Colonialist Legacies: Histories of the New World | Colonial + Pre-Colonial civs

mokyo24 · Apr 17, 2014

Did any of the modern colonialists actually succeeded in controlling Afghanistan? I don't really know much about the country but I always hear it being referred as "The Graveyard of Empires" which sure sounds epic. Whenever I hear that phrase the first things that come to mind are rebellions, guerrilla attacks and an unforgiving terrain.

Now to the Civ, yeah, judging by the name, maybe the UA should have some extra "gifts" for aspiring invaders. Maybe automatically have their Combat Strength sapped while in desert and rough terrain you control? Or maybe cities originally founded by Afghanistan have a chance of entering Resistance every turn or going into Rebellion and generating insurgents while under foreign control? They would be harder to hold on to and would be unappetizing even to the most land-hungry warmonger.

The Caravan discount applies to both production and gold cost right? It reminds me of the Philippine civ's cheaper Cargo Ships.

senshidenshi · Apr 17, 2014

Krajzen said:
Hey senshidenshi, here I upload Jungle Invisibility Ability (...as it seems you cannot send files via private messages???)

Warning - I upload proper lua AND sql AND xml because the core ability - invisibility - is not in lua. And when I discovered where it is my jaw has literally dropped as I was impressed by this genius simplicity. The effect of Invisible Unit is achieved mainly by... adopting Submarine stealth ability from game One XML line

Odd spot to put it, but thank you very much

I'm looking forward to Afghanistan as well.

Barbarian King · Apr 17, 2014

Krajzen said:
Warning - I upload proper lua AND sql AND xml because the core ability - invisibility - is not in lua. And when I discovered where it is my jaw has literally dropped as I was impressed by this genius simplicity. The effect of Invisible Unit is achieved mainly by... adopting Submarine stealth ability from game One XML line

Just fyi, using the submarine invisibility will make your unit visible to destroyers. Shouldn't be too big of a deal for a land unit, though.

Pouakai · Apr 17, 2014

Barbarian King said:
Just fyi, using the submarine invisibility will make your unit visible to destroyers. Shouldn't be too big of a deal for a land unit, though.

And when adjacent to cities or units, I believe.

TPangolin · Apr 18, 2014

Viregel said:
Firstly, the icon isn't a great choice. While it was used as the Afghan symbol, it was only for four years, which I assume is part of the reason why people didn't realise what the civ was. I'd say that the Mosque-like architecture that you see on most other Afghan symbol (while not identical, they are very similar) as it's probably more representative.

That'd be nice if we were going for something religious, but nah. I like the eagle - one could say it even resembles a pheonix - you know rising from the ashes of other empires.

Viregel said:
Secondly, Afghanistan isn't really colonial nor pre-colonial. Yes, it was affected by colonialism, but that's like saying China would fit well because several countries had colonial ambitions there (Just for the record, it wouldn't really work at all).

As you mentioned, it was a nation and a people affected heavily by colonialism and the forces of the west. I wouldn't really call Ethiopia a Colonial civilization - but if it wasn't made - you can bet your thighs that I'd do it for this thread.

Viregel said:
It has a thing about not being taken over by foreign powers - it isn't called the Graveyard of Empires just to provide a fancy UA title.

It's nowhere near complete - just releasing an initial draft. They need some incentive for invading empires (I'm thinking perhaps pillaging bonuses for the Dida).

Oh - and for kicks - let's include the Minaret of Jam as well.

Pouakai said:
And when adjacent to cities or units, I believe.

This is intended

SuperWaffle247 · Apr 18, 2014

The icon combines elements of the various seals that have been prevalent in the Afghan seal for the last 100 years. It's nonreligious, has some unique imagery, and is a way to represent the "national" period of Afghanistan.

I think it's tricky to do defensive stuff/resistance stuff without rewarding poor play. Also, it's not like Afghanistan pulled an Ethiopia and went unconquered for millenia. I also strongly believe that a) TP can adjust the theme of his set of civs if he so desires and b) Afghanistan was undoubtedly, deeply affected by colonialism, especially if you broaden to definition away from early modern European empires.

regalman · Apr 18, 2014

TPangolin said:
Oh - and for kicks - let's include the Minaret of Jam as well.

I have an xml sitting around of it as a wonder, from the days when I was a failed artist

demondance · Apr 19, 2014

@: TP

About UB of VN, what is a final choosing of your ?

TPangolin · Apr 20, 2014

Um what? The UB for Vietnam? Has a slot for a Great Work of Writing. More expensive than the Amphitheater that it replaces, Great Works contained within a city Water Puppet Theater increases a city's Defensive Strength by 5.

SuperWaffle247 · Apr 20, 2014

Doesn't the regular Amphitheater have a GW Writing slot?

TPangolin · Apr 20, 2014

Yes it does.

SuperWaffle247 · Apr 20, 2014

TPangolin said:
Yes it does.

Really what I meant is does the potential city defense bonus justify the increased cost over the amphitheater?

TPangolin · Apr 20, 2014

I'd say so, balance wise.

demondance · Apr 20, 2014

So the great slot must be filled to get 5 defense ? If so = weak.

TPangolin · Apr 20, 2014

A potential 40% buff for Great Writers, Musicians and Artists in every city, combined with +33% from World Congress and +25% from Aesthetics combining for a total of a +98% buff in GWAM spawn rates?

Also consider the fact that each policy adopted in Honor gives you +5% Food and +5% Culture. So in terms of culture with 5 Honor Policies adopted, Hermitage, Sistine Chapel and the Sydney Opera House in your capital + World's fair, During a Golden Age - you'd be producing and ADDITIONAL +275% Culture in the capital.

Even if you get rid of all those extras, you are still having a 40% higher GWAM spawn rate, +25% Food and +25% Culture with your UA maxed out.

I think having a relatively weak UB makes up for that.

Scapegrace · Apr 20, 2014

Oh, yeah, I meant to ask; does that include unlocking the policy tree? I can never remember...

TPangolin · Apr 20, 2014

Just the policies.

Scapegrace · Apr 20, 2014

Ah, right. Makes sense. Also, which bit of DoM bombast do you want me to do next?

TPangolin · Apr 20, 2014

Cosijoeza of the Zapotecs or Mirwais Hotak of Afghanistan would be nice!

Scapegrace · Apr 20, 2014

'Kay. I'll have something done for both tomorrow. I have heard of this human practice called "having a life" and I've decided I want no truck with it. =]

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