SGOTM 08 - Smurkz

[ChrisShaffer]

Thanks for posting the map. I see that trade through the peninsula city would extend southeast across to stone island.

Would it be possible to capture both uMgu and the peninsula city on the same turn to start the war? That would divide Shaka's empire into three parts and give us trade routes to Joao.

How many of Shaka's cities are we going to keep? Will we raze any?

 

[Renata]

It would definitely be possible if things stay more or less as they are now; the defenses in those two towns are practically non-existent. The real question would be timing, and whether we could handle the SOD in Kwa with whatever units we'd have left over. (Purely from a defensive standpoint; there's no way we'd have enough units to begin with to manage an efficient attack.) The southern city would also be vulnerable to re-capture; we wouldn't be able to reinforce it.

 

[Niklas]

Alright, Smurkz, listen up! We're going to war, and we need to plan it. So here goes.

Time is on Shaka's side. The longer we wait, the more Shaka's many towns will win out over our production. We should attack at the first possible opportunity, to maximize our own current production lead. So let's attack next turn!

... nah, just kidding. I suggest we start the war on T127. We complete two units on the turn before, of which one will have time to reach the front, the other will bring up the rear. So at that point we will have at the front:
- 3 elephants
- 5 (7) axes
- 1 spear
- 6 (5) catapults

The numbers without parenthesis correspond to our current production plan. I'm assuming we steal the MP axe from Harapura, he's not needed there right now. The numbers in parenthesis are a suggestion I'm contemplating, allowing us to more quickly take out that SOD Shaka has in Kwa. We'd trade 2 catapults (100 h) for 3 axes (105 h) in Yo.

Could we take Shaka's SOD with this?

 

[ChrisShaffer]

Can you describe Shaka's SoD units and promotions? What promotions will our units have?

 

[Niklas]

The SOD is listed in Renata's log as 1 archer, 1 axe, 2 chariots and 4 impi. Apparently she forgot to note promotions though. Methos, could you send a unit over the border and take a shot?

 

[ChrisShaffer]

perhaps Renata should do it, since she inadvertantly moved a unit in the open file? Did we get an answer from admins about that?

 

[Niklas]

Umm, I should answer all the questions. Our axes will likely be C1, our cats will probably be CR1 or Barrage, and our Dumbos will be C1+Shock.

 

[Renata]

I just PM'd AlanH.

 

[Renata]

OK, I've been assured that a second upload on the same turn is fine, and have moved an axe and re-uploaded.

Save

Screenshot didn't take properly; the executive summary is:

C1 CR1 axe
Two C1 chariots
Four C2 mobility impis
One unpromoted archer

To answer an earlier question from Niklas, neither of the jungles E or SE of Kwa are currently being chopped.

And to more fully answer Chris's question about our forces, two of the five axes we might use were built before barracks and have no promotions available. All the rest of our units except the dumbo are 3/2; the dumbo is 5/2.

 

[ChrisShaffer]

Seems to me, assuming Shaka doesn't upgrade or add to his forces, that we should have enough to take and hold Kwa. I don't think we'll have much left to capture Mgu though, without a medic.

 

[AlanH]

This is why I hate opening the save ...

Alan, when you see this -- I just had it open now and right clicked on something, forgetting that I have right-click menus disabled. This wound up moving the active unit, a warrior that was loitering in Shaka's territory. I think the best thing for me to do would just be to re-upload the new save I made after the accidental move, and I just want to confirm that wouldn't give the system any fits, it being the second save from the same turn, and all.

No problem. When you uploaded the second save for the same turn it got a _02 suffix in tis file name, and became the team's latest save. So effectively, it replaced the earlier _01 save for the same turn. Hope that's clear?

 

[Renata]

Yep, it's all good. Thanks, Alan.

 

[Niklas]

We should eat his stack whole . I'm less and less inclined to spend valuable research on trying to get an edge on Shaka - we have the edge we need already with our Cats and Dumbos.

 

[r_rolo1]

I've been discussing in IM with Niklas about some serious things we need to do regarding the war:

-we should road the path to the Shaka iron city . That would put Shaka SoD on the cows after the Dow. In spite of the unfortunate pillage of the cows, that will ensure a SoD without defensive bonuses.

-We should have a C2 phant , that will not enter in battle with the SoD. His role will be to smash the archer garrison of the iron city and to fight any incoming chariot that comes to the rescue ( axes will take the impis )

-the attack order should be cats->axes->phants. The heavy impi percentage forces that.

-We should keep a axe in reverse to kill any marauding impi or chariot that tries to get our phants

-We should check if there is a coastal path from João land to ours via the icy south ( I think it is likely that it exists ) that does not imply to pass through Shaka lands. That would help the economy ( Niklas disagrees with me on this, because he thinks that it is more useful for us to push west and possibly find more ppl )

 

[Niklas]

I think rolo's ideas make a lot of sense, and I'm inclined to follow them. If we could smash that stack of Shaka's in the open, it would save a lot of lives among our troops. The temporary loss of our second cows is a small price in comparison.

I-We should keep a axe in reverse to kill any marauding impi or chariot that tries to get our phants

Just to clarify between phants and phants, this particular statement refers to our Ivory resource.

 

[ChrisShaffer]

I like the idea of luring the stack into the open with a road.

I agree with Niklas that it is more important to explore west with the woodsman than to clear a trade route in the south. We will capture the peninsula city relatively quickly, even if we don't do it at the start of the war. A southern trade route is not as important as meeting new friends. The woodsman and the galley should keep moving west.

 

[Renata]

I also like that idea, very much. Are you sure they'll all come out to play?

 

[Xcalibrator]

Since we're not guarding the gate east of uMgung, we should try to clear as much jungle as possible so the impis don't get defensive bonuses while we're trying to hunt them down.

How many units do we expect to lure into the open? Any chance Shaka would take the opportunity to post some axes outside Kwa in the jungle squares?

I have doubts about this ploy, but I'm here to learn. Seems to me we're giving up a chance to park a big stack on a nice defensive jungle square next to Kwa and safely pound it to rubble.

 

[Niklas]

Since we're planning a DoW in roughly 7 turns, there won't be that much time to clear any jungle. We need the time to road the jungle SE of Kwa, and clear the jungle E of the cows, as well as complete the cottage there. I agree it would have been nice to clear some more, but we'll have to take what we can get.

I would expect to lure some 6-8 units out. And what would Shaka gain by posting axes in the jungle squares? The AI simply isn't that clever, I've never ever seen it seek defensive ground for an upcoming fight. Also, the "worst" he could do would be to keep all the units in Kwa, then we'd have to root them out in full force.

I'm not completely convinced it will work either, only ~90% sure. But I hope we can get a WB testsave up. rolo is a bit busy so I'll see what I can do myself. Won't be tonight though.

 

[Xcalibrator]

the attack order should be cats->axes->phants. The heavy impi percentage forces that.

No, when in the field and if there are any mounted units (chariots, horse archers), the elephants should go first. Ballista elephants target mounties first and have a +50% bonus against them. After removing the chariots our cats will cause collateral damage among a higher percentage of the remaining units (instead of wasting the effect on the chariot units). All that will be left are melee units and our axes will tear those apart. (I'm assuming Shaka won't send out his archers.)