Emperor Sury - Pangea

[soundjata]

I opened the save and saw that our scattered army of 7 horse archers is the strongest on the map.
That is good.

I saw that shaka is near to the east so it would be incovenient if we are the target of his dow while we attack west.

However Shaka is now willing to get bribed on either Pacal or Saladin for the price of HBR.
Seems like an interesting option to either:
- Attack SB while Shaka is busy on someone else.
- Piggyback Shaka in his conquest, take cities under his nose.
I think the first one is more simple
watcha think @sampsa ?

 

[M60A3TTS]

You should road to both SB and Shaka immediately. You are starving for and the trade routes would help +1 per city. You also could get -trades which would allow your cities to grow to work cottages. I'm not saying it's looking bad really, but things could be better.

To me, SB seems like the next target, unless Shaka chooses otherwise. Tougher archers can be a pain, but probably less painful than impis.

Attach GG to a chariot for healer probably. To me it looks like you have more or less committed to total war...

I see no option other than going after Shaka.

I had thought originally we were taking on SB, but then it made sense that you wanted to go after Gilgamesh. To me, he was the bigger threat. Now the biggest threat is Shaka and if he doesn't attack now, he certainly will later. He appears to have no other neighbors. A bigger Shaka later will hardly be better than Shaka now.

So, how to proceed?

 

[M60A3TTS]

I've shifted citizens working tiles for growth and commerce and swapping HAs for libraries. The economy has to be the priority now.

We have only three cottages and two hamlets and need to double up on that as a minimum. So laying off the whip for now.

Science goes to -1gpt @ 0%. We were running +16 before the Sumerian war so I'd like to get back to a similar level.

Will get the roads built out to NA and Zulu.

We have 182 gold and science is 100% with math in 2 @-36gpt. Then somehow we need IW. Without metal, there is a distinct mismatch between impi and horse units.

 

[M60A3TTS]

Math in. Need IW, currency, alpha soonest.

 

[sampsa]

I'm not sure if libraries is a great idea. You'll be running extremely low slider anyway (then again, it's only 45). According to the old Snaaty quote, get more troops and use conquest gold to fund currency. After you can build wealth there is no bankruptcy really. Easy on the whip though, you want to work those cottages (and gold obv).

You haven't developed a healthy disrespect towards emperor AI yet. Pre-construction Shaka can do nothing to you really. Build some 4 archers to your border city and you are fine.

You shouldn't pick your victims based on who is a threat. Nobody is a threat. Pick the victim based on whose land helps you the most!

 

[M60A3TTS]

Right now I have to deal with this. He has been waiting for an answer for a while now.

We have a road to SB so this would hurt our economy. But it would buy Shaka off for 10 turns.

He is annoyed at SB and has him as worst enemy, but we're at the same diplo level with Shaka as SB at +1. So refusal will drop us to 0 and we may pick up the WE tag. Still, we do get a 10 turn peace deal and could then turn on SB.
But there would be no opportunity to scout SBs land.

Or, tell him to pound sand and hope for the best.

 

[soundjata]

@M60A3TTS Please proceed with caution. The situation looked really good in 700BC. But now you seem to be going at several directions at once.

This game can easily go from very good to unnecessarily painful :/

I think you may have missed my post on the top of this page and overlooked the idea that focusing mostly on HA conquest could win you the game.

There's no plan B at the moment. No Libraries or Alphabet. You got the best army in the world (7 horse archers), you got mathematics and lots of forests.
Kill everyone my friend. No side-tracks

 

[M60A3TTS]

@M60A3TTS Please proceed with caution. The situation looked really good in 700BC. But now you seem to be going at several directions at once.

This game can easily go from very good to unnecessarily painful :/

I think you may have missed my post on the top of this page and overlooked the idea that focusing mostly on HA conquest could win you the game.

There's no plan B at the moment. No Libraries or Alphabet. You got the best army in the world (7 horse archers), you got mathematics and lots of forests.
Kill everyone my friend. No side-tracks

ok, thanks for the input. Science turned off and HAs back in the queue.
Got IW and alpha in trade from Maya and Arabia. Feel better that at least if needed can build axes to help counter impi if it comes to that. But SB is the next target per sampsa.
Built archers for the border cities of the east as advised.

 

[Fippy]

Never agree to "stop trading with our worst enemy" requests.
Those are not war checks..they just give -1 diplo for some time. They are very unimportant and usually just limit your options, cos that AI won't talk to you for longer than you might like.

 

[M60A3TTS]

Turn 103 and war has been declared on SB.

We have doubled up on the HAs and now have 15. 5 of 6 cities are building more. 13 are on the front lines and the other 2 coming in from the east.

The archers are all set in the east to keep an eye on Shaka who closed his borders after we refused to stop trading with the AI we are now at war with.

We have -1 unhappiness in 4 cities that can be whipped away. We also have Buddhism in 4 cities so could go that route in eliminating some of that unhappiness. Or maybe we should just stay as is and keep the production lines humming.

The inspection of SBs lands are he does not have a lot of defenses in any of his cities, about 2-3 for the moment.

I move a chariot up to initially reveal 2 archers in the two cities.

Science 0 @-2gpt. 94 gold to carry us until the first cities fall.

What next moves are suggested?

 

[soundjata]

Taking Cahokia right know looks sensible.
Converting to Buddhism as well.
You'll need to replenish your army if you want to take SB swiftly.
Whip like there is no tomorrow

Only issues could be SB getting to longbows (how close is he?)
And Shaka attacking of course. (keep an eye on him)

 

[M60A3TTS]

Taking Cahokia right know looks sensible.
Converting to Buddhism as well.
You'll need to replenish your army if you want to take SB swiftly.
Whip like there is no tomorrow

Only issues could be SB getting to longbows (how close is he?)
And Shaka attacking of course. (keep an eye on him)

ok, SB does not have Monarchy yet although he can research it through Polytheism. He does not have meditation.

City taken, at a cost of 4 HA. No buildings saved. No walls in any city spotted yet, but he has masonry.
Odds on these were 22.5, 26.8, 22.5, 66.3. So no break there in killing 2 archers.
11 HA and 4 chariots on map.

Chaco Canyon went to 4 defenders, so can't take that city, not that the location is great. It's ok.

Not sure if Mound City worth keeping. Maybe since it can share a farm.

202 gold, -10gpt@0 science.
Total expenses up 7 from 68 to 75.
7 cottages, ditto hamlets, 1 village built.

Will remain on this turn for now. Thoughts?

 

[soundjata]

Mound city has forests. I would keep it.
Then heal a little bit and send enough troop for Chaco Canyon > Poverty point I think.

 

[sampsa]

Consider pillaging mines or even cottages when your units have nothing better to do. You need some kind of "economy".

I think you are approaching the point when you need to decide whether you are trying to win the game with HA-stomp or if you are chilling after SB. I'm sure @soundjata :s suggestion of just going HAs is sound, but you can't afford to make a lot of mistakes.

 

[M60A3TTS]

Mound city has forests. I would keep it.
Then heal a little bit and send enough troop for Chaco Canyon > Poverty point I think.

ok, so another rather costly battle, with 4 HAs lost and 1 withdraw with odds of:

Withdraw 32.9
Loss 32.6, 36.5, 86.2 and 87.4
Win 71.9, 99.9
Battle coming up is >99.9

We keep this city too? It has a pig resource, and is on the road to Mesa Verde. It's also 9 from the capital and will add some distance from palace maintenance to be sure. But we will pick up more gold in a moment either way.
We are at 169 gold, -10gpt@ 0 science.

 

[sampsa]

We keep this city too? It has a pig resource, and is on the road to Mesa Verde. It's also 9 from the capital and will add some distance from palace maintenance to be sure.

As a rule, never take something you can't keep. It wouldn't make much sense to lose ~200 to gain some conquest gold. Size 5 city with a -resource is very valuable.

edit: save?

 

[M60A3TTS]

Consider pillaging mines or even cottages when your units have nothing better to do. You need some kind of "economy".

I think you are approaching the point when you need to decide whether you are trying to win the game with HA-stomp or if you are chilling after SB. I'm sure @soundjata :s suggestion of just going HAs is sound, but you can't afford to make a lot of mistakes.

I agree wholeheartedly that an economy is needed. We are financially under water with a negative cash flow and when there are a lack of AI cities to take with their gold, this carousel I fear is coming to a screeching halt. But until then, I need to rely on the collectively sage advice of others.

 

[M60A3TTS]

As a rule, never take something you can't keep. It wouldn't make much sense to lose ~200 to gain some conquest gold. Size 5 city with a -resource is very valuable.

edit: save?

Surely.

 

[sampsa]

I agree wholeheartedly that an economy is needed. We are financially under water with a negative cash flow and when there are a lack of AI cities to take with their gold, this carousel I fear is coming to a screeching halt. But until then, I need to rely on the collectively sage advice of others.

Yes. The point is to just keep conquering as fast as possible, letting conquest and pillage fund the wars.

 

[Fippy]

I think the former Giggles land could use some more workers moving over.
Cottages not on rivers are rather low priority for this kind of game.
Strange stable build

Bit of an archer overkill there as well, they could be useful elsewhere to guard captured cities.
Chariot could move out and scout Shaka, finding other AIs would also be good..you have only 1 foreign traderoute.
Not sure if settling the double jungle gems spot would be good right now, but they are tempting.