I was told that ATI cards are better at rendering 2D as well as playing DVD, VCD etc. Is this true?dannyevilcat said:ATI is hardly in freefall
And nice to see you are still around (at CFC).
I am building this PC...
- Thread starter Knight-Dragon
- Start date
And nice to see you are still around (at CFC).
Comraddict
C.IV
..They used to be. Problem was that some manufacturers used cheap partd - nvidia didn't enforce standardization. The newer nv generations (gf5fx, gf6) do as good job as ATi does. and many manufacturers make cards form both chip suppliers. And ATi has significant design problems over a year now.
dannyevilcat
DESTROYER OF FURNITURE
Comraddict said:
ATI has had problems with it's transition to a smaller die process for a couple of it's next gen cards, with poor yields which are apparently sorted out now. Even though nVidia was a clear winner this time out with the 7800 series, ATI should be able to recovery pretty quickly (6 months to a year).
I'm especially looking forward to the end of next year when their r600 core arrives with unified shaders, with which ATI are presumably ahead of nVidia at this point, due to they're early adoption of it and they're work on the Xbox360.
I've had both brands, and IMHO ATI gives better image quality.
Also, the GeForce FX5 series sucked, and nVidia recovered just fine...
Comraddict said:
Well, what with Civ4 and all...
You might consider a passive heat sink like the Thermaltake SonicTower for the CPU, then add a 120mm fan to it. That's what I'm doing for my A64x2 4400+ 
Also I would avoid the Hitachi HDD. I looked at getting a pair for my latest PC, and from the people I've talked to they have an unusually high failure rate. Maxtor is my personal favorite -been using their drives for 10 years with no problems- followed by Western Digital... though my current PC is running a pair of Samsung's.
ATI isn't even in the game with the latest generation... all we have from them is promises of what we *might* see in November (last I heard). If they don't deliver on that, they're going to be hurting. Heck, does ATI even have crossfire out yet? I haven't exactly looked.
On the whole ATI vs nVidia issue, well, I've owned 4 ATI cards:
The 7000 was a piece of junk - though that's pretty universally agreed on with the crappy drivers ATI had then.
Both of the 9800Pros wasted my time and money - crashes, instability, wouldn't run Dx9 apps at all.
The X700 died after 2 weeks of minimal use.
So, I will never again buy an ATI card unless something miraculous occurs. I like their competition though; good for prices.
Also I would avoid the Hitachi HDD. I looked at getting a pair for my latest PC, and from the people I've talked to they have an unusually high failure rate. Maxtor is my personal favorite -been using their drives for 10 years with no problems- followed by Western Digital... though my current PC is running a pair of Samsung's.
ATI isn't even in the game with the latest generation... all we have from them is promises of what we *might* see in November (last I heard). If they don't deliver on that, they're going to be hurting. Heck, does ATI even have crossfire out yet? I haven't exactly looked.
On the whole ATI vs nVidia issue, well, I've owned 4 ATI cards:
The 7000 was a piece of junk - though that's pretty universally agreed on with the crappy drivers ATI had then.
Both of the 9800Pros wasted my time and money - crashes, instability, wouldn't run Dx9 apps at all.
The X700 died after 2 weeks of minimal use.
So, I will never again buy an ATI card unless something miraculous occurs. I like their competition though; good for prices.
Comraddict
C.IV
ATi's new card (R520) will compete with geforece 6800, not close to 7800 series. It will have same specs as gf6 6800 (16 pixel pipelines, 256-bit memory) , and just a higher clock speed.
To remind you that x800 series didn't bring anything new. Both 9700/9800pro and x800 have exact same direct x support - pixel shader model 2, while 6800 support pixel shader model 3. Talk about being sloppy.
My experience with ATi (8500LE, 9700 pro) is that both drivers and cards itself cause instabilites. Especially now when driver focus is on new cards, older ones suffer from it even more. Half Life2, the game that endorses ATi, crashed on me after 10 mins of play...with latest drivers.
To remind you that x800 series didn't bring anything new. Both 9700/9800pro and x800 have exact same direct x support - pixel shader model 2, while 6800 support pixel shader model 3. Talk about being sloppy.
My experience with ATi (8500LE, 9700 pro) is that both drivers and cards itself cause instabilites. Especially now when driver focus is on new cards, older ones suffer from it even more. Half Life2, the game that endorses ATi, crashed on me after 10 mins of play...with latest drivers.
dannyevilcat
DESTROYER OF FURNITURE
Comraddict said:
No, r520 will compete with the 7800GTX. The X800's and X850's were competition to the 6800's.
Even though it is only 16 pipes, the card has wicked high clock speeds, and should have more than enough fillrate to match the current nVidia offerings.
Of the 24 pipelines on the 7800GTX, less than that are actually working at a time. I can't remember how many, 20?
Comraddict said:
Well, I got suckered into the SM3.0 feature too (because it's being used for Neverwinter Nights 2, mostly). However, how many games currently take advantage of it (and there is a difference between actually featuring it and just supporting it)?
I see the GF7 series as the first generation where SM3.0 will actually have a useful purpose, as the 6600 and 6800 cards probably won't be able to turn on all the highest graphic settings in the games that use it. Note, the r520 and all of this generation ATI will also have it.
And yes, ATI also got burned by SLI, and has been playing catch-up, but all nVidia's main advantages will vanish around the end of September or early November, and who will care then, except to use it as ammo whenever ATI vs. nVidia wars break out in forums everywhere?
I am only getting a A64 3000+.Speedo said:You might consider a passive heat sink like the Thermaltake SonicTower for the CPU, then add a 120mm fan to it. That's what I'm doing for my A64x2 4400+
No real need, I'll just go with the retailer fan... My main consideration is quiet operation...
Actually I prefer the Samsung P120, but they aren't selling in Singapore. I have a friend who actually works for Seagate, and I have been hearing many stories from him, so...
I don't know about elsewhere but I've read that Maxtor's warranty service is terrible over here, whilst Hitachi's is first class.
Hitachi is actually ex-IBM...
As for the GPU, I'll probably go for the Powercolor Radeon X800 GT 256MB (PCIe), rather than a 6600 GT. It's about the same price...
I'm not playing the very latest 3D games - the next game on my list is actually Neverwinter Nights (which I have some problem running on my current, ancient, noisy setup).
I'm not playing the very latest 3D games - the next game on my list is actually Neverwinter Nights (which I have some problem running on my current, ancient, noisy setup).
PC is up and running... A little noisy, from the fans but otherwise much quieter than my old one.
HAND
Armchair Philosopher
Knight-Dragon said:PC is up and running... A little noisy, from the fans but otherwise much quieter than my old one.
Get benchmarking! I've a got a very similiar spec pc... Did you get that Radeon X800 or did go for the 6600gt?
Radeon X800GT. About the same price as the 6600 GT but with slightly better performance.
It is ATi's response against the 6600 GT.
It is ATi's response against the 6600 GT.
Updated the BIOS last night. Had a little trouble booting up OS, but it sorted itself after some time. Whew.
Question - where do I check the driver version for the chipset and on-board sound drivers? I'm trying to see if my drivers are of the same version as those available latest on Abit's website.
Question - where do I check the driver version for the chipset and on-board sound drivers? I'm trying to see if my drivers are of the same version as those available latest on Abit's website.
tR1cKy
taking over the world
Knight-Dragon said:Having done the research... this are my chosen components.
CPU/MB - AMD Athlon 64 3000+/Abit A8N Ultra
RAM - 1 gig DDR400 RAM (kit, 2.5)
Hard disk - Hitachi Deskstar T7K250 250 Gig
GPU - Leadtek WinFast PX6600 GT TDH Extreme
Casing - Antec Sonata II
Any further comments/recommendations?
Bad RAM choice. Why 2.5? Use 2 sticks of 512M DDR400 with CL2.
Hard disk: use 2 of them, possibly in RAID. You won't be disappointed. Be sure to put some fans onto them, or they will cook.
Case, gpu and mobo are OK.
Want the PC cool and quiet? Toss the fan into the thrashcan and use a watercooling kit. You'll never want fans anymore.
EDIT: uh oh... too late
GrandAdmiral
Deity
Knight-Dragon said:Having done the research... this are my chosen components.
CPU/MB - AMD Athlon 64 3000+/Abit A8N Ultra
RAM - 1 gig DDR400 RAM (kit, 2.5)
Hard disk - Hitachi Deskstar T7K250 250 Gig
GPU - Leadtek WinFast PX6600 GT TDH Extreme
Casing - Antec Sonata II
Any further comments/recommendations?
I would stay away from Maxtor and Hitachi drives. They both have slightly higher failure rates and the Maxtors are loud. Seagate and Western Digital are much better. I would go with Seagate Barracuda hard drives, they are fast, quiet and reliable.
I would go with a Zalman cooler which is much quieter and cooler then the stock cpu cooler. Once you ditch that stock cooler you will notice how loud it was and probably never use a stock cpu cooler again. You can configure it so the fan speed is dependent on your cpu temp which will usually means its always turned all the way down without overclocking. If you have the money go with watercooling. If you wanna save money just get a case fan controller(big improvement) and turn it all the way down. If you configure your fans correctly the case should stay cool and quiet when the fan controller is turned all the way down. Remember to get a good cross breeze in your case by using intake and exhaust fans.
Another thing you didn't mention was your case. You should use the Antec P180. Performance wise its one of the best pc case ever made. That should cut down on noise, especially if your old case rattles.
It's a bit late at this stage... My system is all up and running, and it's well-suited to my requirements...
My system is all up and running, and it's well-suited to my requirements...
It's fast enough, as it is, for my use. I am not a power-user, after all.tR1cKy said:
Even my old PC is good enough for me, but I wanted to play NWN on a faster PC...
I'll look into that someday. Right now, I will just play my game first.Toss the fan into the thrashcan and use a watercooling kit. You'll never want fans anymore.
Thanks!
Hard disks are cheap. So not really a major consideration... I got a 160 gig one eventually - I barely used 10 gig on my old PC...GrandAdmiral said:
And Hitachi has the best warranty service, at least in Singapore.
I got an Antec Sonata 2 casing. Yeah, I am cheap.
tR1cKy
taking over the world
You're welcome. I built mine on my own, but there are kits that can be purchased and easily assembled even by the average folks. But they are not exactly cheapKnight-Dragon said:I'll look into that someday. Right now, I will just play my game first.