LK107, AWE, RaR, 25K

[LKendter]

I finally got a chance to look at the game. The below is the good, the bad, and the ugly.

The good:
The end-date has dropped quite a bit over the last two turns. We went from 1981 AD to 1928 AD as the end-date in just 20 turns.
The southern expansion has been completed.
While I still feel it is week, we are up to $245/turn in income. This a nice improvement since I last played.


The bad:
The military is paper-thin in the south. A stone crossbow and cavalier are the only defenders in 2 towns. The southern expansion came with a price.
I am still not impressed with the military, and we have to many cities tied up on production help. We need the production help, but it really hurts short-term.
In order to get coal, it looks like we have to invade and hold another island. This will stretch our military even thinner.


The ugly:
It comes down to lack of coal. As our empire expands it will get really difficult to protect all of the cities without coal. Not to mention the lack of extra shields from rails.
The salt not being connected is almost as bad.


The future:
Smith's is due in 2 turns. The odds say we get a big boast to the economy. After that Estates General would be another big economy boast.
We got out expanded borders at Toba. Please sell the monument off.

 

[Greebley]

Agree with the comments which means that the invasion will take some time before it happens. We need to shore up our defenses a bit and get saltpeter first. I would also like to get world map before we get anywhere. Finally we need units and boats for the assault. This will all take time to get to.

We should be planning for it but not expecting it to happen in the next 20 turns.

 

[AntiTwelve]

Preturn -

Looks fine.

IT- o

Turn 1.
Sell off the monument in Toba

IT- China is moving it's units in... looks like a decent fight.
*Lhasa Smith's Trading Company -- Toll House

Turn 2.
Find a second source of Roman coal on the other side of the island. Kill an invading Chinese stack. [6-0]

IT- Japan completes Clausewitz's. Russia drops two units in the south and Persia is showing up in large numbers.
Learn Emancipation.

Turn 3.
Kill a Roman Knight landing and I am barely able to kill the two Russian units in our south. After I uncover all of the Roman lands I then send the clipper north towards Persia before returning home. I then kill off the last Chinese unit in the area. [10-0]

IT- Persia is bringing even more units, we're going to have to pull back into cities soon.

Turn 4.
Kill four Persians. [14-0]

IT- We lose a cavalier. [14-1]
Learn Steam Power.

Turn 5.
Kill off another 7 Persian units. Our clipper is checking out Persian lands (notice a Persian horse colony... hmm). [21-1]

IT- Lose a Ghurka. [21-2]

Turn 6.
Our units are pretty badly injured, so I am only able to kill one Persian unit while our forces retreat behind our walled cities. [22-2]

IT- Rargh! A Halbedier I sent to Gorze was picked off flawlessly by a Persian cui! [22-3]

Turn 7.
Seek retribution for that killed halbedier and slaughter 6 Persian units. [28-3]

IT- o

Turn 8.
Kill a Persian Cuirassier, they seemed semi-gassed now. I have also started out clipper on the journey home. [29-3]

IT- Persian/Russian/Chinese units are coming into our peninsula at a faster rate, looks like we'll be behind walls for a good while.

Good news though.

*Sikkim builds The Sistine Chapel--> Hospital (easily switched)

Turn 9.
Kill four more Persians that are surrounding our cities. [33-3]

IT- o

Turn 10.
Kill another three Persians. [36-3]

Aftermath.
~We have more units in the south/west, but 2 more hussars on both sides is still needed.

~Our Army is now spread evenly among our three northern cities, too many units came in from Persia/China and pushed us back.

~Workers are chopping a forest one tile north of Leh, upon completion have them irrigate and then send then to road the jungle heading towards saltpeter. We're going to need that army to cover them (would it be easier to settle ON the saltpeter instead?)

~Clipper is heading home.

~Japan is weak compared to us, three clippers full of units plus an army will suffice in taking them over.

Save

 

[LKendter]

The 25K portion continues to move forward. I see we added another decent wonder.

The economy got a boast from Smith's. I will see about getting Estates General. I will check the progress toward the Central Bank.

The military part sounded stuck this round. I am not surprised, as I feel the south was really stretched.


Signed up:
LKendter (currently playing)
Greebley (on deck)
ThERat
Cizzlewalk


Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.


Due to the 50K limit we are forced to limit culture. The follow cities will be the exception to no culture outside of Sikkim: Lhasa, Chamdo and Gartokh. We should build no more then minimal culture required to open up small or large wonders.
Our extra targets for culture are 3 academies to allow 3 universities for national library. Sikkim will build the 4th.
We also need 3 banks for Central Bank.



Additional restrictions:
Armies may NOT be used more then 5 tiles from our cultural borders.


The following leader restriction is in play. A leader may do one of the below:
1) Rush anything in the 25K city.
2) Rush a small wonder anywhere. I expect FP and maybe IP to be about it.
3) Form an army. Armies may not leave our cultural borders.

The game MUST be won by 25K - period.

This is the standard LK AW type game with NO initial trading.

 

[LKendter]

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/LK107-1450AD.zip


1400 AD
Why in the world did we build a regular colonist? All of the lands to the north need hardies to settle them.
I swapped Lhasa to hardy, and merged the standard colonist into it.

We did inefficient cash rushing. Full rushed buildings waste a turn of production. I agree the cash is to high, but I really prefer partial rushes.
(IT) I really hate dealing with AI adventurers. Having any tile pillaged in the north really hurts.
We get electric power for free.


1405 AD
I kill a Roman pikeman that landed in the south. In the north I kill 2 HA, 1 hussar, 1 adventurer, and 3 cuirassier. (8-0)

I see nothing to rush of worth at this time, so I build lame RaR army. I hope the AI will ignore a 2 halberdier army so I can start building badly needed roads in the north.
(IT) Now we get the corporation for free. We haven't even build 3 banks, so stock exchanges have very little value at this time.
We get a free royal guard.


1410 AD
I kill 2 HA, and 1 cuirassier. (11-0)


1415 AD
I kill 1 spearman and 1 TG. (13-0)

We have another army.


1420 AD
I killed 4 HA, and 1 pikeman. (17-0)

This is totally insane. We have nothing to rush at all, and I get a leader overload.
We now have a very fragile Hussar army. This one will get slaughtered if left alone as it only has 1 point for defense.


1425 AD
I killed 3 HA, and 2 cuirassier. (22-0)


1430 AD
I killed 1 cuirassier, 1 pikeman, and 9 HA. I lost a hussar, and broke my perfect record. (33-1)
The 4th movement point in a hussar army is nice, as you can attack a jungle square and then retreat.


1435 AD
How did I lose track of this turn?


1440 AD
I killed 5 cuirassiers. (38-1)

What a waste of a leader run. Why couldn't we get this with multiple buildings to rush?
We have a second very fragile hussar army.

Banbar is formed, and we have a source of salt. I start upgrading all of our units to line infantry. The extra defense point is nice from the ghurka upgrades, and the option to attack with our "defensive" units helps with landings.


1445 AD
I killed 1 pikeman, 5 HA, and 2 cuirassiers. (46-1)
(IT) We get replaceable parts for free. We can start building some leathernecks for operation Japan.


1450 AD
I kill a pikeman landing by Nyima. I kill a champion landing by Chamdo. In the north I kill 3 HA, and 5 pikemen. (54-1)

==========================

Summary:
The wonders are still paying off as Sistine dropped the end-date from 1928 AD to 1916 AD. The trouble is we are running out of decent wonders to build. Our second and third universities are in progress to get us closer to another small wonder. I haven't figured out where the fourth town should be.

I would like Lhasa to also build bank number 3 before starting on Estates General. We need some small wonders to rush.



Signed up:
LKendter
Greebley (currently playing)
ThERat (on deck)
Cizzlewalk


Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.


Due to the 50K limit we are forced to limit culture. The follow cities will be the exception to no culture outside of Sikkim: Lhasa, Chamdo and Gartokh. We should build no more then minimal culture required to open up small or large wonders.
Our extra targets for culture are 3 academies to allow 3 universities for national library. Sikkim will build the 4th.
We also need 3 banks for Central Bank.



Additional restrictions:
Armies may NOT be used more then 5 tiles from our cultural borders.


The following leader restriction is in play. A leader may do one of the below:
1) Rush anything in the 25K city.
2) Rush a small wonder anywhere. I expect FP and maybe IP to be about it.
3) Form an army. Armies may not leave our cultural borders.

The game MUST be won by 25K - period.

This is the standard LK AW type game with NO initial trading.

 

[LKendter]

Some additional information:
We *do* have rubber.

A picture from the latest expansion:

 

[AntiTwelve]

@LK: Great work with getting those 4 armies! You've done quite a lot for us.

2 points I'd like to make though...

1) About the cash-rushing, I only did it twice... and that was on the last turn. The two projects were only partially done too, so I'm guessing somebody had done the rushing.

2) Um, I forgot... aren't the rules "no armies may LEAVE our cultural borders"? If so, we might want to make sure our armies are back inside our lands

 

[LKendter]

2) Um, I forgot... aren't the rules "no armies may LEAVE our cultural borders"? If so, we might want to make sure our armies are back inside our lands

Armies may NOT be used more then 5 tiles from our cultural borders.


This will make using an army very hard for the overseas action.

 

[Greebley]

However for the invasion of Japan there is a single Japanese square on their island that is 5 squares from our borders. We can defend our initial landing with armies. Once we raze and build a town then the armies will can have free reign of Japan (building towns as we go of course). This is one reason I am hoping we can get coal from Japan. We also deny the rest of the world of at least one Lux.

I got it.

 

[ThERat]

I think we should be able to raze almost all Japanese towns using leathernecks, then we can send over the army with a settler. And connect coal.

 

[AntiTwelve]

@LK: Sorry, I read this in your last post.

3) Form an army. Armies may not leave our cultural borders.

I forgot you mixed it up a little with this game.

How many Leathernecks would be adequate to take a Japanese town? Hmm... well as long as we have maybe 2 covering ships and a halberdier army it shouldn't matter in the end. Hopefully the invasion should be ready by TheRaT's turn or mine.

 

[LKendter]

@LK: Sorry, I read this in your last post.

I forgot you mixed it up a little with this game.

How many Leathernecks would be adequate to take a Japanese town? Hmm... well as long as we have maybe 2 covering ships and a halberdier army it shouldn't matter in the end. Hopefully the invasion should be ready by TheRaT's turn or mine.

I removed that mistake from the document. It was my intent to let them move 5 tiles from our cultural borders.



As for the invasion it is hard to tell. I was hoping to control the choke point first before splitting our army in two.

 

[Greebley]

Preturn: The colonist was due to me miscounting the number of towns building colonists for the south last turn. The plan was to use it to replace the russian city (which I expected us to raze before this). I suppose we can simply keep the city instead.

I think my goal this turn will be to push the borders to the choke.

Early: Build a boat or two.
Suddenly we are getting a huge number of Russian troops - 40 or so on this side of the choke Did they just end a war?
There are enough incoming Russians that the Infra gets delayed including universities. Will try to get back to them by my turn end.

1480 AD: Get a Leader - Another Hussar Army.

Mid: Not sure if it was a good decision, but I build Jomda as a forward outpost to see what is incoming and prepare.
Some units are lost - mostly attack 6 and 7 units vs defense 2 in Jungle - so bad luck which has to happen with so many kills.
I am very glad we got all those leaders on Lee's turn. The armies really make this a lot easier - allowing us to kill the annoying adventurers with less losses. (I think I killed over 20 on my turns).

Late:
An adventurer manages to pillage our Saltpeter and there was nothing I could do about it. We are re-roading it (in 1).

Notes:
Built some ships early on. They have been preventing any landings in the south. We also have a clipper near Japan. I am guessing that is where we will invade eventually. Initially, I was thinking of sending some Rifles over to the Mountain to use up Japanese troops and maybe build a Rifle Army, but it didn't happen due to the Russian Invasion.
I pretty much had to move units up from the south so we are thin yet again - not as thin as last time, but all cities don't have 2 defenders. I don't think we will lose any cities, but we need to build up again (or move units south again.
I think ThERat should be able to control south of the choke on his turn.
It was a more difficult turn set than I was expecting. The lack of rails was especially painful.
We are 2 turns from 10,000 culture and 110 cpt with the Taj Mahal in 5.
The turns were not as neat as I would have liked. To much scrambling. Check things out, they may be askew.
Had to move the Rifle out of the 25k city on the final turn. We will of course want to move it back right away. I nearly missed the fact that an adventurer had wandered deep into our territory and was where the Rifle currently is located.

 

[ThERat]

great job in planting a city there, hopefully we can fill the rest of the land as well.

I feel we really need coal and would like to get it from Japan, will have a look into that as well. got it of course

 

[LKendter]

Every time this game starts to feel under control we get another surprise. This time it was Russian overload.

I think the next goal is to get all the troops to Jomda, a better road net to Jomda, and the battle focus solely at Jomda. I suspect this is easier said then done.

At some point we do need to take the battle to Japan, and get coal. However, we need to control the choke IMO first.



Signed up:
LKendter
Greebley
ThERat (currently playing)
Cizzlewalk (on deck)


Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to at complete.


Due to the 50K limit we are forced to limit culture. The follow cities will be the exception to no culture outside of Sikkim: Lhasa, Chamdo and Gartokh. We should build no more then minimal culture required to open up small or large wonders.
Our extra targets for culture are 3 academies to allow 3 universities for national library. Sikkim will build the 4th.
We also need 3 banks for Central Bank.



Additional restrictions:
Armies may NOT be used more then 5 tiles from our cultural borders.


The following leader restriction is in play. A leader may do one of the below:
1) Rush anything in the 25K city.
2) Rush a small wonder anywhere. I expect FP and maybe IP to be about it.
3) Form an army.

The game MUST be won by 25K - period.

This is the standard LK AW type game with NO initial trading.

 

[Greebley]

I agree we need the choke under control first.

After the Saltpeter reconnects we may want another big boat. Killing ships before they land will allow us to be slightly lighter on defense in coastal cities.

We have only one Clipper, and probably want at least 2. We may be building one already.

 

[ThERat]

update after 6 turns, will play the rest tonight.

We are the owners of Taj Mahal and a rushed Pentagon. Yes, this mean we do have oil.

I was able to plant another town in the north and raze the Russian city there. Pressure has been not too bad, we drove enemy back. Will work on securing the choke (maybe we can build some barricades there).

Now we can fill armies with 3 units, more powerful that way.

I razed one Japanese town with leathernecks (it has lousy defense). However, now they have rifles guarding their towns, we need to maybe send over some armies once the choke is stable.

 

[romeothemonk]

lurker's comment: Based on my RaR experience, I highly recommend building a few 2-5 of the ships that upgrade to battleships, or just building them directly. Just a few of these coupled with any amphib unit chews up any and every AI defense. I have shredded large Deity AI's with 6 BB's and 8 Marines. I think you guys can take out a smaller Emporer civ with 5 BB's and a clipper of Leathernecks.

 

[Greebley]

If the AI haven't researched Espionage yet, maybe we should research it ourselves or go for one of the 2 free tech wonders. I would really like to know what we are dealing with in terms of resources.

 

[ThERat]

save

Pre-Turn
nth much, MM a bit

IT we go 2:0 on defense, get repeating rifle

1.1505AD
defeat 6 incoming units

IT this time we go 1:2 on defense

2. 1510AD
found Namco
while taking out units, get a leader, that will rush the museum

IT win one battle on defense

3. 1515AD
raze Dnjepopetrovsk
clear more units

4. 1520AD
attack and raze Tokyo with our first leathernecks, that was easier than expected
defeat quite a few units to clear all land behind the choke

IT Japanese do not attack our landed leatherneck
we get refining and get Pentagon message
we also get Taj Mahal

5. 1525AD
we DO have oil, rush Pentagon for a 3rd unit
spot rifles in Japanese cities now and don't attack

IT get pentagon, museum next

6. 1530AD
trying to secure the choke slowly

7. 1535AD
first corvette sinks kublai transport
move units further up, load some Cav into armies to make them more valuable
set research on espionage since no AI seems to be interested

IT some Persians adavnce, but Chinese units disappear
we get screw propeller

8. 1540AD
start to attack Zohak

IT Sikkim museum -> central bank

9. 1545AD
defeat more units in the north, no leader though
raze Zohak, move 3 armies closer to Athens
defeat 1 unit in Satsuma and raze it , lame
bombard Kagoshima, looks as if they also have only 1 unit
true enough raze that pop14 city as well

IT lose our 2 landed leathernecks, Chinese show up with some units

10. 1550AD
load all those slaves to fetch them back home (11 of them)
found Baqen to close the frontline
attack Athens, kill 3 units almost losing an army, we have 1 more attack to take out wounded rifle, but it would expose
the army and we would lose it, so I fortify for us to decide whether to attack
espionage is due in 2