can be very frustrating.

 

[Hakan-i Cihan]

I like the idea of "border friction", but any system that has borders move based on culture should be based on a more active approach (imho). Having Tiles flip (or not flip) semi-randomly just isn't interesting gameplay and can be very frustrating.

Some districts, especially cultural and military districts can be involved in this process. The placement of these districts could influence this border friction in a more active way.

 

[lp_04]

what about if culture could shift borders in the early/mid-game but not the late game after borders are more established? i think that would be the most realistic option

Since the developers are implementing different approaches that change during the course of the game - the diplomatic relations, for instance, but also, presumably, the scientific "bonuses"- I would really like to see the relation between borders from different civs change in that pace as well.

One example could assume the borders were kept away from the traditional concept of "culture borders". In the early game, borders could expand by the very expansion of the city. I mean, a new district or wonder provides border expansion to adjacent tiles, if they are not claimed by any civs. Some policies/civics/governments could even provide such expansion for improvements like mines or forts, or even the ability to claim enemy lands. As the game progresses, the neutral tiles should become claimed and not accessible to flip between civs by these means. Although, during the mid and late game (or even early game) military units should be able to claim territory belonging to another civ (there was even a mod like this for civ V).

This won't happen as we see by the screenshots. But some system that changes the border expansion/tension between civs during the course of the game should be implemented, as we see that civilization VI is becoming a more "relative" gameplay (which is fantastic).

Couldn't keep myself away from the speculation...

 

[dexters]

I always felt where it made the most sense was during the colonial era (and especially the race for Africa). I have suggested before that they should bring back nationality among the population count of the city and have culture shift that.

That being said, I'm opposed to city flipping for gameplay reasons. Likewise, I really don't like when the borders completely suck dry the territory of a city. I thought it was awful in Civ4 when you conquered a city and literally got the tile and nothing else. I'd also argue the new city district system undercuts the idea of culture encroaching on rival cities.

I think cultural borders will be as they are in Civ5 to be honest. There was no mention of rejigging the cultural /borders game, maybe it's a feature they are not yet ready to show or it could be expanded upon later in say an expansion.

But Civ5 cities generally work more like provinces. You take the city, you take control of the territory around it. It would make sense to retain that with districts or that mechanic wouldn't work very well.

 

[TheMarshmallowBear]

I think cultural borders will be as they are in Civ5 to be honest. There was no mention of rejigging the cultural /borders game, maybe it's a feature they are not yet ready to show or it could be expanded upon later in say an expansion.

But Civ5 cities generally work more like provinces. You take the city, you take control of the territory around it. It would make sense to retain that with districts or that mechanic wouldn't work very well.

I hope for one thing and that each city has their own "borders" within borders that denoated by the primary or their secndary color so we know which tiles belong to which city.

 

[stealth_nsk]

I hope for one thing and that each city has their own "borders" within borders that denoated by the primary or their secndary color so we know which tiles belong to which city.

That's purely UI feature not affecting gameplay. Could be even done with mod if developers will not have time to implement it, but yes, I'd like to see city borders implemented someway too.

 

[brianshapiro]

That's purely UI feature not affecting gameplay. Could be even done with mod if developers will not have time to implement it, but yes, I'd like to see city borders implemented someway too.

Yes, I agree with that, too, and it would further define a city's borders as delineating a kind of city state.

I think they could build some gameplay around it too. So, in Civ 5 you could make puppet states. But what if you could incorporate city states into your empire that were semi-autonomous, and what if your cities could revolt and become independent? Borders around cities could become a really useful UI element that would sync with the gameplay.

 

[stealth_nsk]

Yes, I agree with that, too, and it would further define a city's borders as delineating a kind of city state.

I think they could build some gameplay around it too. So, in Civ 5 you could make puppet states. But what if you could incorporate city states into your empire that were semi-autonomous, and what if your cities could revolt and become independent? Borders around cities could become a really useful UI element that would sync with the gameplay.

Cities already have borders, they are just not visible. And conquering city passes it with all its borders. So it doesn't cause any actual gameplay mechanic

 

[brianshapiro]

I am against city cultural flip because of enormous gameplay frustration/exploitability, and border cultural changes because of lack of realism.

...
Probably yes, but it'd be rare cases of limited scale ethnic divisions (and I'd say government almost always used coercion in such situations), and we are talking about all empires of the world being able to casually take territory of all other alien empires not with military or diplomacy but, uhm, citizens (???) and that happening all the time across history.
Okay I can imagine Ucrainian city flipping to Russia, for example but that's one of very rare instances when such mechanic would make sense.

Yes, but if they did some type of ethnic population tally like we had in some past Civ games, then I could easily see cities with high populations of the foreign civ revolt and join the other civ.

Its been a long time since I played a civ game with culture flipping, but as I recall, didn't stationing troops put down some chance that it would flip?

 

[brianshapiro]

Cities already have borders, they are just not visible. And conquering city passes it with all its borders. So it doesn't cause any actual gameplay mechanic

Yes I know, it would just be a useful UI element for new game mechanics they could build on top of that