What's the deal with knocking Firaxis

[sabo]

Hi All,

I just discovered this board about 2 weeks ago and I have spent alot of time here getting tips, (thanks for creating this site whoever is responsible) I get a little irriated though when I see these threads from people who either think it's cool to put something good down or don't have anything better to do. For instance I see a lot of comments like "Not enough cultures" or "not enough civs" or "it doesn't do this that civ II does" etc, etc.... why do I get the sneaking suspicion that if the game DID have more options these people would still complain that it still wasn't enough. Heck people, the game is flexible enough that you can changed just about any thing you don't like about it. So change it already!!!

Are these people supposed to get me to believe that they can sit down and write a better game? I've played "a lot" of computer games in the past 14 years and it's been EXTREMELY rare for me to find one that's really good, (I was hooked on Panzer General for a while but I think that was because I'm such a WWII buff) in my opinion the Civ series are the best games ever made. Most games I play once or twice and get bored with it right away, but the civ games have given me years of playing fun. Ok, Ok, I hear ya, your saying this guy is complaining about people complaining, but at least I'm not complaining about something that took years and thousands of man-hours creating. The game is ingenious and innovative period! Lets all be thankful the game was created, otherwise we'd have to go find something else to complain about right?

 

[Zouave]

The main complaint resolves around three issues.

One. Firaxis sold us last Fall for $50 an incomplete beta game filled with flaws and bugs because they rushed it to market for the Holiday buying season. The "Official Strategy Guide" ($13) was terrible. How bad was it? The Guide told us how great privateers were when they had an attack value of '1'!! They stink at '2' (after the patches), and still can't attack trade - their historical purpose (same with subs).

Two. Civ 3 was missing what Civ 2 devotees consider BASIC features in the Civilization series: Scenarios; scenario-building; Cheat Mode; multi-player, etc. Why were they missing? No doubt so they could be sold to us later. Also, instead of being more complex than Civ 2, Civ 3 is basically simpler: Naval warfare, Espionage, and trade have become tedious abstractions.

Three. Civ 3 contains new concepts that are inherently flawed, non-historical, and make little sense: Settler Diarrhea; massive corruption; Culture Flipping, etc. They are also intensely annoying. A lot of of us spent a good deal of time on the forums for over five years after Civ 2 came out debating what should be in Civ 3. Almost all of them were ignored while Firaxis gave us these flawed concepts no one asked for.

So, why don't I go play Europa Universalis instead? Sometimes I do, but I love the Civilization games too much to let Firaxis off the hook for this. All they have to do is get it right.

 

[TETurkhan]

wanting more things isnt bad...
as a consumer it is smart to ask for the most, thats nothing against Firaxis, thats how the relationship between consumers and suppliers of products work..

law of supply and demand.. we demand more and are willing to pay for it, and the companies supply us with what we want...

 

[Baleog]

If people really truly hated the game, they wouldn't play the game, hence they wouldn't be here to complain about it. People do like the game but it was not as great as potentially it could have been. Personally I'd have waited another year for the next holiday buying season if they could have just got it right.

 

[Exile_Ian]

Unfortunately, it's got to the stage where the negative voices seem to outweigh the positive ones. That's not because they represent the majority though - to some extent its because many people are getting bored with the same arguements (I know I am) and feel they shouldn't need to keep justifying why they enjoy Civ3. Also (as someone already said) many people who do enjoy the game are having too good a time playing to hang out here!

Some of what Zouave says (who as you may have gathered is one of the more vocal doom-mongers here) is valid - but I take challenge with the points about Firaxis deliberately holding back features so they could 'milk' us later. The scenario editor (for instance) is already being offered as a free download (hopefully in June), and Firaxis are still commited to providing patches.

Whether the PTW expansion will be a success depends largely on whether you're keen on Multi-player or not (I'm not bothered) and how many other goodies are bundled into the pack.

Meanwhile I still play Civ3 most days and continue to enjoy the game.

 

[Trabpukcip]

Ok you say that civ3 need thousands of man hour to create and the fact that you complain about people and not civ makes it right... Hey man, do I need to remind you that the people you complain about needed around 6500 of women hours to create!

But anyway, on the subject, the truth is that civ players are really devoted to this game and they love a lot, so it's just normal that they want the best out of it. Personnaly I have a lot of thing I would apreciate be put in civ, but that doesn't mean I hate the game. It means I love it enought to want it improve...

 

[Crimson Sunrise]

I also think people on the Internet complain too much about Civ3. But if you think it's bad here, you should see Apolyton.

 

[warpstorm]

Plus some people would rather complain about the same things over and over and over than move on with their lives. They don't realize that their lives would actually improve if they just let it go. I guess they get some sort of perverse joy in complaining.

 

[bobgote]

We also see more criticism than praise because it's quite pointless to start a thread saying "I think civ 3 is good!!" or "I really like this feature!". You'd either get "Yes, I agree" or someone saying "I hate it, it should all be changed". When you bring up something that you think could be done better, you get a lot of feedback, and sometimes one of those mod-creators might even write something that fixes it!

I love the civ games, especially this one. I was playing civ 1 up til the day I got this, and I'm quite impressed. When people complain here, we find out what are real problems and what aren't, and maybe for the real ones, what can be done to fix these. I have seen firaxis people on here, so things might be done about these problems in the future. Firaxis have done a very good job, but these people want something that's perfect and with a bit more work on a few improvements, this may even be achieved!!1

 

[sabo]

My apology, in my book beta testers have every right to complain..