The Immortal Challenge Lineup - Game #26 China

Gustavus Rex

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The Immortal Challenge Lineup - Game #26

Welcome to the Immortal Challenge Lineup!

ICL Game #26 - China
Settings: Default + quick combat & quick movement
Map – Ice Age with landmass set to random
DLC - All DLC - map packs

Starting location:

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Information & rules:

Spoiler :
All games in this series will be set to IMMORTAL difficulty. User civilizations, maps, and opponents will change each game, but the pace will always be set at standard and the starting era will always be ancient. We will try for a variety of starts, and not just having a crazy warmonger as your next door neighbor (although there will be that too). This isn't a competition so there will be no predefined victory conditions. New challenges in the series will be posted every other Wednesday.

Who can play?
Anybody can play. The more the merrier. Even if you normally don't play immortal games you are still welcome to try. The games can become great learning resources for the player trying to improve. Even if you don't finish the game, we are still interested to hear about your experience.

Do's and Don'ts
We are going to be using the honor system. Feel free to restart, reload, play the same game multiple times, but don't use the science overflow exploit. Also please don't edit the game in IGE. If you do chose to cheat, please don't share your results in the comments. Also, please use the spoiler tag if you post a picture, comment about neighboring civs, close by wonders, or locations of ancient ruins.

Also, please tell us about your Build Order, Social Policies, Tech Order, and what type of wonders you went after. I know a lot of this stuff seems pretty mundane to the experienced player, but the details are incredibly useful to people trying to learn.

Future Games in the Series
I want users to submit saves from turn 0. Preferably the person submitting the game has played enough turns to know the map is either difficult, fun, or unique in some enjoyable way. Write a short description as to why it is special and email the save to immortalchallengelineup@gmail.com

Important
If you submit a game for the challenge, you must have the DLC map packs disabled. Not everybody has them and they are honestly kind of useless. Having them disabled will allow more participants.
Links to all recent ICL-games:


Game # 26 - China

All results gets documented in a spreadsheet by Consentient. To help him with his work, please use this headline tXXX victory-type in your finishing post. Example: t210 DV

Link to ICL Spreadsheet
 

Attachments

Spoiler :
I came close to death. BACKSTABBED by Japan, then DOW by Mongols. Good thing, I was on the path to c-bow.


Spoiler :
F7115C2D80075CF33E0513D524BA1F7EE9154924
 
@ Budweiser

Spoiler :
Honor?
 
consentient
Spoiler :
Open Tradition>Ologarchy>Left Honor. At first I was just going to grow cap in peace, but Noooooo!

And then once again as I was finishing Mongol, a second DoW comes from Japan and it was tense for a couple seconds. Now I close on his lands but he has walls with 24 def. That might chew my c-bows up pretty bad...
 
XBs are good up to City defence of 40. Just use injured units with Cover to soak up the hits, and/or use worker bait.
 
Now I am at work, cant play until later. I must remember not to take Logistics on my c-bows :)
 
t50 - The early game

Spoiler :
Settled in place. Met two not so "China-friendly" neighbors and wanted to get things in place so decided to at least start with liberty left to get my empire up and running.

My warrior spotted a ruin beyond Mongols capital, headed for it and got trapped in what showed to be "the rest of the world"

Wanted to scout it but my warrior got stuck in the middle of Rome:s empire... :mad:

Got both Animal hunting and Writing from ruins. Oda sent an unprotected settler to the spot I wanted for my third city. I stole it and it helped getting marble up in time for my expansion. :king:

Tech: Pottery, Archery, Mining, Masonry, Sailing, Trapping, Calendar and Philosophy

Bo Beijing: Scout, Monument, Granary, Archer, Archer, Pyramids, Settler and Paper Maker.

Bo Shanghai: Monument, Paper Maker.

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Soon I will settle my third and last self founded city. Then I will have to decide if I will complete liberty or move onto honor. If so I will try to squeeze in The Oracle before NC. Mongolia has captured a City State so I will probably be able to keep them and Japan busy while I continue to get things up and running.

There is no point in trying to befriend Oda. He always backstabs sooner rather then later in this kind of situations anyway.


t100 - Role playing game!

Spoiler :
Soon after t50 it was SP time and I decided that I want to go full honor after the liberty build-up. I settled my third city and went for Oracle in Beijing.

Now... this is a pretty dangerous map to not spam out units on and Mongolias troops started to lurk around my borders.

Oda did not want ta war and I thanked my lucky star I got to scout the other half of the map. I managed to bribe Attila against Genghis but had to go unhappy before I could improve some luxuries. 10 turns later Attila, the prick, made peace and I immediately bribed Alex before Genghis threw his thousand units on my juicy cities.

Oda had got his self confidence back so I bribed him to against Genghis to get them both of my back while I decided to role play a bit and give China the Great Wall.

After GW was built I noticed that The Terracotta Army still is available and since I already started to role play... why not? The map is covered with thugs warring against each other so there might be a small chanse. Trying to build some different units in my expos.

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I also squeezed in a shrine when I noticed there were few civs going for religion. Wanted the God of Sea pantheon to boost my hammers but missed it so I took Messenger of the Gods for some extra science.

I enjoy this map and want to do some late wars for a change. My biggest issue right now is gold. I have filled the right side of Honor so I need two more SP before it's time to start to collect!

As soon as I have decent amount of Chu Ku Nus I will try to conquer Japan and Mongolia!


t150 - War! It's fantastic!

Spoiler :
Washington finished The Terracotta Army when I had 5 turns left. But I needed the gold for updates so it was ok. I built three Cargo Ships and send them to City States. The AI-neighborhood is not the trustworthy kind to say the least.

Genghis dowed me during the same turn Oda gave him peace about the time my Chu Ku Nu:s were ready and the Honor tree completed. He begged for mercy when he realized his mistake but there were nothing he could do. I burned his expo, puppeted the capital and libarated his conquered City State in a couple of turns.

Suddenly I got a great engineer from what seemed to be nowhere. Pyramids + GW. Hagia Sophia was there so I popped it and got the last religion. I founded Taoism with Tithe and Divine Inspiration with led to a decent FPT.

Meanwhile Oda did his usual trick and befriended me to make me feel safe while he spammed samurais and backstabbed. His days of bullshittning the bullshitter has been over and my army was ready for him! While I was picking of Odas units Alex dowed out of the blue and tried to sneak a decent group of units through Kabul. Luckily I had 1000 gold to spend and allied Kabul and some turns later Alex returned home with the tail between his leg.

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I just reached t150 and captured Osaka. I was going to burn it but it contained the Parthenon so that would be a shame. Oda is likely going to take it back the next turn but I don't mind. As I want this to be a long game with late wars I'm heading for Publics Schools in the tech tree instead of Artillery. I can't even remember when I last did that.


t200 - The Midgame

Spoiler :
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I left Oda with one tiny city. I am going to burn it in time but I still have a couple of trades going on with the far away-brutes. Rome and America double-dowed me and Washington showed up with some troops I rapidly counter attacked back to his borders. I was about to complete a nice road over the forested tundra-hills between us when the minutemen showed up and stole all my workers in one blow! I had to draw back and heal my double-shooters before I attempt my next kamikaze-dive down south!

Meanwhile, back home, I have started to build my navy. After Public Schools I'm going to get some Frigates and Privaters that will come in handy when I conquer Washington. He has been very busy spamming nice wonders and I want them all.

On the other half of the world Alex is starting to slowly run away. He is currently the tech-leader and seems to beat the other thugs. Rome has the greatest army though so there is a chance it'll change...

Gold and happiness is under control. I spend most gold on allying City States.

To be continued...
 
This map is really fun, but it also demonstrates the difference between Immortal and Deity. I've been waging war from T20ish against two of the most crazy warmongers in the game, plus Sidon, and I'm coming out on top.

The landmass has a weird shape, so I don't think this will be DomV unless Frigates take my fancy. Could be Gunboat Diplomacy, for fun and games.

T74 Finish Honor. T77 NC (2 city). Soon I'll take the neighbour's capitals and then we'll be really moving.
 
I basically got stomped on with a double DoW and then another DoW and you two guy more or less got to expand in peace. No fair!
 
Expand in peace? I've been at war with all and sundry. I think that's the way G.Rex intended it! :D
 
I was going to try a Peity culture game, maybe sacred sites, but not all goes according to plan:

to t50
Spoiler :

Running into Genghis on turn 3 and finding his capital the next turn changed my mind about the early game. Instead of Peity lets go to war and Honor. Karakorum down:



I took and kept Beshbalik as well. I guess a settler -> 4 city NC will follow.

Didn't explore before killing Genghis so only Washington knows about my warmongering ;)

Not sure I will play this one out, unless I keep having fun here. Fun opening though.
 
I basically got stomped on with a double DoW and then another DoW and you two guy more or less got to expand in peace. No fair!

I't felt more like less then more. :crazyeye:

I had to sell my all luxuries, horses, gpt along with my all dignity to be keep the peace! :)
 
T131 Update

Spoiler :
Japan are history. Genghis is a fuzzy memory. Washington is fiddling while Boston burns. His capital will follow soon. Then it's onto Alex and the Battle of the Thin Isthmus. I'll be able to keep Boudicca as a trade partner most likely. If she DoWs me, there will be a whole "You said you'd kill me last" - "I lied" kinda moment. I've always hated her guts anyway.

I have a feeling this will either be a really fast victory (due to small land) or really slow (because of the rough terrain). I foolishly deleted 4 workers because I thought I had like 10. But it turns out I only had 7. So I have 3 now, patiently building roads wishing I'd gone Liberty and made their labour easier.

Culture wise the game has been good with the CS alliances, and I've already got Full Honor, Commerce right side, and the 1st part of Commerce left.

Great map. More tomorrow... n'night all.


T154 Finish Commerce

Spoiler :
Happiness forever solved. I can wonderwhore at home while I finish the Battle of the Bullies with Attila. Who wants to bet on the Hun? :D
 
to t100

Spoiler :

I wanted to see how much I set China back by sacrificing a peaceful build up, so I played a few more turns.

I added the Temple of Artemis and the Oracle. Social policies are all over the place: Left side Honor, Tradition -> Aristocracy, Pat opener.

By t100 the development is a little slow, but not too far behind a more sane opening. And there is no Genghis :)

NC is up, Engineering in done, and happiness is under control:



I suppose I should go to war with Oda or Alex at some point.
 
It will be a long game...

178, I have 3 caps - wont take any more for a while, if ever.
Spoiler :
FCED4C18EF66C3BAABB73C1374620298167A6030


202, A good way to deal with a person we dont like is to buy out his allies.
Spoiler :
297ED44FE904CA4C218CB932BD0A6669937711C5
 
Spoiler :
Ugh, I hate maps with tiny chokepoints. I managed to take out Genghis, Oda and Washington, but it's turn 200 and my 3-range CKNs aren't going to do much to a 50-defense Athens. Also Greece seems to have every since city state allied. Artillery is coming in about 20 turns, so I might do that, or I might just give up. I wish you could conquer city-states just to force peace and break their alliance. As it is I can't actually do anything to stop them from spamming units at me, even though all they can do is just pillage stuff.
 
Somewhere around 270

Spoiler :
I bought out all of Alex's CS allies and now they are mine. I have Trad full > 5/6 honor>5/6 Patronage and 3 or 4 in Order. Still miles away from any kind of VC.


I'm in the mood to get some battleships to finish this off.
 
t 250 - Middle of the road

Spoiler :
I have slowly chewed through Washingtons cities with some max-promoted and stubborn Chu Ku Nu:s and a tierd old Long Swordsman.

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I kept throwing City States gold but good old Alex is once again a beast in taking them back. He has been a poor AI in my games since the latest patch and I thought his days of numer one terror AI might have been over but now he is back in all his glory!

Alex dowed me, off course, along with 2/3 of the worlds city states so the last 20 turns has been a CS-pillage party of all my fish-stuff and cargo ships!

I Oxforded Radio for an Ideology and took Order for a change. Alex got Autocracy soon after and I now suffer from some culture-pressure. I would not mind changing Ideology of I have to. I prefer Autocracy for war-games but Order seemed like the right thing to do with China.

As soon as World Fair is finished I will start building my modern army. I'm going to look at my oil situation. If it's good I will beline Tanks and spam Cavalry!

I have a small fleet of 6 frigates that scouts, kills and pillage around the map.


Since I enjoying this map I'm thinking of trying to get my first ever Time Victory. I don't know if it can be done on Immortal? In that case I have just reached half of the turns played! :goodjob:

t300 - Building the second army

Spoiler :
I picked of Alex units at chokepoint like there were no tomorrow and let som artillery and cavalry swim over to attack from the north. But I was to slow and just when I was about to make the puch som fierce battleship entered the scene along with airplanes. So I gave him the peace he has been nagging about to shape up my empire and start to build my second army.

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I have reached tanks, going towards battleships and started to annex cities help me spam units. Since I picked order instead of autocracy I guess I'll use hammers rather then gold to renew things. Or perhaps a combo. I bribed Alex against both Ceasar and Attila to keep him of some turns more after the peace deal runs out.

Even though Alex "own" more CS i managed to pull through both world religion and world ideology. My main goal now is to erase Alex because there is now way I'll be able to win time with him around.

To be continued...


t350 - Collecting cities

Spoiler :
I try to move slow and carefully but a lot happened the last 50 turns... I do want to try to win a Time Victory so I will spare Rome and try to focus on no culture- empire making. Will I try to grow as many cities as possible as big as possible while being as happy as possible....?

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Or... I just move my tanks around 10 more turns, win, and start another game? :)

Also.. I learned the hard way that you can't puppet captured cities to gain the free courthouses from Order. :(



t360 - Time Victory aborted, went for total domination

Spoiler :
500 turns is awful many turns to stay in a game. Sure the map was fun, but not that fun. I claimed I would need 10 more turns in my previous post so I made it a little challenge to take all remaining AI-cities in the next 10. Barley made it. :cool:

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It was very fun to play a more epic game style for a change. Kind of felt like this is the way the game is supposed to play.

Started with a liberty/honor mix boosted by The Oracle. Finished honor first, then liberty. Put 2 policies in Rationalism then the goodies from Order and full Commerce.

From about turn 300 I build nearly nothing but units.
 
T162 Domination

Spoiler :
A fun map, full of aggressive Civs who were easy to bribe. Immortal is a really nice break from Deity simply because I don't have to worry about falling behind in techs and can focus on all-out war.

I met Mongolia really early on and decided to go aggressive earlier than usual. After a scout/monument/granary I built 5 archers (2 later on as well) and camped around his capital earning xp, eventually taking it on about turn 70. He took out Kabul, the liberating of which enabled me to finish Honour by time I DOW'd Japan:

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After the 5 archers I built a shrine to get God King. I had wanted food from camps but it went super early on so I delayed the shrine. I eventually got an extremely late religion, but it was useless so I just took production and ignored it.

I stole a Japanese (didn't want to DOW Attila before I was ready as he rarely makes peace afterwards) and a CS worker pretty early on.

I went for a 1-city NC on turn 80; planning to General bomb the truffles and wine later on since China+Honour earns GGs ridiculously quickly. One city was still enough to be the tech leader by the end of the game.

Japan/America were next in order to kill them before Samurai and Minutemen. All of the Civs in the east were Ancient/Classical powerhouses, but had many out of date Rams/Horse Archers/Hoplites/Legions left over. Well-promoted Chu-Ko-Nus made short work of them later on.

With my archers upgraded to CBs, I marched on Japan. It was a pretty uneventful conquest, as he had been pointlessly splashing units against Sidon's walls and had next to no army left. Tokyo died on turn 107 and I waited a couple of turns to upgrade to CKNs before hitting America. Washington fell after a quick swim across the sea:

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While attacking Japan I built The Oracle and Great Wall (mainly to deny it) because I had hit my unit cap and needed other stuff to do.

Washington also had 8 wonders; Collossus, Chichen, Pyramids, Parthenon, Artemis, Terracotta, Hanging Gardens and Great Library. I annexed it to go full gold focus and stop it from growing. Only Washington and Karakorum were annexed.

I had prebuilt a road east and west of Karakorum in order to assault Boudicca quickly:

She died and I captured and razed her other 2 cities because they hindered my moving east to The Huns:

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Next came the long march across the snow to kill Attila - actually really easy terrain to move across! Because he'd been warring Rome for so many turns, he had next to no army to deal with, though he had taken Rome's snow city Neapolis to the north.

As I started off towards Attila, I prepared a second army to finish Alex. Half of it landed north of him in the snow, and half to the south west of Athens (Astronomy helped here). He was the only AI with a decent army, but for some reason 15+ units headed south east towards Ragusa - probably aiming to hit Attila's Court I guess. I later bought Florence as an ally, so his entire army was effectively cut off from the fight:

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Attila didn't put up much of a fight because, as I said earlier, he only had his 2 Ancient Era UUs and ironless swords because I sold him iron, not knowing he had none of his own:

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I finished Astronomy just in time for a quick swim north to besiege Rome and took it on the same turn as Athens to finish the game up:

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Main army: 7 archers/comps/CKNs, 1-2 spears/pikes, 1 warrior/sword. 2 knights later on.

Social Policies: full honour, 4 commerce.

Techs: Philosophy ---> Construction ---> Machinery ---> Civil Service ---> Education ---> Chivalry ---> Astronomy (with GS bulb).

I play Civ 5 for war and war only. You're unlikely to see me go for another victory condition because I get bored easily, sorry :)
 
T192 Domination

Spoiler :
Exactly 30 turns behind Mr. Bimblecrumbs, who I assume worked out before he got there that Rome was
Spoiler :
on a snaky little annoying peninsula
and planned in advance. In the end, my super Camel Archer, 2 Cannons and my absorb-anything-you-throw-at-him uber-Knight (who began life as a Horseman) took down Rome. I wasted a lot of time going down to Washington when I should have split the army. A fun map but I was disappointed that Attila had so little going for him by the time I got there. A bigger anticlimax than the movie 'Enemy' (2013).


Once again thanks for the map. I'm now gonna pay back my appreciation with some work on updating the spreadsheet.
 
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