Which is better : Monarchy or Republic

[Thierry]

I often find myself at lost to choose between Republic and Monarchy...

In Civ II I always tried for Republic

In Civ III, it would seem as Republic would be better when you are at peace or isolated, but :
Monarchy gives :
* free support for units (2, 4, ?)
* up to three pacifying units -> We love the king day are easier to achieve.

So, does Republic really offer some advantage ? I often find myself with large empire with many underdeveloped or largely corrupted cities... In those case I would think that the lesser support cost + military police may help me get more money (and research) + production through the 'love the king day'...

Has anyone tested the two governements in different kind of situations ?

 

[d10]

I'd pick Republic in just about any situation. The extra commerce you get in republic will be more than enough to pay for your units plus more unless you have a really low population and a really large army. I can't think of a time when my income dropped by switching to Republic. Most of the time it jumps up about 5-10x. More than enough to buy some luxuries from other civs or raise your luxury slider to make up for the unhappiness and still receive more cash and production (less corruption in Republic) than you would in Monarchy.

 

[WildFire]

It depends on what type of game i am playing. If i just happened to start some early wars and would appreciate the extra units per city, i definitely go for Monarchy (also for the Hanging Gardens which are nice). And Republic when i want my corruption lower. Or when i am a religious civ, i switch in between.

 

[jorge_roberto]

With Republic you produce 1 more gold in each tile that already produces gold. So, let's compare:

If you have a nice road system (i.e. road in each worked tile).

A city with size 2 will produce more 2 golds per turn. This equalizes the support bonus of Monarchy.

A city with size 3 -> 6 will produce more 3 -> 6 golds per turn. So, you it's worth to be Republic.

Sure, there is the corruption problem. But, Republic with Market Place in your cities will make your economy stronger. Just control some luxuries and put your entertainment tax at 10%, and you will see.

 

[Angmar]

In my current game things look like they are calming down enough that I might be able to make the jump from Monarchy to the Republic. I am curious if one of the bright people around here can give some rough estimates.

I am playing as England, was first to Map Making and took great advantage of the Great Lighthouse. I have explored the majority of the world and none of the major continents know of each other. I have secured my continent and in the most recent war gained about 1/5th of the largest continent .. with Rome and Carthage holding the rest.

The continent of England has been entirely built up all of its cities are at 12. There is a Forbidden Palace situated at roughly the middle of the Island. On the mainland I control the majority of the south and east coasts. ( England is off the South Coast ). Up until this point I was using Monarchy for the 4 free units per city. With 20+ English cities at Size 12 this really helped me have a large army. However now my Empire has grown to all the small islands and I see ALOT of corruption. Courthouses do not seem to help at all. I rush built my Palace on the main continent with the first Great Leader that popped out of one of the wars that has happened over the last 1000 years. Currently Rome has built a HUGE army compared to me ( I had an utter failure of a naval invasion of Japan .. So I have to build up and build up quickly. I know that 4 Musketmen per city on the mainland will barely slow up the Roman legions. I must build more military.

I think this means that I should take the anarchy hit and go to the Republic and let the English commercial quality really shine. However I have a few questions about this.

1> What is the commerce difference between republic and monarchy? "Where does the extra money come from?"

2> Corruption, I know the republic is less corrupt, but how much, and do courthouses function better under the republic?

3> Anarchy, how long does it last? Im not looking for a specific turn number, but I am curious as if there are any "if you have more of these, or less of these anarchy is going to be longer / shorter". I always HATE switching goverments and Im even known to linger around in despotism for longer than I should cause of my fear of anarchy. What kind of unit costs am I going to see in anarchy?

4> Im 1 1/2 techs away from Cavalary ( I have modified the tech rate so that its usually 25-40 turns between discoveries ). When do I switch governments? Do I switch to the Republic just before Military Tradition? I would like to assume that I should build my army while in the Republic. This will probably 60+ turns away. Rome is probably arlready eyeing up my cities, each turn I tell myself "build like the war starts when you press space bar at the end of your turn" .. musketmen are being built at 90% of the main contient cities and pikemen who are then put on a boat and shipped to the main continent to be upgraded are being built in the core cities around the forbidden palace in England.

Cheers,

 

[Bamspeedy]

1. Republic produces 1 more commerce in all tiles that are already producing at least 1.

2. Corruption difference is minimal. Courthouse work the same, it increases that cities 'optimal # of cities' calculations by 25%.

3. 4-8 turns usually. Happiness does not play a factor as far as I've seen (but some people insists it does). The only thing I've ever seen affect the turns of anarchy is when I get to Monarchy before 2000 B.C., where I have very few cities, then anarchy lasts only a turn or 2 for me.
You will see no unit costs in anarchy. Actually you should break even (+0 gold/turn) unless you are paying/receiving gpt from other civs or you have some specialists. The luxury rate won't help you in anarchy, so you'll need to make some entertainers.
Republic does not have the military police that Monarchy does so you may need to set luxury rate a little higher (but you'll still make more money in most cases, because republic makes about twice as much). If you only have 1 or 2 luxuries you may be better off in monarchy because of the 3 military police. With 3 or more luxuries and a marketplace in several cities then definitely go to republic (unless you are going to do some heavy warring).

 

[civ_steve]

It's surprising, but sometimes your army support in Monarchy is more expensive then in Despotism!! In Despotism, all towns/cities/metros support 4 units; under Monarchy towns support 2, cities 4 and metros 6. If you have a large army and lots of towns (size 6 and under), you may have to spend more to support your army under Monarchy, even with the corruption improvement.

Under Republic, even a size 1 town with roads produces 4 commerce (2 for the town center and 2 for the tile being worked), which, at 100% taxes, compensates for the 2 unit support provided by the town under Monarchy. A size 7 city with roads and marketplace adds 11 gpt under Monarchy and 19 gpt under Republic (after subtracting the cost for marketplace and 4 supported units and assuming 100% taxes.) Similarly a size 13 metro generates 20 gpt under Monarchy and 35 gpt under Republic. Luxuries can easily replace the 3 unit MP capability.

I generally prefer Republic (or Democracy.) War weariness is the only significant problem. However, you can BE at war forever; you just can't have units in each other's cultural boundary or lose any cities (or have citizens of the other civ in your cities.) This forces you into shorter shooting wars, and earlier peace treaties, which should be manageable.

 

[Knight-Dragon]

I'd usually use republic as well, as my warmongering govt style. Unless I'm already in monarchy and already at war; can't afford to waste the turns during a govt changeover to republic.

War weariness is manageable and you shld get a reasonable gpt, if you're somewhat developed (cities and tiles).

 

[DaveMcW]

It's all about the luxuries. You need at least 3+marketplaces to switch to republic, or 4 without marketplaces.

 

[Scyphax]

I reckon the Republic is better but Monarchy has the advantage of being available earlier.

I normally go strait for monarchy because you have less techs to research before you get it and the techs along the way give you immediate benifts -> temple, oracle and archers.

If you have an early UU then you want to be out of despotism quickly because a GA under despotism sucks.

I let the AI reseach the Republic and then trade for it and then swap.

 

[Knowze Gungk]

I've never even tried Monarchy in Civ 3 or Civ 2 because it never worked out for me in Civ. So I've only ever ignored it, only geting it through The Great Library or having another civ give it to me "out of the goodness of their heart".

I also bypass Chivalry a lot, go straight on to Military Tradition, unless of course I hit Gunpowder & find I have not been blessed with them little mounds of sherbert that I hold so very dear ('til I find the black doughnuts, at least) or if another civ makes the mistake of declaring war on me or looking at me in that way, at around my feudal age.

 

[PersianImmortal]

I like Monarchy.. it gives u the option of another wonder.. often the AI beats me to other wonders so there is a fallback available for my pre-build city. and there is no war weariness.. EXTREMELY important as I want to gain territory in Ancient times and I have to be quick about it before there are Pikemen fortifying themselves in AI cities or their Knights are running around threatening my cities.

 

[Angmar]

Before this game I always went for Republic before Monarchy. This time I knew there was a high chance for a long and extended war period where I was sure that my land would be swamped by enemy units at times and I would loose cities. In the end I only lost one city. Monarchy did me very well during this period of great wars. There are only three of us left on the main contintent now. We seem to be able to get along .. right now

I did the switch from Monarchy to the Republic. One thing I did discover is that your domestic advisor tells you how long you will be in Anarchy for. VERY HANDY. Wish I had discovered this along time ago.

The outcome of the switch. The "default" bonus for commerce was able to support my entire army + about 5-10%. So I made a little gain in cash there. However the BIG bonus seemed to be in science. I was able to turn my science slider down two notches and still research at the fastest speed. Now maybe I was negligent in tuning my science slider for the last few discoveries. However that was HUGE boost, nearly doubling my gold per turn. I have 75% of my empire building military units right now ( Sun Tzu's rules! )

"Republic! Republic! Republic!"

 

[MummyMan]

Republic is best in my opinion, but sometimes i can make more money and research faster with Monarchy, so i never know. But generally i don't fight so republic is good for me

 

[Gregski]

I nearly always pick republic. The only choices I seemed to make is whether to change to communism during/before a war, but that's another topic.

 

[planetfall]

Republic is generally better. See Bamspeedy's notes. However Monarchy is better if:

1- you have few luxuries {less than three}
2- don't have at least temples in your cities,
3- don't have breaks in your warfare.

If you switch to Republic too soon and have size 6-10 cities without enough happiness generators, you will lose ground to civ in despotism or monarchy.


== PF

 

[TheNiceOne]

Three of the governments (monarchy, republic and democracy) are well balanced, in the way that each one can be the best choise some time during a normal game, so if you overlook one of these three, you're hurting your game. It's sad that communism is so much worse though.

Republic will normally give a bit more income/research than monarchy due to the extra gold per square and a tiny amount of less corruption, but there are two main reasons for being in monarchy: Happiness and happiness (yes, I really mean two reasons)

The first is the fact that Monarchy has military police. Up to 4 (IIRC) unhappy citizens can be made content by miliray police. This is very helpful befor you get the cathedrals or enough luxuries spread around.

The second is the fact that Monarchy has no war weariness. In my previous game I was attacked on the same turn that I chose anarchy (had planned to go from monarchy to democracy). I therefor chose republic instead of democracy due to less WW, but I still had to start another revolution later on when the WW struck too heavy in republic, and go back to monarchy.

 

[The Last Conformist]

War Weariness is very rarely a problem for me, despite me often fighting fairly lengthy wars of conquest under Republic or Democracy. As long as you're winning, and you've got most/all luxuries, the people doesn't seem to care that much, usually.

 

[Gregski]

Originally posted by TheNiceOne
....
It's sad that communism is so much worse though.

Actually, I think that communism can be useful in certain cases during a war if:

• You are religious (no anarchy wait)
• You want to pop rush build temples/libraries to build culture and reduce foreign nationals from the city
• You want a bit better production in rural cities
  [/list=a]
  Communism is mostly useless in peace though. Once I managed to build the Forbidden Palace in a city far away, but that's it.