RawSasquatch/Kramer's New Civilizations

[ubergeneral]

Why vermont? They were never independent, never made a move for independence and never rebelled.

 

[RawSasquatch]

Why vermont? They were never independent, never made a move for independence and never rebelled.

Nope, they were independent for about 14 years. A lot longer than California was, but I made a California civ nonetheless.

 

[Gyra Solune]

Ahahahah, well that looks pretty neat! Not quite as silly and gimmicky as what I'd conjectured but that's likely for the better.

 

[Scapegrace]

If you could get TP to make it again, there's actually a better symbol for the Civ hiding in their Great Seal:



The fourteen-branched pine is a really good symbol, and it was designed by Ira Allen - whom you might or might not know was the brother of your chosen leader. From the outset, Vermont wanted to be part of the United States - that much has been made clear. That's also why there's so many references made to the number fourteen in the livery, coinage, and mottoes of the Vermont Republic; Stella Quarta Decima, the name I used for the UA, is on the reverse of the coins they minted. Why? Because they wanted join the original Thirteen Colonies in the United States, and as anyone who's written House M.D. fanfic will tell you, Foreteen is Thirteen plus one.

That's a joke, btw. Don't find people who write House M.D. fanfiction and badger them about numbers. You may not escape with your mind intact. =]

Oh, also, the Apples thing will probably cause conflict with that Spice & Wolf Civ floating around. Sorreh.

 

[Scapegrace]

Sorry to DP, but, well...

I mentioned it jokingly in another thread, but I wouldn't mind seeing a New England civ. If I remember my American History correctly, prior to the war of 1812, New England wanted to secede from the US due to their not wanting to adhere to the US's trade embargoes with England. A quick Wikipedia search could probably tell me for certain, but who has time for all that toilsome typing and reading. I'd love to see someone's (Scapegrace's ) ideas for such a civ.

Ask and ye shall receive! =]

---

New England (Sir Edmund Andros)
Start Bias: Forest
UA: Appeal To Heaven
+1 Faith from Bonus and Strategic Resources. +2 Faith from Engineer Slots.
UU: Fluyt (replaces Frigate)
Weaker than the Frigate it replaces, but may be expended to Hurry Production.
UB: Textile Mill (replaces Windmill)
+2 Production. +10% Production bonus. 1 Great Engineer slot. 50% cheaper to buy with Gold and may also be bought with Faith. No terrain requirements.

---

So, obviously it's centred around faith, hammers, and going a little bit wide. Originalgrace is original! It's one of those Civs that does really well early-game, especially if you get a decent pantheon and hold onto it (Goddess of the Hunt or God of the Sea can work especially well, depending on your start), then keeps that advantage and uses Faith well into the lategame. Even after the nerf, Tradition is definitely the way to go with this one, because it allows you to pump out those Great Engineers lategame with the faith from your UA while simultaneously getting them via GPP.

Hope that's up to snuff! =]

 

[shaglio]

Sorry to DP, but, well...



Ask and ye shall receive! =]

---

New England (Sir Edmund Andros)
Start Bias: Forest
UA: Appeal To Heaven
+1 Faith from Bonus and Strategic Resources. +2 Faith from Engineer Slots.
UU: Fluyt (replaces Frigate)
Weaker than the Frigate it replaces, but may be expended to Hurry Production.
UB: Textile Mill (replaces Windmill)
+2 Production. +10% Production bonus. 1 Great Engineer slot. 50% cheaper to buy with Gold and may also be bought with Faith. No terrain requirements.

---

So, obviously it's centred around faith, hammers, and going a little bit wide. Originalgrace is original! It's one of those Civs that does really well early-game, especially if you get a decent pantheon and hold onto it (Goddess of the Hunt or God of the Sea can work especially well, depending on your start), then keeps that advantage and uses Faith well into the lategame. Even after the nerf, Tradition is definitely the way to go with this one, because it allows you to pump out those Great Engineers lategame with the faith from your UA while simultaneously getting them via GPP.

Hope that's up to snuff! =]

Awesome, thanks! Now if only I knew the least littlest thing about coding. . .

Also, did my memory of American History serve me correctly, or was I making that all up?

 

[Scapegrace]

No idea, didn't check. =]

 

[shaglio]

No idea, didn't check. =]

Aha, I do have somewhat of a memory!

From Wikipedia:

Spoiler :

Opposition to the War of 1812[edit]

When Madison was re-elected in 1812 the discontent in New England intensified. In late 1813 Madison signed a more restrictive embargo act than any of those approved by Jefferson, this time prohibiting all trade between American ports (the coastal trade) and fishing outside harbors.[3] By the summer of 1814, the war had turned against the Americans. After ending their war with Napoleonic France, Great Britain was able to marshal more resources to North America and had effectively blockaded the entire eastern coastline. Territory in the Maine district of Massachusetts was occupied in July, in August the White House and Capitol were burned, and by September the British were advancing further in Maine and the Lake Champlain area of New York. A naval assault on Boston was expected in the near future. Free trade with the rest of the world had virtually ceased, thousands were thrown out of work, and by August banks were suspending specie payment. The federal government was approaching bankruptcy.[4]

New England governors followed a policy of giving minimal support to the Federal government in waging the war. With the exception of Governor John Taylor Gilman of New Hampshire, most requisitions for state militia were denied. New Englanders were reluctant to have their militia, needed to defend their coasts from British attacks, assigned elsewhere or placed under the command of the regular army. General Winfield Scott, after the war, blamed Madison's policy of ignoring Federalists, who in New England constituted the best educated class, when granting regular army commissions in New England.[5]

The anti-war sentiment in Massachusetts was so strong that even Samuel Dexter, the Republican candidate for governor, opposed the national party's commerce policies. Federalists still dominated the 1814 elections, returning Caleb Strong as governor and electing 360 Federalists against only 156 Republicans to the lower house of the Massachusetts Legislature. In September Governor Strong refused a request to provide and support 5,000 troops to retake territory in Maine.[6]

Because Massachusetts and Connecticut had refused to subject their militia to the orders of the War Department, Madison declined to pay their expenses. Consequently, critics said that Madison had abandoned New England to the common enemy. The Massachusetts Legislature appropriated $1 million to support a state army of 10,000 men. Harrison Gray Otis, who inspired these measures, suggested that the Eastern States meet at a convention in Hartford, Connecticut. As early as 1804 some New England Federalists had discussed secession from the Union if the national government became too oppressive.[7]

In September 1814 Madison asked Congress for a conscription bill. Even though this had not been one of the original grievances that led to the call for the convention, Federalists presented this as further proof that the Republicans intended to bring military despotism into the nation. Thomas Grosvenor of New York saw this as the result of the administration leading the country "defenseless and naked, into that lake of blood she is yet swimming".[8]

 

[cairnsy44]

That's... a really, really interesting idea. You can basically get the Hanging Gardens of Babylon in your capital for the cost of a Settler and a terrible Tundra City, and you can do it lots because of how much the AI likes to expand. It's a great take on an OCC Civ. =]

Here's a slightly expanded version.

Vermont Republic (Thomas Chittenden)
Start Bias: Grassland
UA: Stella Quarta Decima
Selling Cities you founded to other Major Civilizations grants you the yields of all the tiles worked by that City and 25% of the Population in the Capital. Settlers have +1 Movement and ignore Terrain penalties.
UU: Green Mountain Boys (replaces Musketman)
+33% Combat Bonus when attacking fortified units and ignores Terrain penalties. If this unit reaches level 10, a Unique Unit from a Civilization not in the game or available from City-States spawns in the Capital.
UB: Constitution House (replaces Palace)
Standard Palace Slots. Contains an additional slot for a Great Work of Writing. +1 to all yields for each Great Work and Theming Bonus in the Empire (stacks with God-King).
---
Hopefully that's of use. Plus, hey, Palace replacement! Noice. =]

As a Vermonter, I would be obligated to play that civ!

 

[cairnsy44]

Well, uh, this is a little awkward. I was actually planning a Vermont civ in secret, but you guys have forced the cat out of the bag a little prematurely. I didn't have too strong of a design, though, so we can at least combine some of Scapegrace's wonderful ideas with this mess:

Vermont Republic (Ethan Allen)
Start Bias: Forest
UA: These Green Mountains
Forest tiles in your territory may spawn a unique Apple Bonus Resource. (Very high yields, think a stationary Sioux Buffalo.) Upon improving this a copy of this resource, it may be removed from the map and converted into a unique Luxury Resource (Cider, probably. I was also planning for a Maple resource alongside the Apple that could be improved into Syrup, but CL's Expansion Pack is going to have a Maple resource of its own).
UU: Green Mountain Boy (replaces Musketman)
Claims any Forts, Citadels, or neutral tiles it enters for 1 turn or as long as it remains on the tile. 20% Attacking bonus vs Fortified units.
UB: Tavern (replaces Stone Works)
Boosts local Happiness, and each source of Apple or Wheat worked by the city provides +1 Production and +1 Culture. City must have at least one of these resources improved nearby with a Plantation or Farm.

Two very different focuses, I see. I like the creativity of Scapegrace's design, but it seems like it would be veeery difficult for the AI to play. (And for the average Steam Workshop knuckle-dragger to play. And to code.) Given that the Old Constitution House IS a Tavern, it seems like we can sort of mash those two up a bit, though. Additionally, TPangolin already did a lovely icon for the civ a while back:

And I more-or-less finished Ethan Allen's scene (though his face is still a bit wonky).

Spoiler :

Nice job on the leaderscreen! Fort Ticonderoga, I presume? It sure looks like it.

 

[DonStamos]

omg that Vermont. Love it!

 

[ubergeneral]

This topic is turning into a united state alternative thread. While the ideas for vermont is interesting (very cool UA). I sort of want to discuss other possible civs from around the world

I have two in mind I would want to see

1. Spartacus Civ
this civ is so short lived it never happened. But it almost did! The slave revolt in rome is something of legends. It happened in a time when rome was on top of the world, and was nearly successful. Startacus intended to take his people and find a new home and if he wasn't betrayed he would have done it too

Leader is obviously spartacus, city list is the same as the Huns. Since in More civs the flavor is the enemies of Rome, this fits right in.

2. ISIS

ISIS isn't like a normal terrorist group, they seek to create a nation in the middle east. They have a sophisticated network, and infrastrcture. If anything it could be possible to make an arguement for their success, if it weren't for the atrocities they commit. Irag and Syria are joke nations. They are cookie cutter nations made my Britain after WW1 they lack any cohesive national identity or even a national hero. I feel ISIS would solve this by making a nation that has both those things.

I feel that under all the negative aspect are redeeming qualities, that if fostered, can make a successful nation, and an ISIS civ would explore those ascepts.

Don't like ISIS? The solution is Nukes!

 

[TPangolin]

 

[DonStamos]

That gif is awesome. What's it from?

 

[Natan35]

This topic is turning into a united state alternative thread. While the ideas for vermont is interesting (very cool UA). I sort of want to discuss other possible civs from around the world

I have two in mind I would want to see

1. Spartacus Civ
this civ is so short lived it never happened. But it almost did! The slave revolt in rome is something of legends. It happened in a time when rome was on top of the world, and was nearly successful. Startacus intended to take his people and find a new home and if he wasn't betrayed he would have done it too

Leader is obviously spartacus, city list is the same as the Huns. Since in More civs the flavor is the enemies of Rome, this fits right in.

2. ISIS

ISIS isn't like a normal terrorist group, they seek to create a nation in the middle east. They have a sophisticated network, and infrastrcture. If anything it could be possible to make an arguement for their success, if it weren't for the atrocities they commit. Irag and Syria are joke nations. They are cookie cutter nations made my Britain after WW1 they lack any cohesive national identity or even a national hero. I feel ISIS would solve this by making a nation that has both those things.

I feel that under all the negative aspect are redeeming qualities, that if fostered, can make a successful nation, and an ISIS civ would explore those ascepts.

Don't like ISIS? The solution is Nukes!

That gif is awesome. What's it from?

No,no,no, no, not AGAIN!
And israel is a nation. So what? Nobody is making it. Give up on ISIS as well.

 

[Hoop Thrower]

What do you mean? There's like 5 Israel civs already out there.

Oh, this conversation again...

I had suggested Angola Janga some time ago, though it seems it didn't catch as much interest, guess people really just like USA split civs more.

 

[COF]

Eh, Spartacus is a nice idea, but kinda hard to put in a game like Civ5.

 

[ubergeneral]

Wtf I never mentioned Isreal in my post. We are talking about isis that is something completely different.

 

[Natan35]

What do you mean? There's like 5 Israel civs already out there.

Oh, this conversation again...

I had suggested Angola Janga some time ago, though it seems it didn't catch as much interest, guess people really just like USA split civs more.

The only quality israel civ out there is Legui's one(no offence to other modders who made Israel civ).
And, maybe you should suggest it again...

@ubergeneral
A. Ask scapegrace. Or he will just tell you by himself.
B.i gave an example(they are only slightly different; not any nation\state is worthy of a civ)

 

[Scapegrace]

Natan, can we not do this here? I like this thread. Do not screw it up for me. Again.

The fact of it is, America has almost ideal conditions for short-lived nation-states because there were so many of them. Hell, it's only comparatively recently that people started saying "The United States" instead of "These United States"! There's also good written records and enough diversity of landscape and approach that you can get some really interesting ideas out of it - see the weird, amazing UA that Gyra cooked up for Vermont. You don't have a go at CL for focusing on First Nations and NA Civs, now do you? =]

Now, as to why ISIS's New Caliphate is a really stupid idea: you will draw everyone with an axe to grind out of the woodwork. They are killing indiscriminately in the name of a nebulously-defined supreme being. They particularly want me and mine dead. I'm trans though, so most religious groups want me and mine dead on general principle. Moreover, they are enforcing a retrograde and reactionary Islam that is entirely at odds with that noble faith's teachings and achievements. Compare their so-called caliphate to the Abbasids or Ummayads. The Ummayads ruled from the Holy Land to southern Spain. The Abbasids were colossal patrons of the arts and sciences. ISIS?

Thugs in a sandpit.