Rise of Mankind 2.8 Feedback and bug reports

strategyonly said:
Didnt know where else to put this, so here it is, the Megapack.

Where are all the Custom ArtStyles for those extra civs? ie: Apache, there are alot of units listed but no ArtStyles for them, etc?
Click to expand...
RoM full and Mega version have their civ specific unit artstyles in Modules\Custom Artstyles folder. I think I replaced Apache civ in the newest megapack with the one from Civ Gold 5 and in the process it lost its unit artstyle (wasn't the previous Apache version yours?).

By default RoM 2.8 comes with the following unit artstyles:

Ethnic styles:
Asian
African
European
Middle East
Native American
Meso American
South American

Civ specific (modular):
America (USA)
Arabia
Aztec
Babylon
Barbarian
Byzantium
Carthage
China
Dutch
Japan
Rome
Russia
Viking
 
zappara said:
RoM full and Mega version have their civ specific unit artstyles in Modules\Custom Artstyles folder. I think I replaced Apache civ in the newest megapack with the one from Civ Gold 5 and in the process it lost its unit artstyle (wasn't the previous Apache version yours?).

By default RoM 2.8 comes with the following unit artstyles:

Ethnic styles:
Asian
African
European
Middle East
Native American
Meso American
South American

Civ specific (modular):
America (USA)
Arabia
Aztec
Babylon
Barbarian
Byzantium
Carthage
China
Dutch
Japan
Rome
Russia
Viking
Click to expand...


OK then whats the deal with this MLF "stuff"? I have tried now for 2 hours just to get the Civ Apache into the regular RoM version, to NO success, i thought it was as easy as just placing it from the Mega pack to RoM, and of course placing a 1 in the appropriate spot in Custom Civilizations, but NOOOOO. Why is MLF 9 times harder to do stuff.:crazyeye:

EDIT: I just looked at two different MLF's?? Both are the 1st in MLF's, under modules.

one is: Modules_RoM, and with AND its: Modules_Main_1, HUH?
 
strategyonly said:
OK then whats the deal with this MLF "stuff"? I have tried now for 2 hours just to get the Civ Apache into the regular RoM version, to NO success, i thought it was as easy as just placing it from the Mega pack to RoM, and of course placing a 1 in the appropriate spot in Custom Civilizations, but NOOOOO. Why is MLF 9 times harder to do stuff.:crazyeye:

EDIT: I just looked at two different MLF's?? Both are the 1st in MLF's, under modules.

one is: Modules_RoM, and with AND its: Modules_Main_1, HUH?
Click to expand...

Just to get obvious out of the way, did you put in Megacivpack's FPKs into your Asserts folder?
 
os79 said:
Just to get obvious out of the way, did you put in Megacivpack's FPKs into your Asserts folder?
Click to expand...

No i just extracted the FPK and took it out from there, but i think i might have found another problem that MIGHT have caused the problem, i dont have time right now to look at it, cause i am going to The Cities, in 15 minutes.

It was BuildingSupplies, that was causing the crash error. Now i just need to find out later.:confused:
 
JAZBONE said:
Following up on my postings of 11/14 (#315), 11/22 (#403) and 11/28 (#479), there seems to be a bug associated with the Mass Media tech. In the game I am currently playing, I get a CTD within one or two turns after achieving this tech, the crashes occurring as I select a new project in a city window. Crashes do not seem to depend on the particular building or wonder selected to build. After each crash I backtrack and select a different tech to research. The game proceeds normally until I select & achieve the Mass Media tech and again get a CTD one oe two turns later. Anyone have an idea as to what is going on?
Click to expand...


I have the same issue - the game crashes as soon as I research the mass media and go to the city screen to build something :sad:
I had that on 3 different games and unfortunately it still crashes after reinstall.

EDIT: I tired also on 2.81 but this still doesn't help.
 
Adde said:
Press CTRL-ALT-O and in the bottom left you will see two options called "PreChop Forests" and "PreChop Improvements".
Click to expand...
I understand the strategic benefit of prechopping forests. When would you want to prechop improvements?
 
I just got to combustion and it crashes about every 3-4 turns, So is it just logs that need to be posted?
 
I enjoyed this mod and won't go into detail about the things i like in it because this would be an extensive post but i'll rather just say i appreciate the work put into this project a lot.

Anyways since there is always room for improvement let me add some remarks about my experience with this build.

For reference, my comments are based on the following settings:
speed: epic/normal
mapsize: small/standard
difficulty: emperor/immortal/deity
maptype: pangea/custom_continents
revolution mod: on/off
archer range bombardment: on/off
tech diffusion: on
barbarian civ mod: on
i didn't play beyond AD500 in most cases

Techtree

In all of my games 'Ceremonial Burial' seemed to be favored as a starting research by the AI. Further research by the AI was focusing on the bottom half of the tech tree. Higher priority on economic techs might increase the AI's performance over all. Especially in the early stages of the game.

Since people seem to play RoM on higher difficulty settings in general givinig more starting units to AI an AI research that leans more towards economy should not influence rushability too much. Furthermore slavery civic is not as strong as well making rushes a little harder to pull. So it might be better to shift the AI research a bit.

'Feudalism' tech is a little too important for my taste. It has a lot of requirements and is necessary for basically everything beyond in the tech tree. This might limit the possible strategies. So it might to be better to reduce requirements or enabled techs a little. Don't lead the player by the nose and force feudalism that much :crazyeye:
Furthermore i tended to arrive at 'Machinery' early quite often because of the AI's research pattern and the dire need to be able to build lumbermills. Crossbowmen(enabled be machinery) are already strong in comparison to Longbows. Early availability makes the even more worthy. Adding a historical argument, the crossbows we think about were not available before 12th-14th cent. Those had a high efficiency vs. armored melee units. That's were '+50% vs. melee'-bones comes from i guess :) This issue could be solved by removing the bonus vs. melee initially and moving it as an auto-improvement or promotion to a later tech; 'Engineering' would fit best. Maybe this can be done by forcing a "random"-upgrade event like towershields. This would avoid to implement a new unit - don't know if it's as easy to implement as i think. Or just go and increase machinery tech cost a lil.
Anyways, all of this is a result of the useless forest tiles that makes you want to get lumbermills. Jungle camps make jungle tiles worthy - too much forest is just a pain in the beginning. Relation between jungle and forest tiles feels very wrong to me. Read of other people complaining about his as well - needs a fix imho.

minor: Please change the name of the 'paved roads' city improvement. Very easy to confuse with.. eh, yes.. paved roads :crazyeye: And since we are at paved roads at the moment: What about -30% cost on paved roads while in slavery. Would fit pretty well and slavery could need a little edge again anyway.
very minor: The green color for early medieval techs is pretty much the same as the active research's green. Guess it's a BUG thing though.

Unit Balancing
Early mounted units suffer. Javelineer and spearman available without resource requirements. Marsh terrain slows down mounted units additionally. And then there is the absence of early chopping what makes the missing defense bonus for mounted units more important because there is more cover left to abuse and less mobility. Add archer bombardment to this and see mounted units suffer. I suggest to increase strenght/cost relation for all early mounted units. Would help to keep up with these nasty swordsmen which are already pretty valuable anyways.
Crusader unit feel overpowered to me. 15str on a crusader in comparison to 14str a mailed knight for example. Maybe :hammers:cost on units like teutonic knight should be slightly higher.

Large Cities/ +X% food bonus/ specialists
So cities seem to grow pretty large with all these percentage base food bonus buildings. No problem to hit 20 pop by 200BC. I didn't play any games till the modern ages but i'm pretty sure it's not going to be better later on:) I feel this is a result of the extensive food bonus. I suggest to split the buildings bonus to a fixed +1:food: and a lower percentage increase in exchange. This would favor small towns and put a little cap on the megacities which are nice to have ofc - but i feel they grow out of control. Might correlate to the cap on world wonders/city btw. I can see why the cap might be necessary, yet i dislike it pretty much. Maybe it wouldn't be as much a problem if the +x% food bonus was less.

And then there are the specialists. Their 'costs' got increased by 50% - 3:food: per pop instead of 2:food:. Additionally, tiles give more food/hammers/gold then in vanilla therefor discouraging use of specialists and work tiles instead. Furthermore no more +3:science: civic. And as icing: Hefty penalty% on GPP by early civics - *swallow*. That's too much, seriously. Thing about specialists is that, as you know, they can balance out starting positions. No juicy river available - go for 2 food resources and some specialists instead. Without the specialist possiblity starting position is very important and there is not much a possibility as in vanilla to adopt to more difficult surroundings. And that's what it's all about after all - being able to apply a wide variety of tactical approaches and making the right decisions. Please improve specialist economy.
But maybe i just miss out on something here? - Please comment on this part especially.

Speaking about river starts: 'Flood Plains/Plains' tile is overpowered anyway - there is a reason why this description makes no sense :mischief:

Revolutions
I don't like this option. I takes quite some time to figure how to manage because description is well - weak. Description on how civics influence the rating could be easier and more specific. Features like financial trouble and distance to palace should be explained. Strength of garrison does not matter - just numbers. I can't see the fun part in being forced to watch the AI play a bunch of rounds for me i.e. I want to play myself and i don't want to watch. And AI handles it badly from my perspective. It's hard to 'plan ahead' and focus on the right civics for an AI ofc. Don't worry about a rival civ with a high score - it's going to drown in civil war anyways. I could continue... I know that there are different opinions on revolution mod and i like the general idea - just keep it optional please, that's all i ask :)

Civics
Great work on the civic balance in general - hard to accomplish.
Just a few remarks anyways. Maybe -1:yuck: on slavery would be better than 2:yuck:. Penalty on GPP in divine church might be better at -25% then -50%. Free church is too strong and secular too weak for my taste. Marxist looks very weak but i didn't test it.

Resources
I didn't see much silk, ivory, tea and coffee in my games. I played 'only' on standard size maps and some of these resources are rare but coffee is not. Maybe one could tweak the mapscript a bit if this is a general perception.
The 2:yuck: on lead are a quite much. I was happy to gift it away as soon as i had trade routes with someone and 'poison' him instead. Maybe 1:yuck: would be better since there is not much use for lead anyways.

Minor descripton issues
Point out that cottages lose the +1:food: when developing.
Clarify that paved roads cost are decreased when improving from roads.
The Chapter House don't only prerequisite a christian monestary and state religion in the city but the state religion also has to be christianity.

Crashes
My games crashed when discouvering writing while a trade caravan was in enemy lands without open borders agreement. This was reproducable.

Again let me say that i really like the mod and tons of it components - yet some balancing and better description of some components would be great. Please feel free to comment on my suggestions and point my mistakes :)
 
there seems to be a bit of a problem with the unit art, only with the naval units. For example an american attack sub only shows the top of its mast hiding what is under water while an arabia sub shows all of the sub correctly.0did some tests and it appears to be completely civ specific with some fine some not. Any idea's
 
I'm having a problem where I'm getting stuck between turns (600AD) in my game on the Earth 18 civs map. I end the 600AD turn, and get part of the way through the cycle, but then it just never gets to the next turn. I can still scroll around the map or load a savegame, and the little globe is still spinning, but it just never advances beyond that.

Any ideas?
 
xian said:
I enjoyed this mod and won't go into detail about the things i like in it because this would be an extensive post but i'll rather just say i appreciate the work put into this project a lot.

Anyways since there is always room for improvement let me add some remarks about my experience with this build.

For reference, my comments are based on the following settings:
speed: epic/normal
mapsize: small/standard
difficulty: emperor/immortal/deity
maptype: pangea/custom_continents
revolution mod: on/off
archer range bombardment: on/off
tech diffusion: on
barbarian civ mod: on
i didn't play beyond AD500 in most cases

Techtree

In all of my games 'Ceremonial Burial' seemed to be favored as a starting research by the AI. Further research by the AI was focusing on the bottom half of the tech tree. Higher priority on economic techs might increase the AI's performance over all. Especially in the early stages of the game.

Since people seem to play RoM on higher difficulty settings in general givinig more starting units to AI an AI research that leans more towards economy should not influence rushability too much. Furthermore slavery civic is not as strong as well making rushes a little harder to pull. So it might be better to shift the AI research a bit.

'Feudalism' tech is a little too important for my taste. It has a lot of requirements and is necessary for basically everything beyond in the tech tree. This might limit the possible strategies. So it might to be better to reduce requirements or enabled techs a little. Don't lead the player by the nose and force feudalism that much :crazyeye:
Furthermore i tended to arrive at 'Machinery' early quite often because of the AI's research pattern and the dire need to be able to build lumbermills. Crossbowmen(enabled be machinery) are already strong in comparison to Longbows. Early availability makes the even more worthy. Adding a historical argument, the crossbows we think about were not available before 12th-14th cent. Those had a high efficiency vs. armored melee units. That's were '+50% vs. melee'-bones comes from i guess :) This issue could be solved by removing the bonus vs. melee initially and moving it as an auto-improvement or promotion to a later tech; 'Engineering' would fit best. Maybe this can be done by forcing a "random"-upgrade event like towershields. This would avoid to implement a new unit - don't know if it's as easy to implement as i think. Or just go and increase machinery tech cost a lil.
Anyways, all of this is a result of the useless forest tiles that makes you want to get lumbermills. Jungle camps make jungle tiles worthy - too much forest is just a pain in the beginning. Relation between jungle and forest tiles feels very wrong to me. Read of other people complaining about his as well - needs a fix imho.

minor: Please change the name of the 'paved roads' city improvement. Very easy to confuse with.. eh, yes.. paved roads :crazyeye: And since we are at paved roads at the moment: What about -30% cost on paved roads while in slavery. Would fit pretty well and slavery could need a little edge again anyway.
very minor: The green color for early medieval techs is pretty much the same as the active research's green. Guess it's a BUG thing though.

Unit Balancing
Early mounted units suffer. Javelineer and spearman available without resource requirements. Marsh terrain slows down mounted units additionally. And then there is the absence of early chopping what makes the missing defense bonus for mounted units more important because there is more cover left to abuse and less mobility. Add archer bombardment to this and see mounted units suffer. I suggest to increase strenght/cost relation for all early mounted units. Would help to keep up with these nasty swordsmen which are already pretty valuable anyways.
Crusader unit feel overpowered to me. 15str on a crusader in comparison to 14str a mailed knight for example. Maybe :hammers:cost on units like teutonic knight should be slightly higher.

Large Cities/ +X% food bonus/ specialists
So cities seem to grow pretty large with all these percentage base food bonus buildings. No problem to hit 20 pop by 200BC. I didn't play any games till the modern ages but i'm pretty sure it's not going to be better later on:) I feel this is a result of the extensive food bonus. I suggest to split the buildings bonus to a fixed +1:food: and a lower percentage increase in exchange. This would favor small towns and put a little cap on the megacities which are nice to have ofc - but i feel they grow out of control. Might correlate to the cap on world wonders/city btw. I can see why the cap might be necessary, yet i dislike it pretty much. Maybe it wouldn't be as much a problem if the +x% food bonus was less.

And then there are the specialists. Their 'costs' got increased by 50% - 3:food: per pop instead of 2:food:. Additionally, tiles give more food/hammers/gold then in vanilla therefor discouraging use of specialists and work tiles instead. Furthermore no more +3:science: civic. And as icing: Hefty penalty% on GPP by early civics - *swallow*. That's too much, seriously. Thing about specialists is that, as you know, they can balance out starting positions. No juicy river available - go for 2 food resources and some specialists instead. Without the specialist possiblity starting position is very important and there is not much a possibility as in vanilla to adopt to more difficult surroundings. And that's what it's all about after all - being able to apply a wide variety of tactical approaches and making the right decisions. Please improve specialist economy.
But maybe i just miss out on something here? - Please comment on this part especially.

Speaking about river starts: 'Flood Plains/Plains' tile is overpowered anyway - there is a reason why this description makes no sense :mischief:

Revolutions
I don't like this option. I takes quite some time to figure how to manage because description is well - weak. Description on how civics influence the rating could be easier and more specific. Features like financial trouble and distance to palace should be explained. Strength of garrison does not matter - just numbers. I can't see the fun part in being forced to watch the AI play a bunch of rounds for me i.e. I want to play myself and i don't want to watch. And AI handles it badly from my perspective. It's hard to 'plan ahead' and focus on the right civics for an AI ofc. Don't worry about a rival civ with a high score - it's going to drown in civil war anyways. I could continue... I know that there are different opinions on revolution mod and i like the general idea - just keep it optional please, that's all i ask :)

Civics
Great work on the civic balance in general - hard to accomplish.
Just a few remarks anyways. Maybe -1:yuck: on slavery would be better than 2:yuck:. Penalty on GPP in divine church might be better at -25% then -50%. Free church is too strong and secular too weak for my taste. Marxist looks very weak but i didn't test it.

Resources
I didn't see much silk, ivory, tea and coffee in my games. I played 'only' on standard size maps and some of these resources are rare but coffee is not. Maybe one could tweak the mapscript a bit if this is a general perception.
The 2:yuck: on lead are a quite much. I was happy to gift it away as soon as i had trade routes with someone and 'poison' him instead. Maybe 1:yuck: would be better since there is not much use for lead anyways.

Minor descripton issues
Point out that cottages lose the +1:food: when developing.
Clarify that paved roads cost are decreased when improving from roads.
The Chapter House don't only prerequisite a christian monestary and state religion in the city but the state religion also has to be christianity.

Crashes
My games crashed when discouvering writing while a trade caravan was in enemy lands without open borders agreement. This was reproducable.

Again let me say that i really like the mod and tons of it components - yet some balancing and better description of some components would be great. Please feel free to comment on my suggestions and point my mistakes :)
Click to expand...

I suggest you try playing this modmod.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/forumdisplay.php?f=369

It has revised many things which is annoying you.

p.s. 한국분이신 듯 한데 반갑네요 :goodjob:
 
kaltruhe said:
한국분이신 듯 한데 반갑네요 :goodjob:
Click to expand...

예, 만나서 반갑습니다. My korean is still awful though.

I switched to AND last week but i keep away from the newest beta release - seems rather buggy. I enjoy playing more then beta-testing tbh :crazyeye:
 
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