What have you learnt from these forums?

[noughmaster]

Are they any new players out there who feel more confident about playing higher levels after participating in these forums? If so, tell everyone else what you learnt and how your progress (not just level, but score and finish time) has gone.

My personal experience is:

1. I didn't know that airbases on hills & mountains increase food production.

2. I had no idea a game could be won using only 1 city. BTW, I replayed GOTM7 on the weekend with only 2 cities in Britain and won easily by SS. I used London for science and York for production.

3. I've vastly improved my midgame growth by using caravans to establish enough trade routes so that We Love The Consul growth days occur and last for 5 or 6 turns.

4. I used to always build the Great Library and the Pyramids before the Colossus. The Great Library is unnecessary if you build the Colussus, Copernicus' Observatory and Isaac newton's college in the same city. You can use Marco Polo's embassy to trade advances you would get through the Great Library. It's 100 shields cheaper and you can see what everyone else is doing, rather than just infer it from what you get from the library.

5. I'm not greatly concerned by not getting the Pyramids (or indeed any other wonder) early on. If this happens, I build Sun Tzu's War Academy and The Great Wall and then go and capture the city which has the wonder I want.

I used to almost always play on Deity and would almost always win by SS without a nuclear war unless on a large map.
Now my midgame growth is good enough that I can usually conquer the other civs before rocketry, unless I have a very slow staring position.

 

[oryx]

The value of trade. It increases revenue and science! Whenever I don't know what else to build in a city, I build a caravan/freight if there are trade routes remaining to be established.

The value of Marco Polo's Embassy. I prefer it to the Great Library. You can not only get advances but you can spy on your rivals and see if you want to invade them.

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<FONT size="1">"In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move." -- Douglas Adams</FONT s>

 

[kundor]

I owe a great increase in skill to this forum...I'm not yet anywhere near an expert, but I've vastly improved from my former state. I came as a warlord-level player who rarely if ever won by spaceship (usually going conquest or just not finishing games.) Learning the value of PDS days really helped. I played Gotm5, which moved me up to Prince, then Gotm6, where I tried out what I'd learned here. That was a trial by fire: I hadn't gone after SS in a long time, and this was on Emperor with bad starting terrain! I ended up launching to arrive in 2036, but lost my capital and the SS in an ensuing war. Those mistakes taught me a lot and Gotm7 was without a doubt my best game ever. Moving down to King and a world map let me conquer most of the world, keep a pet city and arrive at AC in 1854, with a score like 220%, which amazed me because I'd never gotten higher than 75% or so before.
I still have to start using trade more; I only established a few trade routes in Gotm7 for lack of time and planning. I made a half-hearted attempt at an SSC but could greatly improve that.
I learned relative values of various Wonders; I used to just build whatever was available, I guess in the order they appeared, and let important ones slip by.
Next Gotm is another easy one, I'll try to use more trade.

 

[starlifter]

Trade, science, gold, democracy... those are the keys that I personally use. I used to be a warmonger (until abouta year ago) who once considered it impossible to land a SS before 1900 (then I found people that had done it, LOL!), and that a trade route was one of the most worthless things in the game.

When I started playing these GOTMs a few months ago, I have learned a lot about the value of early growth, since I'm a mid/late game player. But before trying GOTM 8, I'm going to go back and have another look at the early part of games by experts like Shadowdale, Cactus Pete, Smash, etc. and see how my own thinking must be impeding my pre-1 AD play.

In GOTM 7, several constraints forced me to play the game much quicker than I would normally do, yet the GOTM results were better than my prior GOTM.


BTW, Noughmaster, I played a game (small map) that was limited to a single size 4 city, and landed a SS in the late 1800's. That was an OCC (one city challenge) game I downloaded from the Apolyton site in June, I think. I have even read that one dude landed a SS with a single size one city!!

OCC games go very quick, and can usually be finished in one sitting

.

 

[noughmaster]

I have even read that one dude landed a SS with a single size one city!!

Yes, that amazed me. I think it was Smash.
I'd like to see the game.
I'd also lke to see your size 4 city game.

 

[starlifter]

Yes, that amazed me. I think it was Smash. I'd like to see the game. I'd also lke to see your size 4 city game.

I can't recall just where I read about the size one OCC, but I am going to assume it was at Apolyton. I don't think it was Smash, though he's probably done it by now himself.

I went to my archives and did find the OCC size 4 game. It was called OCC#25, which means it was from Apolyton as I recall. The special rules were that you can never have a size 5 or larger city, which can be a bit tricky when you make your engineers.

I archived all my saves, plus the log. Many OCC players keep a log of events along the way, which is where I picked up my habit of logging some games.

The thing to remember in an OCC game is that anytime you are not specifically making something, make caravans/freight. You use these later on to build (and seed the rush building) of your spaceship. The planning starts thousands of years out

.

In the log, I use many abberviations, which should be easy to figure out. "Combustion; S-Automobile", for example, denotes the date Combustion was finished and Auto started. C-50; A-75; J-100 means the Carthegenians tributed me 50 gold, the Americans 75 gold, and the Japs 100 gold.

BTW, Gold is the name of the game... get it every chance you get, and learn about gifting. I did not mess with Reference (key) civs... I just continued to gift all, and encourage war amongst my Allies. At one point for many years, all nations were allied with me

... but then, I was not Supreme, either!

Anyway, here is the log:

Log for the OCC #25
OCC 25 dated from April 2001
Played June 10-11, 2001 by Starlifter


AD 1886 - **** SS LANDS **** Score 212
AD 1885 - SS about to land!!
AD 1884 - 2nd Howie
AD 1883 - Howie
AD 1882 - 3rd Spy; Senate forced Cease Fire & Peace with Egypt
AD 1881 - Armor
AD 1880 - 2nd Stealth
AD 1879 - Sell-University; Rush- 2nd Stealth
AD 1878 - Spy
AD 1877 - Mech Infantry
AD 1876 - Sell-Research Lab
AD 1874 - Walls
AD 1873 - Science-768; Switch to 100% tax!
AD 1872 - Barracks; disband Warrior
AD 1871 - Component #6; SS is now 15-3-3-1-1-1; READY FOR LAUNCH!; LAUNCH; ETA=1886
AD 1870 - Component #5
AD 1869 - Component #4
AD 1868 - Component #3
AD 1867 - Component #2
AD 1866 - Component #1 (cost 440g); Egypt-Sneak Attack
AD 1865 - Module #3; SS is now 15-0-0-1-1-1; Egypt-Ended Alliance
AD 1864 - Module #2
AD 1863 - Module #1 done
AD 1862 - SS #15; ALL SS ARE NOW DONE!
AD 1861 - SS #14; Superconductor; S-Fusion
AD 1860 - SS #13
AD 1859 - SS #12
AD 1858 - SS #11
AD 1857 - SS #10; Swap - Egypt, Laser for Recycling
AD 1856 - SS #9; Swap Espionage for Combined Arms
AD 1855 - SS #8
AD 1854 - SS #7; pollution
AD 1853 - SS #6
AD 1852 - SS #5
AD 1851 - SS #4 done; 2 caravans-Thebes-142g
AD 1850 - Plastics; S-Espionage; Hides to Thebes (212 gold)
AD 1848 - Swap-Egypt-Space Flt for Theology
AD 1846 - Build SS #1
AD 1844 - APOLLO PROGRAM; Pillaged my RR to control pollution; 552 science; 4511 Gold in Bank; 44 Freight
AD 1842 - Space Flight (Start Apollo)
AD 1840 - Continue-Space Flight; Rush-Mfg Plant
AD 1838 - Swap-Am-nuclear power (give Atm Theory)
AD 1836 - Continue-Nulcear Power; Give-Rocketry-AdvFlt to Am (hoping to jump their science); Oil-Thebes-170
AD 1834 - Swap-Egypt-Focketry for Refrig
AD 1832 - Adv Flt; S-Rocketry
AD 1828 - Give radio; Egypt-200g
AD 1824 - Radio; S-Adv Flt
AD 1822 - Swap-Am-refrig-AmWar; C-Refrigeration
AD 1820 - Swap-Egypt-Flight for Fission; (Science = 440 beakers now)
AD 1818 - Japs-Fission-150g
AD 1814 - Nuclear Fission; S-Flight
AD 1812 - C-Nuc Fission; V-AmphWar; Give Fundy
AD 1810 - C-0g-Swap AtomTh-Give Elect; V-100g; A-50g; Mech Inf; E-75g; AtmTh
AD 1808 - Bribed 2nd Partisan
AD 1804 - Robotics; S-Atomic Theory; Rob to all but Japs; Bribed Egypt Partisan
AD 1796 - Labor Union; S-Robotics; LU to all; V-150g; A-25g; C-50g; E-0g; J-0g
AD 1792 - Off; (44 caravans; 520 science; 0 tax; 27 shields (fact-off-hydro))
AD 1790 - Research Lab; Rush-Offshore Platform; Scie 520 Bkrs-4days
AD 1788 - Computers; Rush RL; S-Labor Union; Computers to all; J-0; A-25; V-50; E-200; Minit-C-25g
AD 1786 - Fundy to J-100g
AD 1784 - Swap-Egypt-minitur for Fundy; Minitur to all; J-100; V-100; A-25; Fundy to C-25
AD 1782 - Mobile Warfare To All; J-Fundy; V-150; C-50; A-25; E-Guerilla Warfare
AD 1778 - Disband Musketeers; Start Mine
AD 1776 - Mobile Warfare; S-Miniturization
AD 1774 - Begin WLTPD (for next turn)
AD 1772 - Start harbor
AD 1766 - MachineTools; S-Mobile Warfare; MT to all; J-100g; V-150g; A-0; C-0; E-0
AD 1758 - Mass Prod; S-MachineTools; MassP to All; E-0; A-50; J-100; C-0; V-50
AD 1752 - Refining to all; 0 gold (tightwads!)
AD 1750 - Tactics to all; E-100; C-25; A-0; V-25; J-75
AD 1730 - Leadership to all; J-100; E-100; A-50; V-50; Auto-A
AD 1720 - Superhighways; Science-396 beakers (4 days per advance)
AD 1710 - Auto to all but Am; E-100; J-100; C-25; A-25; V-50
AD 1700 - Auto; S-Tactics; C-Auto; Rush-Superhighways (Science 276)
AD 1690 - C-25g; Give Mono-Got-Leadership-gave Combustion
AD 1680 - Killed-2 Barb Leaders
AD 1670 - V-25g-Mono
AD 1650 - A-25g; Swap Mono for refining; gave ??; E-0; J-200; A-25; V-0
AD 1620 - Swap-Monothiesm-Egypt
AD 1590 - Explosives; S-Chivalry; Swap-Communism-Viking (Give Econ); Exp to all; E-250; C-50; A-50; J-100
AD 1580 - Fact-Hydro
AD 1570 - V-100 (sanitation)
AD 1550 - Rush-hydro(560); C-50; A-0-; V-50; J-75; E-100
AD 1530 - Rush-Factory
AD 1480 - Chemistry; S-Electronics; For Chemistry: V-75; E-100; J-75; A-0; C-0; In Bank: 4464 Gold
AD 1460 - Oil-Thebes-76g
AD 1440 - Give Steel A-100g; everyone else-0g
AD 1420 - Wool to Heliopolis (88g); Hides-Kyoto-72g
AD 1400 - Steel; S-Chemistry
AD 1340 - Bribe-Barb Musk; Disband-Archer
AD 1300 - Electricity; S-Steel; V-100; C-25; S-25l E-Genetic; J-100
AD 1200 - Magnetism; S-Electricity; Egypt-DarwinsVoyage
AD 1140 - Swap-Sani-Eg; V-50; C-50; J-75 (for Sanitation)
AD 1100 - Metallurgy; S-Magnetism; Met to all; C-25; C-75; E-100; A-0; J-100
AD 1060 - A-50g
AD 1040 - E-100g-Gun
AD 1020 - Gun to all but E; J-50; Am-50
AD 1000 - Gunpowder; S-Metallurgy;
AD 0960 - J-50g
AD 0900 - Corp; S-Gunpowder; C-50g; A-50g
AD 0880 - V-150g
AD 0860 - C-25g; J-50g; E-100g; Ind; Kill Barb
AD 0800 - Ind-S-Corp
AD 0780 - Carth-Swap-Poly-50g; E-100g; J-25g
AD 0700 - RR; S-Steam Engine; Am-75g; Eg-75g; Eg-150g; Gift RR; C-0g; J-50g; V-50g
AD 0660 - Carth-0g; Am-75g; jap-0g; Eg-0g
AD 0620 - Kill-Barb
AD 0580 - Continue-SteamEngine
AD 0560 - Egypt-Swap-Medicine-for-IW; 25g
AD 0520 - Physics; S-Medicine; Nav to All; J-100g; V-200g;
AD 0500 - Carthage-Gift-Lots-25g
AD 0480 - Wine-165g
AD 0440 - BB; S-Physics
AD 0420 - Bribe-American Warrior-27g
AD 0400 - Met-Americans-Allied-150g
AD 0360 - Nav; S-BB
AD 0300 - Eg-150g; Gift-Seafaring; Swap-IronWorking(Japs); Gift-WarriorCode
AD 0280 - Seafaring; S-Navigation
AD 0180 - Ecomomics; S-Seafaring
AD 0140 - DEMOCRACY; Science 90% (240 beakers)
AD 0120 - Democracy; S-Economics; REVOLUTION; Gold-Trondheim-156g
AD 0060 - Kill-barb
AD 0040 - Invention; S-Democracy; Gift-Inv to all; Jps-25g
AD 0001 - Nothing much
BC 0025 - Jp-50g; V-50g; Rush-Bank; Allied-carth(engineering)-57g; gift-Eng to all; S-Invention
BC 0100 - Banking; egypt-75g; Jp-25g; Vik-100g (sci-204 beakers)
BC 0200 - ToG; S-Banking
BC 0275 - Build University (10% tax-6 gold; 80% sci-132 beakers)
BC 0300 - University; S- ToG; Gift-University to all; Allied-Viking
BC 0350 - COPERNICUS OBSERVATORY
BC 0375 - 80% Science (49 Beakers)
BC 0400 - Philosophy; Astronomy; S-University; Caravan-Beaads-196g
BC 0425 - Caravan-Wine-205g
BC 0450 - Japs paid 150 for Cease Fire!
BC 0475 - Japs-Sneak Attack (damn Japs)
BC 0525 - Swap-Egypt-Construction
BC 0550 - mathematics; S-Philosophy
BC 0575 - Disband Horseman (get 10 shields)
BC 0625 - REPUBLIC; Alliance Cancelled; Killed more barbs
BC 0675 - Bribe/Kill Barb; disband warrior; REVOLUTION
BC 0775 - HUT-Republic
BC 0925 - Killed-Dip
BC 0950 - S-Mysticism
BC 1050 - Bribe-Barb Archer; Killed-Barb Leader
BC 1100 - (28 trade, 30 science, WLTKD)
BC 1250 - MONARCHY
BC 1350 - Trade; S-Literacy
BC 1500 - Egypt-50g; Peace; Gave most tech
BC 1600 - HUT-Horseman
BC 1750 - Rush-Library; Carthage-50g; Gave all tech
BC 1900 - Japs-Sneak Attack (So what's new, LOL?!)
BC 2050 - Joined 2nd Settler; Rome is Size 4
BC 2350 - HUT-Code of Laws
BC 2950 - Met Japs - Give All Tech
BC 3000 - Ally-Carthage; Give all Tech

 

[starlifter]

Here is the Zip file of the Size 4 OCC (Apolyton OCC #25), including the starting position (hope it uploads correctly)...

 

[noughmaster]

The thing to remember in an OCC game is that anytime you are not specifically making something, make caravans/freight.

Playing OCC has really taught me the value of several key cities as well as trade routes. I usually make all the other cities for the score.

 

[starlifter]

Playing OCC has really taught me the value of several key cities as well as trade routes

LOL, you know the "O" in OCC means "One", not "Several", right? The latter would make it the SCC. BTW, if your OCCs have been really easy for you, and you have several key cities, you might need to replay the OCC(s) with just one city, hehe

.


OK, OK... I'm just giving you a hard time because of the way your sentence reads...

 

[ferenginar]

What have I learnt from these forums/

How woefully inadequate my previous strategies have been, the high scores and fast finishes that I read about are frightening.

I don't quite understand why, as I do not feel that there is anything new in the strategy tips I read about, it must simply be the application, or maybe my abject failure to reject other strategies that do not work and thus in amalgamation lose everything.

Things are improving though i still have a long way to go, as you will all see when i submit gotm8.

 

[donsig]

The first thing I learned was the 'riot factor'. I had reached the point of playing emperor or diety only and multiplayer had taught me to build cities, build cities, build cities. New cities being born with red citizens aggravated me while the occasional black citizen threw me for a loop. Now I know why this happens (and what the black citizens represent!).

I've also learned to take the "we love the....days" more seriously. I'm actually raising my luxury percentage in GOTM8 to encourage these. In the past I would only raise the luxury rate to the level where my cities stayed out of civil disorder and would rue even that level.

I'm learning to use more trade routes but this is taking a bit longer to sink in. I rarely have trade routes between my own cities, preferring to send my caravans to far off foreign cities (though I never seem to have enough ships to do this right).

I've also begun paying more attention to where I build Wonders. I haven't yet made a Super Science City - these lessons take time to sink in.

I've also been intrigued by the One City Challenge concept and flabbergasted by the early launch dates bandied about in the forums. Been inching towards them....

 

[RJP]

I have played civ 2, off and on, since it first came out. I have usually played prince and king, and stuggled to get over 150&.

During that time I never:
- bullt an airport
- traded with my own cities
- played raging hords
- played higher than king


I do now!!! (except GOTM9 of course)

Enough said

RJP

 

[RJP]

and never use spell check!

that is 150%

RJP