R:I. My personal spin-off

[TheBirdMan]

The war against Hungary ended with a victory. Mostly because the AI waited and waited instead of using their invaders for an attack. 20 attackers incl. 2 Rams against 10 defenders incl. 3 Rams (with a 25% defend-bonus (palisades)). I had reinforcements on-their-way as I did spot the enemy some turns before the war was declared - but still.....

Spoiler 1st battle - the attackers and the defenders :

 

[TheBirdMan]

As some might have read in another thread, I have added many of my own small "changes" to this mod. Not because I'm not satisfied with the mod, but as I wrote on page 1: More-wants-more.

So my maps will - after a few hundred turns - have large savannas, forests and jungles. The spread-factors I'm using can be seen on page 1. As a counterbalance to this, I always have large areas of desert, tundra, and snow. Areas the vegetation cannot spread to.

Due to all this "green stuff", Recon-units are really valueable in my games. I admit it did take many months for me to "acknowledge" this - but as I could see the AI using those units much as soon as the skirmishers appeared on the stage, I finally did the same.........

So here is my "new" favourite:

 

[TheBirdMan]

Above unit and chariots were exactly the units I used to break down the Hungarian army.

Chariots for soften the fortified attackers (hilltop, forests) and skirmishers to kill them. Took some time/turns as I lost 75-80% of the chariots each time I attacked (had to train new and bring them to the front) - while I only lost a few skirmishers. Skirmishers, that gradually became more "experienced" and thus stronger.

 

[TheBirdMan]

And below the battle to secure my southern border and the way to peace:

Spoiler The final battle :

First the Hungarian defenders and my attackers before the battle

City taken. I used all my 6 chariots to soften the defense. In addition, 3 of my ax-men had to travel to Valhalla.

The last Hungarian troops defeatet.

And finally: Peace. At least for now.

Ohhh, did I forgot to write, that using 2 GreatGenerals for promotion of skirmishers makes them kind of "Elite-troops" and thus much more valueable in a battle (see 3rd sreenshot above)???

 

[TheBirdMan]

Let me start the day with a little recap of yesterday's final battles.

Apparently Poland thought that the city I took over from Hungary was theirs. It probably was too - but then they should have kept it.

Instead, they send an "army" of just 4 units - good enough with a significant reserve on the way - but still. Probably the most stupid act I've seen from an AI in a very long time.

They (Poland) lost another small town on that.

Spoiler An easy war :

 

[TheBirdMan]

As you can see below (if you open the spoiler) - you can't do much without ressources.

Spoiler My World Wonders :

 

[Hafenguy]

Hi
I really like the idea of extending the value chain of resources a bit.

Is there any way to implement some features of the advanced diplomacy 2 mod as well?

 

[TheBirdMan]

Hi
I really like the idea of extending the value chain of resources a bit.

Oh, thanks. Admit, I havn't updated much the last months - it seemed to me, that nobody read it anyway......

Is there any way to implement some features of the advanced diplomacy 2 mod as well?

I can only "handle" the most basic XML, so I don't know if I can - but where can I read about this mod? However if you know how to do it - implement all or part of this into my mod - then I'm ready to share anything from my mod with you. Directly by E-mail or via this site. Just ask.


Right now I have played 1667 turns (game is at year 1402, era Rennaissance, next science physics) with only 1 error, that could have been serious - but fortunately it was managed in the first attempt. In addition there has been a small number of CTD due to memory issues - that's perfectly normal, my 'puter isn't brand new anymore.....

Next steps are to make/fix "a number" of smaller changes, a few errors and try a few "new" ideas for the eras upto and including renaissance. After that it's the Industrial era I'm going to take a very close look at. I'm "restarting" my game tomorrow or the day after with a new nation (that's the best thing by making a game to a scenario - you can reuse the map and still play a game very different from the other one you just ended).

 

[TheBirdMan]

Where-ever I find them, I'm deleting or changing terrain (back) from hills to flatland for Oasis and Scrubs on my "Mastermap" to avoid "floating" features (see this: https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/floating-r-i-improvement-and-features.689343/ ).


Now game restarted with another nation.

 

[TheBirdMan]

Ohh well. Had to restart - could just as well do it now than later. Playing this nation on this specific map was doomed to end fast anyway. Just as it had ended early for the Amharic/'Etiopian tribe all the other times I have played this map. Bad starting position and too many agressive neighbors. That's too much for even this nation, even given a very good leader (not me but Haile Selassie). And as I also had some changes for the WorldWonders (use of resources), the decision wasn't difficult to take.


So I have changed the starting position and relocated a few bonus - not given more and/or different/"better", just relocated in the neighborhood. And most important, I have changed the location of a small belt so that there are now "only" 3 of the 5 other nations that have direct land access. The other 2 need to cross some water first before they can be a real threat (again).....

 

[TheBirdMan]

And the 3 early Wonders as they are now:

Spoiler Great Bath of Mohenjo-Daro, Moai Statues and Stonehenge/Sphinx. :

 

[TheBirdMan]

Now that is surely a much better starting position for the Amharic/'Etiopian tribe - now and in the future. A "limited core" for sure with place for only 8-9 cities before you are out of space.

However that's probably not a problem since you will find yourself in a war against the Arabs/Palmyrene Empire long time before you actual control this, your natural "homeland".

My first war here against this "dear" neighbor ended with a draw. They attacked me, but wasn't able to take my city (the one to the east). This was the situation for quite some turns. Then the Arabs was attacked in their back and I got a relative cheap peace (50 gold only)......


Later I made my revenge. While the Arabs was at war with 3 other of their former best friends, I declared on them (the Arabs, not their enemies). I had sight on 2 of their cities and noticed, that the defense there was close to nothing......., so why hesitate?

 

[TheBirdMan]

Below is sub-info to my answer in our mainthread here https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/realism-invictus.411799/page-520#post-16603781 , dated Maj 12, 2024, page 520

You can't build a citywall unless you - somewhere - have both a Carpenter + a PrimeTimber and a Stonecutter + a Limestone. A Carpenter makes 3 NavalSupplies (read logs, boards, planks - what-ever needed in wood - from 1 PrimeTimber. A Stonecutter makes 4 masonry from 1 Limestone.

To wall-in your 4th city you need a 2nd Carpenter and a 2nd PrimeTimber. To wall in your 5th city you also need a 2nd Stonecutter + his Limestone.

Spoiler Resource map for the Viking startingposition, Screenshot from WorldBuilder and pre-req for citywalls :

 

[TheBirdMan]

My 2-front war is over now.

First a trip to the Northwest.

Spoiler Last days of my Arabian War :

And the end of the Arabian Republic:

So far so good. Now I'm only at war in SouthEast. But for how long? More than 4 times I have joined Scandinavia in their wars against Germany and Arabia. Just to keep up the good relationship (remember my army is about half-the-size of theirs and have been so since I do not remember when). Now this "easy fix" is gone as I killed Arabia and Scandinavia is close to kill Germany. If i'm asked to join (again) against Germany I will of course do my duty - even if I can't do anything "useful" from or to in this matter.

As I see it, it is just a matter of time before I'm in deep-deep-deep-deep trouble. Right now I'm only in deep-deep trouble (see next post).

 

[TheBirdMan]

Then a trip to the Southeast.


I'm at war with the Sassanid Empire (Persian) for the 4th time.

1st time I was taken by surprise and lost the city Bati you just can see up to the north. 2nd time I manage to hold my stand in the area 3-4 tiles to the northwest of my (newly builded) Fort. 3rd war took somewhat time - they tried first with a relative massive invasion over the sea, followed by one over land. Then one more time from the sea (smaller than 1 attempt - but still a try). Then a rather big army over land. I guess I could have won this battle too, but it was not needed as they suddenly asked for peace for a small "fee" (only 500 gold as far as I remember). I accepted as I was uncertain if I could win or if I would loose. Next turn the reason showed up. Seems like the Persians ally - the Turks - had called on them to help killing the Greeks. Which they did.

I used the pause in this corner to build my Fort at the best place I could find and train enough troops to hold this spot before the next "visit" from the East (see spoiler) while I still was in a hot war against the Arabs (the ratio when that war started last time was 1 vs. 1.3 in my favour).

Spoiler An important Hotspot :

As you can see, I'm well fortified here. This screenshot is after the Persians 2nd big attack. Here they have lost more than 80 units in total.

Comming my way right now - how to deal with this?

Spoiler Bigger trouble ahead :

My defenders

Those are dead - they just do not know it yet.

But here comes a problem

As I wrote in the Spoiler. The Persians isn't a problem. But the Turks are. We are not at war right now, so if I do not do anything, the Turks can pass my fort. If I allow that, I know what will happend next. I'm sure most reading this also will know.

But if I declare war against the Turk to prevent them from passing my Fort - then my "dear" friends in the North - who actually do not like that much - will give me a big "-" (minus) in my GradeBook. That will probably lead to a war between us as soon as the Northerners are "done" with the Germans. It actually looks somewhat "black" to little me.

 

[globosud]

I see you use the fort outside the cultural boundary, in R.I. 3.6, the fort should not give any defense or attack bonuses. Have you made any changes to the mechanics of the fort that it also gives a bonus outside your territories?

 

[TheBirdMan]

I see you use the fort outside the cultural boundary, in R.I. 3.6, the fort should not give any defense or attack bonuses. Have you made any changes to the mechanics of the fort that it also gives a bonus outside your territories?

I'm pretty sure it does - but I'm not in an eagle to translate all code into what actually happens in detail. The only difference in the code between the original and my version for the <ImprovementInfo> <Type>IMPROVEMENT_FORT</Type> is this:

Original: <bActsAsCity>1</bActsAsCity>
My change: <bActsAsCity>0</bActsAsCity>

I made this change mostly because I don't want ships to use forts as a kind of harbor/canal as they normally does. Nor do I want airplanes to use forts as an airfield. Specially not when those forts are placed on a hilltop, But I did it also to "force" the AI to use the correct improvement, when they claimed access to any bonus outside the citylimits. As it is in the original version, they use forts. But I know - by trying - that they are able to use the correct improvement - even on flatland - when they are "forced" to it.


In the screenshots below you can see the differences for units fortified on a hilltop with a fort outside cultural border and for a unit fortified on a "normal" tile also outside cultural border........

Spoiler Defensevalue of forts outside cultural borders :

As you can see for this unit, "we" have 2 forts on the stats for this Levy. That fits very well with the 2 sciences I have (Fortification with a fort and Military Engineering).

Here you see the stats for a unit "just" fortified - but still outside cultural borders. No fort-bonus are available here.

Taking above into consideration together with what I actually have seen so far when the Persians attacked me (only a very few units lost while the Persians lost +80 in their attacks) - then YES. The forts do work outside cultural borders. I can also conclude (now) that the default extra defense a fort gives (50%) is too high since the AI isn't able to prioritize a fort as a very important target for a spy.

But perhaps it is possible to add some more "power" to siege units, so that - when they "attack" as catapults fx. do or bombards as .... well bombards do -, then they do some damage to the fortified units. Collateral damage to a greater number of units - but with a low limit???? Or "something" else?!?!

Spoiler How do we deal with defenders in forts - maybe :

Below some codelines for the Bombard.

<iCollateralDamage>0</iCollateralDamage>
<iCollateralDamageLimit>0</iCollateralDamageLimit>
<iCollateralDamageMaxUnits>0</iCollateralDamageMaxUnits>

<FeatureAttacks/>

I'm sure the 3 lines for Collateral Damage can be used somehow - but what about the FeatureAttacks line?!

I don't know - but maybe Walter have an opinion on what could be a - fairly reasonable - solution to this "problem".

 

[TheBirdMan]

I decided to declare war against the Turks while they were outside my border (so to say - I also "defended" some unclaimed tiles). Now time will show if that was wise or not.

Spoiler Screenshots from the battle :

And as you can see - forts works outside cultural borders - that's for sure. I did only lose few units in this long battle.

 

[globosud]

perhaps only the unit promotions are activated in the fort even outside the borders, but the fort itself does not give any bonus outside the cultural border
I posted a screenshot I just took

 

[TheBirdMan]

Memo for myself - and maybe input for others

Spoiler Info about Fort_Aid - where does it come from and what does it do :

Semms like if you have a fort outside your cultural borders this replaces the normal 50% extra defence, that a fort gives inside your cultural borders.


From CIV4ImprovementInfos.xlm - Improvement Fort.
<AidTypes>
<AidType>AID_FORT</AidType>
</AidTypes>


Which calls this:

From CIV4AidInfos.xml - Aidtype for Forts:
<AidInfo>
<Type>AID_FORT</Type>
<Description>TXT_KEY_AID_FORT</Description>
<AidStyleType>AIDSTYLE_FIXED</AidStyleType>
<bCoastalOnly>0</bCoastalOnly>
<iRange>1</iRange>
<SupersedesAidTypes/>
<Promotions>
<PromotionType>PROMOTION_AID_FORT1</PromotionType>
<PromotionType>PROMOTION_AID_FORT2</PromotionType>
<PromotionType>PROMOTION_AID_FORT3</PromotionType>
<PromotionType>PROMOTION_AID_FORT4</PromotionType>
</Promotions>
<Button>Art/Interface/Buttons/Promotions/Fort1.dds</Button>
</AidInfo>


From CIV4PromotionInfos.xlm - promotion PROMOTION_AID_FORT1 to PROMOTION_AID_FORT4

<bTemporary>1</bTemporary>

Kind of "tells" me, that this promotion only is active under certain circumstances (my guess is that the unit actually is placed - and maybe also fortified - on the same tile as the fort is to have this promotion active).

And below each of the single Fort_Aids (screenshots):

Above seems to give much-to-much extra defense to fortified units in a fort outside cultural borders. And what I do not quite understand are, how can a unit "use" withdrawal chances, no penalty for crossing rivers and extra first strikes since it dosn't attack - if it did, it would "leave" the tile that gave the fort-bonus..... wouldn't it?????

Question is:
Should some of the values be reduces and/or some of the unittypes removed
OR
Should early siege units somehow be added something like collateral damage?!?!?!

Don't know yet