Thibix Magnus
Warlord
- Joined
- May 19, 2019
- Messages
- 200
Hi all,
New to the forum, hoping it's the right section!
Short version:
I’m looking for advice about how to mod some beliefs that would benefit unimproved tiles, and a rough guess to make it a bit balanced in vox populi. The way I see it:
- A founder belief that gives some faith / culture / happiness for every worked, unimproved tile in cities that follow this religion.
- A follower belief that, in a city that follows this religion, makes the city tiles produce additional faith and culture if not improved (hopefully encouraging converted foreign cities to remove tile improvements).
- Reformation wonder : holy cites produce (give ?) additional faith/culture for (to?) every adjacent, unimproved tile.
Everything can scale with era.
Implementation : any tip about that ? where to look for, bits of code… the condition about unimproved tiles looks feasible, as celts in vanilla had a similar perk. The founder ability is trickier. And, is it possible to add beliefs or should I replace an existing one?
Very important: will the AI remove (some) tile improvements over tiles if it gave it more faith / culture?
Rough balance : It shouldn't be a "I win" religion neither a useless one. I’ll make my tests but any starting numbers can be useful, by how much culture/faith would you forsake an improvement ? If less than 1, it can be a “for every two tiles“ perk. More importantly, do you foresee an obvious broken abuse potential?
thanks a lot!
Now, if you are further interested (wall of text):
Motivation:
Civ 5 (and VP) is a fantastic game. But a fundamental gripe I have is the core 4X without limits principle (see here for a nice article).
I want an option that allows me to play (a bit) against the need to cover the map and transform every bit of natural world. Ideally, there would be difficult trade-offs everywhere. Cutting forests increases floods (if you play with events). Making a coal mine near a river reduces ag yields downstream, or disables gardens. Of course climate change. But that is a major overhaul that would impact everything and I don’t feel like implementing or balancing it (but if someone wants, happy to help ^^).
However, just adding a belief that supports a "nature-friendly" play style is much easier to start with, and can already create a very interesting game. Faith, culture, happiness are more intangible values that are easier to justify without improvements.
I imagine a play-style where you can out-faith everyone and cruise through policies faster than anyone but you give up a lot of food, production and science. So you have to actively spread your religion to make it worth, not only to compensate this set-back with social policies, but also encouraging your neighbours to stay small, by converting them or conquering them. You also have to carefully choose which tiles to improve or not, maybe favouring GP improvements or strategic resources. The interesting thing is also that it is not all or nothing, you can choose a middle ground strategy. The very important thing is that you only receive additional faith and culture if you work the tile, so you are actually limited by population.
In theory all victory types should be possible depending on your reformation belief if you swim in faith.
Now, why changing civ 5 instead of playing/improving civ 4 or gathering storm, that actually have environmental limits? Because I only know civ 5 and I can’t invest the time to know these other games enough to make something roughly balanced. And importantly because the graphics are my favourite (civ 6 too cartoonish for me).
Exploring a natural world with e.g. communitas with the watersheds and mountains and lakes is just beautiful. And I find, even visually, it’s a shame that everything has to be transformed and covered by improvements and consumed, even more than in our world where some wilderness remains. Thus I want to be able to fight for a world map that keeps part of its beauty throughout the game, by spreading a religion about nature, or by just killing everyone.
Any tip would be great for my personal tests. But if you are convinced and think such a mod should be a well-thought and balanced cbp contribution, I'm happy to contribute!
New to the forum, hoping it's the right section!
Short version:
I’m looking for advice about how to mod some beliefs that would benefit unimproved tiles, and a rough guess to make it a bit balanced in vox populi. The way I see it:
- A founder belief that gives some faith / culture / happiness for every worked, unimproved tile in cities that follow this religion.
- A follower belief that, in a city that follows this religion, makes the city tiles produce additional faith and culture if not improved (hopefully encouraging converted foreign cities to remove tile improvements).
- Reformation wonder : holy cites produce (give ?) additional faith/culture for (to?) every adjacent, unimproved tile.
Everything can scale with era.
Implementation : any tip about that ? where to look for, bits of code… the condition about unimproved tiles looks feasible, as celts in vanilla had a similar perk. The founder ability is trickier. And, is it possible to add beliefs or should I replace an existing one?
Very important: will the AI remove (some) tile improvements over tiles if it gave it more faith / culture?
Rough balance : It shouldn't be a "I win" religion neither a useless one. I’ll make my tests but any starting numbers can be useful, by how much culture/faith would you forsake an improvement ? If less than 1, it can be a “for every two tiles“ perk. More importantly, do you foresee an obvious broken abuse potential?
thanks a lot!
Now, if you are further interested (wall of text):
Motivation:
Civ 5 (and VP) is a fantastic game. But a fundamental gripe I have is the core 4X without limits principle (see here for a nice article).
I want an option that allows me to play (a bit) against the need to cover the map and transform every bit of natural world. Ideally, there would be difficult trade-offs everywhere. Cutting forests increases floods (if you play with events). Making a coal mine near a river reduces ag yields downstream, or disables gardens. Of course climate change. But that is a major overhaul that would impact everything and I don’t feel like implementing or balancing it (but if someone wants, happy to help ^^).
However, just adding a belief that supports a "nature-friendly" play style is much easier to start with, and can already create a very interesting game. Faith, culture, happiness are more intangible values that are easier to justify without improvements.
I imagine a play-style where you can out-faith everyone and cruise through policies faster than anyone but you give up a lot of food, production and science. So you have to actively spread your religion to make it worth, not only to compensate this set-back with social policies, but also encouraging your neighbours to stay small, by converting them or conquering them. You also have to carefully choose which tiles to improve or not, maybe favouring GP improvements or strategic resources. The interesting thing is also that it is not all or nothing, you can choose a middle ground strategy. The very important thing is that you only receive additional faith and culture if you work the tile, so you are actually limited by population.
In theory all victory types should be possible depending on your reformation belief if you swim in faith.
Now, why changing civ 5 instead of playing/improving civ 4 or gathering storm, that actually have environmental limits? Because I only know civ 5 and I can’t invest the time to know these other games enough to make something roughly balanced. And importantly because the graphics are my favourite (civ 6 too cartoonish for me).
Exploring a natural world with e.g. communitas with the watersheds and mountains and lakes is just beautiful. And I find, even visually, it’s a shame that everything has to be transformed and covered by improvements and consumed, even more than in our world where some wilderness remains. Thus I want to be able to fight for a world map that keeps part of its beauty throughout the game, by spreading a religion about nature, or by just killing everyone.
Any tip would be great for my personal tests. But if you are convinced and think such a mod should be a well-thought and balanced cbp contribution, I'm happy to contribute!
