Strategy Proposal

[Provolution]

Strategy Proposal

I think we need to consider how to get as much production as possible up before we gamble all on a religion. We got so many good spots to settle, that religion is our smallest concern right now. We should steal Spanish Hinduism, and make that our religion, since we have to take them out as it stands.

Mathematics would allow us forts and 50 % bonus on forest chops, something very useful to our next two cities, as well as partly Arete.
Sailing would allow us to trade goods along rivers and sea, interconnecting our empire much faster, Lighthouse for Arete is imminent. Sailing and Mathematics are both prerequisites for Calendar, which we need for plantations (5 dyes and 1 silks). As calendar also gives us global map location, that is quite important too.
I honestly think our next city should get 4 dyes, cow, settle that jungle by river on the delta, for both freshwater and a port location, perfect site.

This way we can use sailing to trade along our coast and along all river tiles.

After that, we get Iron Working, to remove jungle tiles, and that fits in perfectly in developing our cities with the first dyes outside jungles, and the last dyes as we get iron working, capping it all nicely off with currency and market places

I recommend: Mathematics, Sailing, Calendar, Iron Working and then Currency and Code of Laws.

Meditation and Priesthood I consider a detour, as it seems we need to take out Spain anyways. Suggest an open border agreement to catch Hinduism and map their lands just prior to pillage and worker theft, after that we get mathematics in time for chops and make the Hindu holy city our own.

This game seems full of religious civs, as Buddhism, Hinduism and Judaism is already done, I bet we will be too late for Code of Laws and Confucianism first as well. I suggest we stick to the core plan, leverage our cavalry and resource advantage, and make Hinduism our religion, as it is a much lower risk as it stands. We also need that Dye-port, if people can agree to that, with markets etc, that will be a very very lucrative city.

Finally, we may need Iron Working for City Raider Swordsmen, if the Spanish are well defended on a hilly city etc, or behind river.

 

[DaveShack]

My, you're certainly in love with those dyes.

No, we must have metal, and more than one happy resource. We should go for the northern copper site immediately, while the taking is still good. With it, we get copper, gold, and ivory, all of which can be developed as soon as we have them. We already have one source of dyes, and cannot improve them for at least 40 turns even if we take the shortest route to calendar. The jungle dyes would take even longer to improve at current research speed. Sure, it will be faster with the next city, but even so, it's an eternity in which we have unimprovable tiles while our neighbors will be taking the other better locations with resources we need.

 

[Provolution]

I think it has military implications too, we want all our cities near, or at least proximate to both Arete and to a northern border city. Getting distant copper would not cut it. I know barbarians at this level is fierce, and would prefer City Garrison Archers before I move deep into the wilderness. We do not even have the worker capacity to do so.

Our first three cities should remain close, and utilizing sailing and river makes sense here.

Also, the dyes location got cow, river, water tiles (improved by sailing and possibly Moai Statues). Outer rings is a strategy of Civ3 nostalgia, Civ4 BTS is a different deal, and we need those cities in an integrated resource and unit supply system.

 

[Seymoo]

Normally I would go for the northern city first rather than the western one, but it seems clear that it is the military city whilst the western would make a slightly better religious city. If common sense can prevail amongst the triad then perhaps the well laid plans can be modified to adjust to the game situation, with the warlords taking the first city, and the protectors waiting for the third. Certainly once we have captured Madrid anyway the protectors may consider moving there faction to there, as it is likely to be the most promising religious city we have.

 

[fed1943]

I agree with Provo general strategy, but not the way to implement it.
Next city must be an hammers/war city and we need production and
metal resource first, as we already have horses.
To the Barbs, fogbust.
3rd city commercial; and Madrid looks a great religious city.
Best regards,

 

[Provolution]

Well, if Faith is willing to adapt, I am more than open to set up the military city by the mountain pass. The use of the developed pig farm will get it quickly up to size (now that Arete will not benefit much more from it), and the rice paddy as well as a couple of developed grass tiles will take over.

If Faith Faction is willing to change the city sequence, I am more than happy.

However, the Dye City may be settled by the Spanish first, whereas we still got some time for the Northern War City, so that is a strong argument for sticking to the present sequence.

Also, the Triad is the collective decisionmaker here, which is the beauty of a demogame above a normal succession-game, that politics indeed do have a say, as they should.

 

[Seymoo]

I agree that the politics should be taken into consideration, only if the protectors agree it is in their interests long term should a change be made. They have a complete control over this city unless they choose to give it to someone else

 

[Furiey]

If the Spanish settle the Dyes it will be convieniently close for us to take it from them. That's the plan after all isn't it? The Bronze will help us do that, or how long is it intended to leave Hatty alive?

 

[Provolution]

The Spanish will likely misplace the city, so we will conquer a misplaced city much less than we could have. It would be a sham. Also, we do not want to dislocate us, we need to connect resources (ideally sailing and a couple of roads).

Dye City is the location I would hate to see displaced.

 

[AluminumKnight]

Just a note (I am leaning towards the Dye city for us, actually): Just because the Spanish will likely misplace the dye city doesn't mean we can't raze and replace!

 

[Ballazic]

I personally think we should keep our two first citys close. If we get archery we don`t need bronze to defend. Lincoln has archers and hatty is going to be horse rushed. We have horses and the tech if we get archery to rush hatty. I think the dye port will be key for our religious city as having a lot of money always is a good thing for a religious center. Also our military city should be close to. if we block babylonians through the mountian pass and destroy the spainish we will have all that land to our selves for awhile. As far as barbs go, archery is key, but also utilizing our cavary to keep them out of our lands will do much

 

[Seidrik_The_Gray]

The Northern city...on its own would be capable of defeating Spain. On its own... Let alone the Gold and Ivory there. It's potential production is enormous. What better place to launch a holy Crusade than from the area so aptly named "Paradise Hills"? After Spain is destroyed, there is more than ample time to get the dies, etc...In fact, after Spain is toast, who is there really to challenge us for domination of this fine coastal region???

 

[Ballazic]

That city will be a lame duck up there, we are trying to rush the spanish not wait for till the y discover archers or put up walls around everything, timing is the key. The farther a city is a way, the farther it is to reach. IMHO i think if they settle closer (agian not just the dye port, closer engeneral not seven turns) they will have alot more help from our capital. Thats not a threat or anything just realistically what will happen, my worker will not walk 7 turns out in the wild out there.

Also after we take the spanish, who will stop us from paradise hills, the babylonians won't be dumb to build that far yet. So the real question which city locations are best suited for assisting the spanish rush. Remember we are thinking of a relativly quick timeline here.

 

[DaveShack]

The earlier a great site is occupied, the longer its benefits gain compound interest. Games are won by getting great sites, and lost by failing to get them. We might be OK without it, but we might not.

 

[Seidrik_The_Gray]

So, Ballazic, I know you're not saying that if the Protectors of Faith chose to build their city in Paradise hills that they'd be totally on their own?

 

[AluminumKnight]

Also after we take the spanish, who will stop us from paradise hills, the babylonians won't be dumb to build that far yet.

This is simply not true. The AI definitely prioritizes Bronze, and if that's the closest Bronze to him, he will surely head that way soon. Even if it's not, all those other resources will make it very attractive to him.

 

[Seidrik_The_Gray]

This is simply not true. The AI definitely prioritizes Bronze, and if that's the closest Bronze to him, he will surely head that way soon. Even if it's not, all those other resources will make it very attractive to him.

Here here!!!

 

[Ballazic]

Which is excatly why taking one of the copper sites doesn't block them from copper ingeneral, isn't better that we force them to choose either site that is vunerable to be attacked, or one really far away. We are not going to beat them bronze.

Bronze could get us axemen, but the resources required to get us axemen and to build them could help us a build our mass of horsemen.

 

[Bertie]

I agree with Provo general strategy, but not the way to implement it.
Next city must be an hammers/war city and we need production and
metal resource first, as we already have horses.
To the Barbs, fogbust.
3rd city commercial; and Madrid looks a great religious city.
Best regards,

I agree with fed1943 (although I might be inclined to make our third city a production city, too.)

If the Spanish settle the Dyes it will be convieniently close for us to take it from them. . . .

Correct.

Just a note (I am leaning towards the Dye city for us, actually): Just because the Spanish will likely misplace the dye city doesn't mean we can't raze and replace!

Ditto.

That city will be a lame duck up there, we are trying to rush the spanish not wait for till the y discover archers . . .

The AI starts with archery on this level so this isn't a consideration. I would imagine Spain is going to settle close to the copper near the coast before we can get to it, which leaves the northern copper (and gold and ivory and rice) site if we want an early metal. I agree this location is farther from our capital than is ideal (too bad we didn't settle in the original spot), but its location is doable. In this case, the benefit of grabbing this spot is so good we just have to attempt the gambit.

 

[Provolution]

Forget this proposal, its not going to be implemented.