Turnchat CoL

[Black_Hole]

It's to inflexible, forces the DP to do something at exactly this time.

The DP is the one who is playing the save, let them decide when to do it, for it fits in with there schedule. To do otherwise is pretty much telling them that they have to give up there whole life for this game.

no it just makes the minimum 4 days, they can spread them out as much as they want(but atleast once a week), im shur most ppl have 1 hours once a week somewhere, even if no one else can goto the tc....

 

[Strider]

no it just makes the minimum 4 days, they can spread them out as much as they want(but atleast once a week), im shur most ppl have 1 hours once a week somewhere, even if no one else can goto the tc....

It takes longer than one hour to play the save. Also, 4 days is to much time, leaders in the pass 4 demogames have been able to make instructions with no problems. It is not a problem with our rules, it's a problem with our leaders.

 

[MOTH]

How would you word it then?

I would simplfy it and remove the specific timeframes of 3.5 or 4 days + or - some number of hours.

Something on the order of:
There will be no more than two normal turnchats schedule in any 7 day period.

I agree with Strider. If we put in too much structure as a law (as opposed to a general guideline) then the DP can get stuck between RL and the game. If we have the 4 day timeframe and the DP can usually only commit to TCs on weekdays then some weeks there would be only one TC.

The current system seems to be working in general practice. Perhaps all we really need sometimes is to put a brake on things and cancel a TC here and there. Maybe we just need something saying that anyone can start a poll at least 24 hours before a sceduled TC asking if the TC should be cancelled due to blah, blah blah.

 

[MOTH]

@blackheart,
A procedural issue:
I suggest you review the CoL as far as amendments go. The CoL (section I) states that a proposed poll must be posted at the botttom of the discussion thread and that it must be seconded and thirded before it may be submitted to the judiciary and proceeding to poll on the subject.

 

[blackheart]

It was already seconded and thirded though...

 

[donsig]

If turnchats are not required, then we give the DP almost complete control. Very few people read over the chat log, but I'm sure many people will go to the turnchat. Why? It's just more interesting. If we do not require turnchats then the DP will beable to get away with a great many things, that a turnchat would stop.

Turnchats also helps the DP in making decisions based on the WOTP (notice I said based on).

Baloney. The president is still bound by the game play instructions posted by the other leaders. You've been around long enough to know that Strider. You also know that it is quite possible to have turn chats and still have a president who does not let those at the chat rule him. I find it very sad that after all this time you still think the WOTP is based on the will of those at the chat.

EDIT: Well, the president WOULD be bound by the game play instructions if we hadn't let Rik Meleet and Chieftess get away with ignoring them in DGIV (and Chieftess again in DGV).

 

[ravensfire]

blackheart,

What MOTH (and others) are looking for is a detailed proposed poll. Here is a link to a sample.

Basically, it's something that can be cut and pasted into a poll. Example:

This is the Proposed Poll for a new section to the Code Of Laws regulating the Turn Chats. Please review this carefully before voting.

CoL G.5 - Turnchat Schedule
A.  At least 4 days between Turnchats is required. The time, however, of
    the TC does not have to be exactly 96 hours from the previous Turnchat.
    Some latitude will be given (+/- 5 hours). This latitude is up to the
    discretion of the DP. 
B.  There must be played at least one full Turnchat every week; one full
    turnchat usually constitutes of at least 10 turns, but this does not have
    to be fully played as the DP can stop the turnchat early as the need 
    arises.
C.  If required, the DP can decide to hold more turnchats, limited to one turn, 
    as needed to decide in matters of trade or any other one turn actions. 
    During these one turn TCs no more than one turn can be played, but no 
    turns (effectively pressing the turn button) are needed to be played, just 
    the instructions are required to be carried out as dictated by the 
    ministers and governors.

Please Vote:
YES, I apporve the Article as written
NO, I do not approve
ABSTAIN, I have no opinion

This poll will be open for 96 hours, and is Subject to Section I (1) of the Code of Laws.

</end sample>

You put it into this format so everyone knows EXACTLY what the proposed verbiage is. If you edit the post, it should be for typo's only.

-- Ravensfire

 

[MOTH]

Exactly my point Ravensfire. It was unclear what was being seconded and when the 24 hour period started. The post at the bottom is more important than it being formed as a poll. To me it was also unclear what Ashburnham was approving and counting it as a "third" would be irregular at best.

 

[blackheart]

Well, regardless of whether they're required or not, I give my approval to the proposal. I like the idea of codifying the regularity of Turnchats, as it will keep any overzealous presidents from playing whenever they feel like it.

He most certainly did give his approval to this proposal, it's clearly stated in his first sentence. I had updated the first post with the improved and revise version by GJ, then Black_Hole and Ashburnham approved it.

 

[Black_Hole]

He most certainly did give his approval to this proposal, it's clearly stated in his first sentence. I had updated the first post with the improved and revise version by GJ, then Black_Hole and Ashburnham approved it.

did you happen to read ravensfires post before posting this post?

 

[MOTH]

@blackheart,
All I am asking is that the procedure in the Code of Laws be followed. Specifically:
1. A proposed poll be posted as the last post in the thread.
2. Within 24 hours it be seconded and thirded by other citizens.
3. After the 24 hours have passed the proposed poll may be submitted to the judiciary.
My main point in posting this procedural issue was to save you and the judiciary time and thus let you get the process back to the judiciary quicker.

As far as Ashburnham's post:
At the time of Ashburnham's post the last proposal submitted was:

Turn chats are not required.

It could be argued that Ashburnham was approving the proposal by donsig. The post that you quote was in response to a post about donsigs proposal. I agree that he was probably talking about your proposal from the context. This is why I say it would be irregular to accept it as a third.

 

[Ashburnham]

Well, actually, I was supporting the proposal not donsig's (well-meaning but unworkable) suggestion. However, in light of the recent discussion on this topic, I'd like to temporarily remove my approval until we have had more discussion on the topic.

 

[blackheart]

OK I am thoroughly confused now so let's step back and start over. This is a poll for this proposal

CoL G.5 - Turnchat Schedule
A. At least 4 days between Turnchats is required. The time, however, of
the TC does not have to be exactly 96 hours from the previous Turnchat.
Some latitude will be given (+/- 5 hours). This latitude is up to the
discretion of the DP.
B. There must be played at least one full Turnchat every week; one full
turnchat usually constitutes of at least 10 turns, but this does not have
to be fully played as the DP can stop the turnchat early as the need
arises.
C. If required, the DP can decide to hold more turnchats, limited to one turn,
as needed to decide in matters of trade or any other one turn actions.
During these one turn TCs no more than one turn can be played, but no
turns (effectively pressing the turn button) are needed to be played, just
the instructions are required to be carried out as dictated by the
ministers and governors.

This needs a seconding and third within 24 hrs to be passed onto the judiciary.

 

[ravensfire]

Looks interesting - seconded.

-- Ravensfire