Northern Pike
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Nice progress. 
I've got it.
I've got it.
LK154 - CCM - Bablyon
- Thread starter LKendter
- Start date
Well Done! 
I think we should trade for Democracy. Self Research Steam. Then make peace with Nubia for how ever many techs they will give us.
Northern Pike
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Pointy-stick research is miserably unrewarding after the first age. It wouldn't be a question of how many techs we could extort from Nubia, but likelier of a discount on one. The amount of tech (measured in beakers) that an enemy civ will give up to survive either doesn't scale at all as the game advances, or doesn't scale enough--it's a fundamental error that was never fixed.
Right now the Nubians are still insulted by the idea of surrendering Democracy for peace, for example.
Right now the Nubians are still insulted by the idea of surrendering Democracy for peace, for example.
Northern Pike
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The question of whether we should buy Democracy immediately for about 9K gold or self-research it in six turns is a subtle one. My decision is for self-research, because we probably can't afford Democracy plus Steam Power in less than six turns anyway; that is, if we spend almost all our gold for Democracy now, it'll take a few turns of looting Nubia to restore our wealth to where we could buy Steam Power.
My suggestion was before I looked at the game. Also, I did not know how stingy (and short sighted would not even give 1,000 gold for peace) the AI is when negotiating peace.
Any idea about how much would it cost to buy Steam Power in 6 turns?
Self-research Democracy, buy Steam Power and self-research Improved Steam Engines might even be a turn or 2 quicker getting to railroads than what I suggested.
Northern Pike
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Steam Power might cost about 12K gold, though that's a loose estimate. If we delay the big purchase by six turns, we might be able to make back some gold by selling Steam Power on, whereas there's no money out there for which we could sell Democracy now.
I looks like it is getting close to when it is not profitable to build windmills (obsolete with Industrialization). For a city producing 12 to 15 uncorrupted base shields per turn, it takes 27 turns to earn back the 80 shields invested.
Also, looking at Nubia's boundaries it appears that besides Wawat, at least 1 other and possibly a third city are in the west.
Also, looking at Nubia's boundaries it appears that besides Wawat, at least 1 other and possibly a third city are in the west.
Northern Pike
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Agreed, on both points. I'll change our four windmill builds.
I assume Democracy would have the 'markup' in cost for government techs. In that case self research wouldn't have the 50% extra cost tacked on and is likely the better deal (though I have never tested to see if CCM has this same increase as regular games).
I think your plan of self research and then buy is sound.
If I recall correctly there are only a few more tradable tech left. I assume that hasn't changed?
I think your plan of self research and then buy is sound.
If I recall correctly there are only a few more tradable tech left. I assume that hasn't changed?
Northern Pike
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It seems to be the same, if the Civilopedia can be trusted. Of the seven first-tier techs in the IA, five are the last tradeable techs, while Steel and Marine Engineering are already untradeable.
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Yes, so it is in this version of CCM.
In the next version of CCM - on that I work even tonight - some techs more can be traded, so the player in CCM version 2.00 has to fight more against WW2 units of the AI...and one question: What´s the difficulty level you are playing this game?
Northern Pike
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Thanks for the confirmation.
We're playing at deity, as usual.
We're playing at deity, as usual.
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I always thought deity CCM was slightly easier than vanilla deity. I think this is due to the fact the AI growth is constrained. (However, the constrained growth is also one of the more interesting things about the mod so its not a bad thing)
We (this team) could probably play at SID level. The extra settler is a minor advantage with constrained growth so its not a big jump difficulty like vanilla.
We (this team) could probably play at SID level. The extra settler is a minor advantage with constrained growth so its not a big jump difficulty like vanilla.
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Greebley, thank you very much for your statement.
This is just the direction I am reflecting about. More about it, when the prebetatesting of the next version of CCM will start, as this thread of course focuses on the great game and story of this team about the history of Babylon.
I agree with Greebley. Biggest problem we have right now is time pressure.
I wish that we had 600 total turns to play instead of 500. We are going to win, I just do not know if we will be able to choose which victory we achieve.
As it stands we have played (through Tusker's set) about 1/2 the turns (245 out of 500).
We still have 26 AIs to eliminate which means we can only spend about 9 turns on average to destroy one of the remaining AIs.
Space race is also close. We need to learn about 50 techs in 255 turns and build the space ship parts.
Northern Pike
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Linear projections like this aren't really a concern, because the graph of our progress is exponential. Once we have a full rail net and buildable settlers, it'll be perfectly possible for us to eliminate rival civs in one turn.
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We don't have to destroy ALL the civs. We typically end with domination, as we get get larger the steam roller really hits.
IMO the late game is easier with CCM since corruption is so much easier to handle, then the base game.
IMO the late game is easier with CCM since corruption is so much easier to handle, then the base game.
