[BTS] SGOTM 24 Pre-game Discussion - Sitting Bull

[AlanH]

Please use this thread to discuss or raise questions about the game rules before it starts.

Please don't speculate about your team strategies here. Wait until you have a private team thread - and you know which teams you are allocated to.

Caveat, everything is subject to change. So check the game maintenance thread when the game starts for official rules.

 

[kcd_swede]

Ummm... so the turn you change to Environmentalism is what starts the countdown, right? I mean, at that turn, your number of forest preserves is counted, and no further preserves you might make later will reduce the number of turns you (and the AI) need to run Enviro, Did I understand correctly?

 

[AlanH]

Correct.

 

[pigswill]

No vassals, no huts. What about random events?

 

[AlanH]

No random events. Added to the game details.

 

[WastinTime]

can Civs be DEAD?

If so, did they need to be running Env when killed?

 

[AlanH]

My reading of the rules is, once you and the world all switch to Environmentalism, they all have to remain in that civic until you win or they die.

 

[Zhary]

Ai could be dead. You won't get disqualified if you dont using un and another Ai change back their civic once you bribe/forced them into env as long as the total turns adds up.

 

[LowtherCastle]

Ai could be dead. You won't get disqualified if you dont using un and another Ai change back their civic once you bribe/forced them into env as long as the total turns adds up.

In other words, countdown begins when all players are running Env and is interrupted if and when any AI is flips out of it, right?

What if all AIs are dead before you revolt to Environmentalism?

 

[neilmeister]

What if all AIs are dead before you revolt to Environmentalism?

"you must force the rest of the world to run Enviromentalism for 100 turns! You may use carrot, whip or UN. It's up to you. Since 100 turns is an awfully long time there is an option to reduce that number to a minimum of 1 turn."

If you can convince an AI to run Environmentalism for at least 1 turn after they are dead, then hats off to you

 

[AlanH]

If all the ai are dead before you or they start Environmentalism then you've ended the game without meeting the requirement.

 

[WastinTime]

If all the ai are dead before you or they start Environmentalism then you've ended the game without meeting the requirement.

No, you still have to press 'end turn'. Then you win the game with 1 turn of Env.

 

[ChrisShaffer]

It's definitely inventive to kill all the AI, then revolt to Environmentalism in the same turn, and end the game. However, since Sitting Bull is not Spiritual, you would still be in anarchy, and wouldn't meet the criteria of spending a turn in Environmentalism.

tl;dr it won't work

 

[ChrisShaffer]

On what terrain is the settler standing? Looks like a grassland gem to me, but I can't tell for sure.

If it is grassland, then by my count there are 47 forests in the starting screenshot, which would yield 94 turns of relief if you put a forest preserve on every single one.

 

[Zhary]

I think we discuss the this Wednesday, next Wednesday problem here ie does the first turn counts as 0 or 1. To make some clear definitions:
Turn 0 is when the log says you change to the civic ie when you enter anarchy if I'm not remember things wrong. The turn you winning the game is the turn after the victory movie. So if you want to kill everyone and run 1 turn env yourself that is ok.

The settler stand on a jungle ph gems.

 

[ChrisShaffer]

Just to be completely clear about the "kill all the AI and run Environmentalism by yourself" scenario...

If we revolt into Environmentalism on turn 150, this is turn 0. Turn 151 would be 1 turn of Environmentalism, turn 152 would be 2 turns, etc. Correct?

If we are in a Golden Age when we revolt, and thus incur no anarchy, would turn 151 still be 1 turn or would turn 150 be 1 turn? If we are in anarchy on turns 150, 151, and 152, leaving anarchy on turn 153, would turn 151 still be 1 turn or would turn 153 be 1 turn? i.e. does anarchy have any effect on the counting of turns in Environmentalism?

 

[Zhary]

Good thing that you pointed out the anarchy problem Chris hadn't thought about that. To be clear: turn 0 is when you click change civic or the un resolution pass(one turn after the vote). If there is 0 or 1 turn of anarchy doesn't matter.

 

[ChrisShaffer]

Only two weeks left for signups, and we only have two teams so far?

 

[AlanH]

The clamour for the next game starts as soon as we end the previous one. But that doesn't seem to translate into actual participation. The game will not start with only nine players!

 

[LowtherCastle]

The clamour for the next game starts as soon as we end the previous one. But that doesn't seem to translate into actual participation. The game will not start with only nine players!

Interest in a particular SG is high at the beginning and then wanes if it drags on. Interest after a SG concludes is high, perhaps because people want to improve their performance, then wanes. Waiting for months for the next one to begin, especially when you're talking about a game that in itself is aging and losing players, is a recipe for failure.

One more thing, with all due respect to Zhary. Erkon's radiation game lost a number of players who had no intention of scrubbing 52 gazillion tiles. Remember that a key factor in designing CIV was lowering micromanagement. This one harkens back to that problem... (just sayin')