SGOTM 14 - Xteam

[Cactus Pete]

Nice progress, Htadus.

I'm not used to playing with the techs being considered for trading, so don't have a feel for best approach. Two comments: rifles are not much of a problem for grens (but cavalry are), so question how important it is to have them; even if we do choose to trade, probably should wait as long as possible to do so.

 

[leif erikson]

If we trade MilSci to G/M, won't that give them Cavs as well? Not sure we gain much. Especially since rifles will be a challenge for our Cavs anyhow. I guess it speeds us to Inf. Not sure where I come out on this .

Cavs require Rifling, HBR and Horses. Mil Sci gives Grens and Ship of the Line. They probably already can build Cavs?

We are just over 50% on Replaceable Parts, so we are giving Shaka a really good deal? We can complete Replaceable Parts in two turns if we can gain another 650 Gold? How much have you been getting for cities?

The best reason to get to Rifles is to counter their Cavs. We still have to deal with Genghis and can, hopefully, get enough Gold to feed some research? Perhaps we can make a trade for Rifling from Shaka after we get Replaceable Parts, before heading for Gandhi/Montie?

 

[Htadus]

If we trade MilSci to G/M, won't that give them Cavs as well? Not sure we gain much. Especially since rifles will be a challenge for our Cavs anyhow. I guess it speeds us to Inf. Not sure where I come out on this .

BTW they do not need mil sci for cavs, they can build them now. I just like to bring a few rifles as a counter.

Nice progress, Htadus.

I'm not used to playing with the techs being considered for trading, I figured you would be a master of pointy stick tech trading style so don't have a feel for best approach. Two comments: rifles are not much of a problem for grens (but cavalry are), so question how important it is to have them; even if we do choose to trade, probably should wait as long as possible to do so.

I will wait for leif to comment but I see your caution. That is why when we attack india it will be will with amphibious curas/cavs, and before they get to upgrade anyone. The first turn ,we should take about 6 cities minimum.

 

[Htadus]

I see I xposts with leif. So what will it be? Wait a few turns untill what? I have no opposition but not sure what I should wait for. I would prefer to get the gold while it is available and start on rifles as ap. Also I would prefer to attack against grens with cav than rifles.

 

[leif erikson]

How quickly are you gaining gold from city conquest? If fairly quickly (we need up to 650 Gold for 2-turns research on RP), then we could attempt trade with Shaka only?

Otherwise, please do what you think best. We'll adjust as needed.

 

[Cactus Pete]

Yes, the mouse is in your hands.

 

[Mad Professor]

Nice progress Htadus

The tech trade thing is complicated. I've nervous about them having Cavs, but it looks like there's nothing we can do about that - we can't withhold them from them. If they have cavs, we need rifles, or they'll start cutting us to bits - if we don't have some serious cav killers in each stack, they will pop out of cities with cavs, kill a unit and blast our seige units to hell in flanking damage, and run back to the city leaving us swearing at their retreating hooves.

The solution is to have a couple of cav killers in each stack. I'm not really in a great position to judge the finer points of the proposed trades, but if my gut feel above helps, that's good. As leif says, the mouse is in your hands.

 

[Htadus]

Wiz is still alive.
3 (I thought it was 4 but I messed up) galleons are heading toward wiz. Need to send 3 unpromoted cav units for the first galleon.

I played 1 more turn than I planned.

I held back the trade for Rep Parts and teched it with most cities building research. Then traded Mil Sci to Zulu for rifle.

I razed 1 mongol city. Kept 3 and units are still converging. I did build a 2 movement super healer rifle with the use of a old warror. He is in Mongolia. I ma sending bunch of navel unit via north route but it may not be needed. In 7 turns we can build a sea bridge to India via a captured Mongol city. I have not whipped as hard as I should have but there is the opportunity for the next player.

Game is uploaded.

http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/civ4sgotm14/Xteam_SG014_AD1540_01.CivBeyondSwordSave

 

[Cactus Pete]

Great effort, well done.

Note that our population is only 29% of the needed 56%, so good that you didn't whip too indiscriminately.

Have you calculated how many turns before our galleons reach Oz?

 

[leif erikson]

Great progress Htadus.

Asoka, Raggie are down the drain and we're starting on the Mongols.

Roster:
The-Hawk - UP
Cactus Pete - On Deck
leif
Mad Professor
Htadus
-Asterix-
DJMGator13


Off to have a look.

 

[Mad Professor]

Wiz is still alive.
3 (I thought it was 4 but I messed up) galleons are heading toward wiz. Need to send 3 unpromoted cav units for the first galleon.

I played 1 more turn than I planned.

I held back the trade for Rep Parts and teched it with most cities building research. Then traded Mil Sci to Zulu for rifle.

I razed 1 mongol city. Kept 3 and units are still converging. I did build a 2 movement super healer rifle with the use of a old warror. He is in Mongolia. I ma sending bunch of navel unit via north route but it may not be needed. In 7 turns we can build a sea bridge to India via a captured Mongol city. I have not whipped as hard as I should have but there is the opportunity for the next player.

Game is uploaded.

http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/civ4sgotm14/Xteam_SG014_AD1540_01.CivBeyondSwordSave

You did some quite respectable thumping. Well done.

I'll get a chance to have a good look over it a bit later.

 

[The-Hawk]

This is going to be a bit of a busy week for me. Also, we are running low on time. How about I sneak in a quick turnset in the next day or two. I'll try to finish the war against GK and position units to attack West. Also I will kill Oz if possible with the units in transit. Then I will turn over to CP for the next war.

Some questions:

- What sort of units should I be building for West? I see that Htadus is building a ton of cav. Do we think we can beat west with only fast movers (no siege or rifles to protect)? I am on the fence on this. We will lose a ton of cav without siege, but then again, we can build a ton of cavs...

- I see Htadus has started democracy. I am wondering if we should hold off on democracy and continue to beeline Inf. I have a bad feeling that West may have Inf by the time we get there. At the moment, we are not too bad from a happiness perspective, most of our cities have no red faces. Obviously war weariness will start to rise again as well. Thoughts on this? I guess it depends on the answer to my previous question. If we plan to overwhelm using suicide cavs, then democracy makes the most sense. We need our cities to be able to grow...

- Htadus, are the letters you marked on the map for a galleon chain? Do you have one going?

 

[Cactus Pete]

Think Htadus mentioned moving seige on galleons and running cavs. Should at least work for coastal cities. Internal hill cities could be costly, though.

As I mentioned earlier, I am going out of town and out of contact 29th through 4th, so team needs to skip me and let me step back in when I return.

As civs running Emancipation are eliminated, doesn't unhappiness go down? If so, then Infantry route certainly deserves consideration.

 

[Mad Professor]

As civs running Emancipation are eliminated, doesn't unhappiness go down? If so, then Infantry route certainly deserves consideration.

How important is this question? Democracy is 200 turns away at the current rate and I expect Assembly line would be just as far. We're never going to get there right?

Regarding the unhappies going down CP. the civs with emancipation are the two west and two south, and they'll all be around for the majority of the remaining game - only as we destroy India then Aztec near the end will the number of civs running emancipation go down...

 

[Htadus]

@CP. I think it will take 6 to 7 turns to get to Oz. There is a runaway treb that I was giving a ride on one of the galleons. He is no use at the Oz city. SO we need a replacement unit for him. So we need 4 units meeting the Navy. I am guessing Oz is a rifle and not more. Hopefully no more than 2-3. So it will be 3 against 9 battle. Sorry about the 4th galleon.

Some questions:

- What sort of units should I be building for West? I see that Htadus is building a ton of cav. Do we think we can beat west with only fast movers (no siege or rifles to protect)? I am on the fence on this. We will lose a ton of cav without siege, but then again, we can build a ton of cavs...I chose cavs for retreat potential but it is really up to CP and you to choose the unit type.

- I see Htadus has started democracy. I am wondering if we should hold off on democracy and continue to beeline Inf. I have a bad feeling that West may have Inf by the time we get there. At the moment, we are not too bad from a happiness perspective, most of our cities have no red faces. Obviously war weariness will start to rise again as well. Thoughts on this? I guess it depends on the answer to my previous question. If we plan to overwhelm using suicide cavs, then democracy makes the most sense. We need our cities to be able to grow...My plan was to capture several coastal cities from galleons with some casualties in india. As for techs, I hope we do not have to wait for Inf and cavs do really well against infantry in my exp.

- Htadus, are the letters you marked on the map for a galleon chain? Do you have one going?

Well it was, but those galleons are going around mongolia. I may have missed something in regards to the number of turns it will take them to go around the landmss. Please adjust accordingly. There are several cannon that could use a ride in Mongolia.

Think Htadus mentioned moving seige on galleons and running cavs. Should at least work for coastal cities. Internal hill cities could be costly, though.We should use the cannons for these cities.

As I mentioned earlier, I am going out of town and out of contact 29th through 4th, so team needs to skip me and let me step back in when I return.

As civs running Emancipation are eliminated, doesn't unhappiness go down? If so, then Infantry route certainly deserves consideration.

I am OK with Run to infantry as long as it does not deviate from blitzing.

How important is this question? Democracy is 200 turns away at the current rate and I expect Assembly line would be just as far. We're never going to get there right?I hope so

Regarding the unhappies going down CP. the civs with emancipation are the two west and two south, and they'll all be around for the majority of the remaining game - only as we destroy India then Aztec near the end will the number of civs running emancipation go down...

If we blitz and just ovewhelm cities, then we should not have to deal with much of this issue.

 

[Mistfit]

Nice to see some of the old crew still stomping around here. Some of you (read Leif) have added a whole lot of little boxes under your name

Cheers and keep up the good work

 

[The-Hawk]

Turn set plan:

Load some extra units on the southern galley group and go destroy OZ. I will raze the city, no use to us.

Carry on the attack on GK to completion. Keep all of his cities. Build a fort somewhere to create a channel.

Position several stacks for a multi-city attack on Gandhi. The stacks will include cannon for siege attack on the coastal cities and some rifles to protect the stack from Cavs. Also lots of Cavs to do the dirty work .

I also plan to build a stack in the hub area. I have to think Monty will be all over us at Tabriz. However, I suppose it is possible he will attack on any of the spokes.

I will tech towards Inf. Assumption is we will not need it.

Civics stay as is. No tech trades planned. Minimal whip because we need to grow pop to domination limit.

Htadus has left us in fine shape . Looks like a pretty straightforward turnset, I'd like to play later today.

 

[leif erikson]

Plan looks good. Think you will have some to do.

Load some extra units on the southern galley group and go destroy OZ. I will raze the city, no use to us.

Please remember that while these units are enroute, you cannot declare on Gandhi or they will be teleported to who knows where. That would negate all the turns it took to get them wherever they are at the time of declaration.

If you need to , could "hide" them in Mansa's waters, if you can get them there.

Htadus has left us in fine shape . Looks like a pretty straightforward turnset, I'd like to play later today.

Good to go from here. Good Luck.

Got to get that Haka going.

Nice to see some of the old crew still stomping around here. Some of you (read Leif) have added a whole lot of little boxes under your name

Cheers and keep up the good work

Nice to see you Mistfit. Hope you have been well and are getting ready for a Merry Christmas season.

I think someone made a mistake and put too many hats on me or something. All it does is give me more things to keep track of and less time to play...

Got to put that Christmas avatar you made for me on soon.

 

[Cactus Pete]

Plan looks good, and good luck.

GONE FISHING!

 

[The-Hawk]

GONE FISHING!

On that note: GONE HUNTING!

(later today that is)