Leveraging Balseraph (units, promotions, timing)

[stormyorky]

I would like to theorycraft a bit around Balseraph, and specifically Perpentach.

First of all Freaks. Seeing how mutation can be given by chaos2 mages, the mutation ability given to freaks can be seen as redundant (with a specific exception, will get to that) since warriors and scouts are just so much cheaper in hammers. And since hammers is a limiting factor, as you will run 50% of the mutated troops thru arena, it makes sense to mass produce warriors/scouts, mutate, (arena) and then upgrade.

Now, the only exception to this would be Freaks beeing melee but can be upgraded to recon. Thus mutated freaks can grab melee-specific promotions (city raider) and then upgraded to hunters-harlequins-beastmasters/druids or taskmasters-courtesans. Now, not all of those units need city raider but on beastmasters is nice for sure. Do people agree with this? Or do people use freaks for upgrading down the melee line as well?

Next tricky one is Mimic. The trick with mimic is to grab his "own" promotions as unique ones, like march, commando, mobility. These are promotions the AI usually dont pick. Also, if the mimic has experience enough to distribute a promotion, it can be wise to wait with promoting it until it has stolen more AI promotions. These tactics leads to the Mimic beeing weak in midgame. They need to be supported by a stack, and should be used after you have damaged the enemy units allready. Mimics can be upgraded to Eidolons, Paladins, Immortals, Phalanxes, Knights and can thus be used to "farm" massive numbers and unique promotions and then be upgraded to endgame units.
I wrote before that warriors should be used to mutate with chaos2, and then upgraded down the melee path. A godly mutated warrior makes a perfect "farm" mimic. However a warrior with average to below average mutation that has run a couple of arenas does not. This unit you want to get use for right away, and should thus be promoted as soon as its needed. The problem with this unit is its promotion path and upgrade path. Should he be upgraded to mimic? If yes, should we give him combat promotions from his arena experience? If yes, his mimic ability will much be wasted. Should such warrior be upgraded towards the archery line, and used as city defenders? Here, I would like to hear what others think.

I remember reading somewhere that saving mutated warriors with crazed promotion could be a valuabe source for Mimics. Letting warrior turn barbarian and then attack it with Mimic. However I dont see the reward in it? Crazed is a negtive promotion, really...

Another perk would be Harlequins having chaos sphere acess and can be upgraded to druids. Anything else that should be mentioned about that transition? In order to leverage Druids as much as possible.

Some areas where I really lack knowledge. What mana should be stacked to make most use of mages/harlequins/druids? Assuming Druids are upgraded from harlequins.

 

[odalrick]

Freaks become available some 100 turns before mages and mutated warriors cost more gold to upgrade.

Harlequins have lost their spell casting. (Or is it just Mind they lost?)

 

[ZHONN]

Well I use freaks for everything. It seems that these days the bad freaks are very few and most of them get good promotions. It's like I almost don't have enough of them for the freak shows.

I don't think that the Mutate spell really lessens the usefulness of the freaks. Sorcery is a long way and one can get some very good mutated units through freaks very early on. And even later it's less of a hassle to have units come out with mutated. Like said they mostly come with good mutations so there's no sense not to use the freaks.

I also rarely use the arena. Maybe I should give it another shot, but earlier on I didn't find it consistently useful enough to warrant the slaughter of perfectly usable units.

 

[Emptiness]

As you pointed out, the advantage of Freaks is that they can be upgraded to different unit paths. This means that you can decide what kind of unit they will become based on what mutations they have. For example, I like to turn Freaks with the Heavy promotion into city defenders, since the movement penalty has no effect on a unit that never moves. Strong Freaks I turn into Mimics, since I want them to be as tough as possible to compensate for the -1 strength compared to Champions and the fact that I won't be giving them Combat I-V promotions directly. Warriors also have some of that flexibility, since they can also upgrade to Archers, so once you finally have Mages your method could be used if production is tight but gold for the extra cost of promoting the warrior is plentiful.

With Arenas, I only run mediocre units through them. The bad mutations I use as fodder (or Freakshows if the unit is a Freak) and the good mutations I don't want to risk losing. Running the average mutations through the Arena gives them a chance to get a little xp to make up for their mediocrity, and if they die then I don't really care.

I usually upgrade my Mimics with Drill I-IV because: a) the AI rarely takes Drill, b) it unlocks Blitz, and c) it helps the Mimic survive the combats that will allow it to steal other promotions. The Drill line could be skipped if you always protected/supported your Mimics with other units, but I tend to use them as my main offensive troops. Also Blitzing Mimics is just too nice for me to pass up.

As for the Crazed promotion, it no longer causes a unit to go barbarian. That was removed a few patches back. So even if that was a valid strategy before, it doesn't work now.

 

[stormyorky]

Okay, the crazed method is outdated then.

About mimic with drill: Imo Drill is excellent for Mimics especially the ones I want to farm up to godly ones. Problem with taking drill promotions is that the AI sometimes give their defensive archers Drill, so it can be stolen. At least so with drill 1-2, while drill 3-4 can be bought with experience.

What about Harlequins? Did they lose chaos spells? Can someone confirm this?

I agree that Freaks does have a substantial window of usefulness before sorcery, and permanent usefulness for freakshows and city raider beastmasters.

A question that hasnt been answered is what mana to stack.

 

[EverNoob]

Harlequins no longer get any spell casting promotions. Instead they can cast Taunt, which is a Harlequin specific spell.

I'd stack either Air or Mind mana. Personally I prefer Mind mana for the research bonus. Chaos mana doesn't seem worth stacking IMO.