armstrong
Prince
Okay, here's my game. Now time to look at everyone else's! 
Spoiler Notes :
P666-02 Fix Another Trash Game
- Thread starter Cam_H
- Start date
armstrong said:There's no need to grab Agriculture.
Excuse me while I
... again.armstrong said:
But is a 5F1P tile better than 2 x 3F2C + 1 X
?armstrong said:
All up ... a lot of interesting submissions ... is a Monarchy rush better than a Theology rush ... or a Metal Casting rush ... or a Code of Laws rush ... or a Literacy rush ... or 'lorks a Lordy' - no rush but a balanced game ...
Calavente ... could you count the votes for this round please?
Please PM Calavente your votes in the next two or three days;
- 3 votes for the most successful submission
- 2 votes for the second most successful submission
- 1 vote for the third most successful submission
I open the floor for discussion ... and in the meantime I have done my blurb on my game ... apologies for the delay.
i'll try to open the saves tomorrow or saturday, but i can't promise.
Looking at my own game, it doesn't look like a good candidate, so my non voting should not have any big influence on the result (no one in his right mind should vote for my game with only 2 cities, a smallish army, no wonder..., so it will not be selected because i didn't vote for another).
just one thing about agri or not before AH,
you will need agri or fishing for pottery later,
I know some of you grabbed fishing from a hut, but for those who didn't (like me!) it's better to research agri first then AH, it makes AH cheaper, so it's overall faster than AH, then wheel, then agri, then pottery+you won't have your worker fast enough anyway, so you may just as well research agri first.
Looking at my own game, it doesn't look like a good candidate, so my non voting should not have any big influence on the result (no one in his right mind should vote for my game with only 2 cities, a smallish army, no wonder..., so it will not be selected because i didn't vote for another).
just one thing about agri or not before AH,
you will need agri or fishing for pottery later,
I know some of you grabbed fishing from a hut, but for those who didn't (like me!) it's better to research agri first then AH, it makes AH cheaper, so it's overall faster than AH, then wheel, then agri, then pottery+you won't have your worker fast enough anyway, so you may just as well research agri first.
pigswill
fly (one day)
I chopped the Oracle; two chops I think. Never whipped the Oracle. Chopping depends on date and also number of wood tiles around. Date should not be a huge factor because if you decide to go for Oracle it makes sense to beeline.
VuDu,
In this instance I just did a straight build, with a focus on
tiles. I'm a little wary of chopping around Tenochtitlan given the 
bonus from the trees (although we do have an odd number) - The Oracle was a risky move that worked for me this time.
In this instance I just did a straight build, with a focus on
tiles. I'm a little wary of chopping around Tenochtitlan given the bonus from the trees (although we do have an odd number) - The Oracle was a risky move that worked for me this time.armstrong
Prince
VuDu said:
I put a single forest chop into the Oracle where I knew I was going to clear the forest at later. Even with two golds, I didn't try for a CS slingshot, grabbing the lower-hanging fruit of Metalcasting instead.
Normally, I probably would have whipped a population or two off to speed up things, but in this case I wanted to make sure I had enough population available in case I had to whip a quick jaguar or axeman to defend the city.
As for dates, I very loosely have the following "safe" dates in mind -- all of these can and do get beaten, though they're often much too conservative too, and a lot depends on the map settings/opponents/etc.
Prince: 1000
Monarch: 1300
Emperor: 1600
as with my game I will never even want to vote for me...
I will be here this WE so I can count the votes if needed.
(I will have to look in depth to all games... in order to not be influenced by other people votes. it will be interesting.)
Lets determine the one the will have the honor to be played for the next game.
I am currently counting 7 submissions/saves :
armstrong,
cabert
pigswill
mice
vudu
cam_h
me
is s/o missing?
I will be here this WE so I can count the votes if needed.
(I will have to look in depth to all games... in order to not be influenced by other people votes. it will be interesting.)
Lets determine the one the will have the honor to be played for the next game.
I am currently counting 7 submissions/saves :
armstrong,
cabert
pigswill
mice
vudu
cam_h
me
is s/o missing?
pigswill
fly (one day)
No, we started with seven. Advertising for a Noble Prince without success.
armstrong
Prince
mice said:
Well, to win a space race quickly the main thing you need is really fast teching, which means lots of cottages. Generally 2-3 production cities can build all the parts, so the key is lots of commerce. Rivers give +1C a tile; every 7 river tiles in a city is basically a free gold mine one you're working them all.
Cam_H said:But is a 5F1P tile better than 2 x 3F2C + 1 X
Well, it's not fair to compare a 5F1P tile to two tiles, especially since the pig tile would let you work a second one sooner.
As for religion, though, I mentioned I'm not a fan of founding religions in space races. Let me explain my reasoning.If you found a religion and build the shrine, it costs you not only the opportunity cost of founding the religion, but also a great person to construct the shrine. In a fast space race you're going to have tons of commerce cities that are making 80+ commerce/turn, so you could use the GP for an academy instead for 40+ beakers. Unless all of your religions are in the same city, every shrine not in your Wall Street city then needs to spread religion to at least 20 cities to be equal to the academy.
That's a huge amount of production - 1600 hammers, to be exact.
Here's a screenshot from my most recent space race victory. There are 7 cities making 80+ commerce a turn, and 8 more making 50+. It's a lot more straightforward to build an academy in one of those cities than worry about a shrine/missionaries/etc:
Btw, don't too much into this screen shot - I was just trying to show the distributions of commerce cities. There's a lot of
involved since it was a won game at this point. 
pigswill
fly (one day)
Regarding pig tile vs oasis; you can argue oasis has more commerce but pig hill and gold hill gives 5f/4p/5c vs 6f/4c for two oases(14 vs 10).
Regarding religion; I agree you don't need multiple shrines as much as you need multiple academies but one shrine with money multipliers and wall street will likely give you more gold than you'd get beakers from an academy though you do have to invest a lot of hammers in a money city. Its also worth considering religious civics- OR for building, theocracy for warfare and pacifism for GP production.
Regarding voting I've voted.
Regarding religion; I agree you don't need multiple shrines as much as you need multiple academies but one shrine with money multipliers and wall street will likely give you more gold than you'd get beakers from an academy though you do have to invest a lot of hammers in a money city. Its also worth considering religious civics- OR for building, theocracy for warfare and pacifism for GP production.
Regarding voting I've voted.
armstrong said:Well, it's not fair to compare a 5F1P tile to two tiles, especially since the pig tile would let you work a second one sooner.
I know it's not fair
. Eventually the Pig tile would be worked, after you produce your Worker. I guess we've got a start with a heap of Floodplains and Oasis tiles, and to me, while I don't dispute the value of Pigs in a Paddock, going out of your way to increase food production at the cost of Shrine income was a questionable (but not necessarily wrong!) strategy.Then again, it's not fair to suggest that founding a religion means that you're missing out on an Academy.
Thanks for your screenshot
. A lot of B.C. cities there!armstrong
Prince
pigswill said:
Right. I really appreciated having Hinduism to pop boundaries too. On the other hand, you can get religion from other civs, too, for religious civics, and don't have to worry about spreading your religion in order to keep your diplomatic bloc in line.
There's also the "hidden" benefit of Free Religion/Paganism -- trade routes with everyone, and culture from all religious sources. This makes these the Paganism/Free Religion the best civics for teching (except Pacifism in some cases.)
Cam_H said:I know it's not fair
Ah, I see what you're getting at now with the two tiles.
Cam_H said:
It is too fair!
It costs the same number of GPP to get a scientist and a prophet as it does to get two scientists. Of course, it is possible to end up with a prophet accidentally, especially if you build the Oracle, but you can avoid that. You can also usually grab Philosophy to found Taoism, which will give you a holy city while being on the path to Nationalism & Liberalism.Cam_H said:Thanks for your screenshot
Most of those are enemy cities that have been renamed to proper "Egyptian" names.
I'll send out my picks soon - I've evaluated the saves, but somehow was thinking that we were picking the "best" game, so it's back to take another look.
Edit: Bigger
We are voting for the best game...I've got the votes from
pigswill
Cam_H
mice
Me (it was a hard choice)
Armstrong : I have one vote from you (given by Cam_H).. is it still the good one after your edit of post 74 ?
VuDu and Cabert : we are waiting for your votes !!
It is true that you still have a full week-end to make your vote (until october 1st 23h59 ..but..
if you give them sooner, we will have more time to play the round.
pigswill
Cam_H
mice
Me (it was a hard choice)
Armstrong : I have one vote from you (given by Cam_H).. is it still the good one after your edit of post 74 ?
VuDu and Cabert : we are waiting for your votes !!
It is true that you still have a full week-end to make your vote (until october 1st 23h59 ..but..
if you give them sooner, we will have more time to play the round.
armstrong
Prince
Calavente said:
Whoops, yes, that is my correct vote. I needed to pay more attention to the vote-taking process...
HoHoHo !!guess what?
the winNNEEEeeeer is ...
..
c...
...
Ca...
...
Cal...
...
...ARMSTRONG !!!
yeah !!!
good play guy !!
you were plebiscited by an absolut record of 11 votes for you on a max total of 15 !!!
(only 7 voters, 1 abstention = 6votes; cannot vote for one-self : 5*3=15 max)
11/15 is IMO a very good score!!
WE gonna play Armstrong's game
And if I count correctly :
we are playing ending this round at 125AD.
We have until friday 6th, october to post our save for the "trash game selection"
Firstly, great game Armstrong - the result doesn't surprise me! Well done. High land area %ge, comparatively high raw score, high 'soldiers' rating, and Metal Casting 'to-boot'!
Secondly, no rest for the wicked! ... a bellyfull of 'Veuve Clicquot' ... and an iPod full of 'System of a Down' ... and "yee-ha!" Please find attached my 125AD attempt. No wonder I keep submitting 'middling' games! ... one last thing to do though at 125AD.
Secondly, no rest for the wicked!
... a bellyfull of 'Veuve Clicquot' ... and an iPod full of 'System of a Down' ... and "yee-ha!" Please find attached my 125AD attempt. No wonder I keep submitting 'middling' games! ... one last thing to do though at 125AD.Spoiler :
points required for our Great Scientist.Similar threads
