FFH MANUALS: which one?

[jprc]

Grey Fox's manual is included in the patches and the related thread is sticky whilst Xienwolf's work and thread is not.

Grey Fox: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=257728
Xienwolf: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=265888

In my humble opinion, Xienwolf's manual, in its current version (1.8) is now at least equivalent to Grey Fox's version, is easier to browse (thanks to the tons of hyperlinks) and print (white background), and is updated with latest changes. It corresponds also better to an off-line version of a revised pedia, which is nice.

It is not a competition for knowing who is the best.
Both made a huge lengthy work deserving many praises and thanks!!
We don't want to waste 2 talents by making 2 manuals aiming, I think, at the same goal.

The problem will be to know which manual will grow in the future and will stick better to the constant evolution of FFH2...

Question:

Which choice will be best for you (FFH)?:
1- Include both manuals in the coming patches? (Makes it bigger but user can choose)
2- Stick for a while with Grey Fox's manual (at least until it is obsolete)
3- Have only Xienwolf’s manual included in the future patches.
4- Have whatever manual: just put the most recent / better updated in the next patch!
5- Have the FFH writers merging the 2 works?
6- Remove both manuals from the patches and add an entry in the pedia with the links?
7- Include Xienwolf and/or Grey Fox in the FFH team , making them officially in charge of the manual.
8- Another idea (please elaborate in a post)
9- Don’t care about any manual!

... My own choices would be 3 (it is currently better updated), then 4 and 7.
(Multiple choice possible)

 

[xienwolf]

I would just like to say for anyone who isn't aware of it that to my knowledge there is no competition between me and Grey Fox. He recently became active online again and stated that he doesn't have a connection 365 days a year, hence his recent 3 month or so absence.

I had originally compiled data because I was just curious about too many things. Then in the middle of my doing that project for my own use (never planned to post it), Grey Fox posted his manual and blew us all away. Since he stated that his future plans were to include all the raw information I was compiling, I decided to step it up and post it so that I could save him some time (I was starting to realize how much of a pain it could be!).

By the time I finally posted it, Grey Fox had gone from the Forums for a while. Took me quite a while to realize that one, and so a while later I decided to make my raw data a tad bit prettier for people to utilize it in addition to his Manual. It still stands that I would happily let ANYONE, not just Grey Fox, snag all the data I have compiled and make their own Manual (or just snag it all from the XML & python of course. No way to tell where the info came from since it isn't exactly a secret ). I would pray that it looks better than mine and I can go back to playing the game more than reading it

But don't worry that just because I am willing to hand over the reigns I am also willing to drop the ball. I'd only quit updating mine if someone else was offering a better product all around, and would still lend a hand to ensure they kept up to date if it became needed



Also, Kael didn't include Grey Fox's Manual with .31 (reasonably certain on that one. If he did then I accidentally erased it when I was clearing space on my drive).

 

[JDexter]

I would say that Greyfox's manual already is obsolete with the noticable tech tree and very big magic system changes. Also a few new things were introduced with several 0.30 patches and 0.31 (a ton of events, graveyards, etc.) which aren't mentioned (to my knowledge) in GFs version.

It would be good if the most recent manual would be included, but that's Kael's call anyway.

 

[smjjames]

Well, as stated before, Greyfox's manual is out of date and I did check, the manual wasn't included in the .31 release.

There is an excel worksheet, but that is to help with the worldbuilder or in making scenarios or something.

 

[kenoxite]

Both are excellent manuals with their own merits and misses. I'd love to see both up to date and even combined in a single manual, if possible. Where GreyFox's could be a sort of "quick guide", Xienwolf's is definitely deeper and IMO easier to the FfH new player. I don't see a real competition between both as my impression is that both come from a different point of view on how and which information to present.

But if merging is out of the question then I go for the most updated and informative. And right now that's Xienwolf's.

 

[Sofista]

As long as they're updated, why not keep both into the .exe? They sure don't take much space compared to the rest.
I also voted that a merging would be fine. May I also add that for non-printing purposes a black background is easier on the eye?

 

[leo.]

i like xienwolfs manual, just put the finishing touches

i know another community manual for the game heroes V, tribes of the east, best community manual i've ever seen before

perhaps you want to get some ideas from it... its the 50mb dl (3.0 pdf manual)
http://www.heroesofmightandmagic.com/heroes5/toe_info.shtml

 

[Nonobots]

I love both current manuals and the site http://phrasr.com/ffh/pedia.php and all those have been good reference material providing more integrated view of the data than the Civilopedia. I think Grey Fox's manual feels more 'complete' but is more outdated and Xienwolf's is better structured, more up-to-date but isn't final yet and still has some holes.

I love when games come with a Quickstart Guide and a Reference Manual. FFH, with its big learning curve would profit a lot from this approach. Basic 'getting started' is somewhat lacking in those three sources. Highlighting the differences between Vanilla and FFH, overview of broad strategies and tutorial-like material. Both manual currently have some elements in those veins (the civ's strategies in Xienwolf's and the What is FFH in Grey Fox's) but nothing clearly identified as is. This might cut a lot of the faqs (why can't I build this, I hooked up my copper but it doesn't show up, what are those weird blue things on the map, etc.)

Documentation is one of the hardest part of a community project. Both Grey Fox and Xienwolf have done excellent work here. Keeping the manual up-to-date with the fast development speed of FFH requires lots of dedication. Thanks guys.

 

[Grey Fox]

I'd love to help Xienwolf with his manual in the future. But currently, I just don't have a stable internet connection (I actually have none of my own).

His is the most up to date, so it should be included.