The Futility and Illogic of DUI Pot Laws

[Berzerker]

About 1/3 rd of the country has changed pot laws, largely for medicinal purposes. Accompanying most of these changes are attempts to establish a limit on THC in the blood akin to measuring the alcohol in drunk drivers. While Coloradans are currently relying on the cops to determine when a motorist is impaired, the legislature is trying to follow in the footsteps of other states by setting limits on THC.

Herein lies the catch: pot smokers are safer drivers than drinkers, they consistently show less impairment than the legal limit for drinking and driving. Various tests reveal pot smokers range from ~.03-.07 BAC depending on the dose, so how can they be considered more impaired than what's legal for alcohol users?

http://druglibrary.org/schaffer/misc/driving/driving.htm

This is from a '93 NHTSA paper

THC's effects on road-tracking after doses up to 300 g/kg never exceeded alcohol's at bacs of 0.08 g%; and, were in no way unusual compared to many medicinal drugs' (Robbe, 1994; Robbe and O'Hanlon, 1995; O'Hanlon et al., 1995). Yet, THC's effects differ qualitatively from many other drugs, especially alcohol. Evidence from the present and previous studies strongly suggests that alcohol encourages risky driving whereas THC encourages greater caution, at least in experiments. Another way THC seems to differ qualitatively from many other drugs is that the former's users seem better able to compensate for its adverse effects while driving under the influence.

from another study about culpability:

There was a clear relationship between alcohol and culpability. … In contrast, there was no significant increase in culpability for cannabinoids alone. While a relatively large number of injured drivers tested positive for cannabinoids, culpability rates were no higher than those for the drug free group. This is consistent with other findings.”

http://norml.org/library/item/marijuana-and-driving-a-review-of-the-scientific-evidence

 

[MobBoss]

What are you arguing for?

No pot DUI laws....or better ones?

And fwiw, less impairment =/= no impairment.

 

[~Corsair#01~]

I'm in favour of banning cars. SOLVED.

 

[Berzerker]

What are you arguing for?

No pot DUI laws....or better ones?

None, they're illogical given that a blood-alcohol level of .08 is legal and pot smokers apparently dont reach that level of impairment.

And fwiw, less impairment =/= no impairment.

The law doesn't require the absence of impairment, if it did all drivers would be in violation. The law allows "some" impairment, pot smokers fall within that legal range.

 

[civver_764]

Driving while high is not dangerous in my experience. I have the exact same control over my muscles as I do while sober. It even makes me more careful a lot times.

 

[Formaldehyde]

It does slow down your reaction times somewhat. So you have to be more alert to counter it. But other than that, being stoned while driving shouldn't be treated at all like a DUI crime as it is now.

The laws are really only on the books to give the authorities the ability to harass people they wish to do so, which is true with any of the still existing marijuana possession laws.

 

[El_Machinae]

In my region, the law has punishments for driving with a BAC of less than 0.08. I'm not very familiar with them, because they're outside of my experience.

 

[Berzerker]

http://www.iihs.org/laws/dui.aspx
http://www.totaldui.com/state-laws/default.aspx

they say its .08 in all 50 and DC

 

[Birdjaguar]

I'm pretty sure that adding pot smokers to the highways in greater numbers will not make the roads any safer.

 

[MobBoss]

None, they're illogical given that a blood-alcohol level of .08 is legal and pot smokers apparently dont reach that level of impairment.

Well, you might think they are illogical, but THC is still a drug that alters ones awareness and response. Sure, its different than alcohol, but that doesnt mean we should'nt have laws about Marijuana use and operation of vehicles.

The law doesn't require the absence of impairment, if it did all drivers would be in violation. The law allows "some" impairment, pot smokers fall within that legal range.

I'd say that depends on the state law, which varies state by state.

Driving while high is not dangerous in my experience. I have the exact same control over my muscles as I do while sober. It even makes me more careful a lot times.

Yeah, that sounds exactly how some people claim they drive better while drunk.

 

[Birdjaguar]

Yeah, that sounds exactly how some people claim they drive better while drunk.

It certainly does...

 

[Mr. Dictator]

I've had others make remarks concerning how much grace I brought to the art of driving after smoking at least two pots.

 

[MobBoss]

I've had others make remarks concerning how much grace I brought to the art of driving after smoking at least two pots.

Very convincing....

 

[Kaitzilla]

Bring on the self-driving cars! GPS and computers are getting pretty good.

The increasingly harsh DWI and DUI laws are killing fun in this country!
The robots can bring the party back.

But what will all the traffic cops do then?

 

[Formaldehyde]

Yeah, that sounds exactly how some people claim they drive better while drunk.

Only that has actually been proven to be false over and over again. Where is the proof regarding a substance you likely haven't even tried, and which has no commonality whatsoever with those who are drunk? That instead of making you far more aggressive and imbalanced, it actually makes you less aggressive, more cautious, and doesn't affect your balance at all?

Don't you think we would be deluged with ads from Mothers Against Pot Smoking claiming that their loved ones died from someone smoking pot and then driving?

Don't you think if smoking pot was all that debilitating that people in the states where it is now legal would be up in arms that their lives are now in grave danger merely by driving on the highways?

Wouldn't numerous talking heads be on Fox News decrying this grievous mistake by "liberals" that will cause in the deaths of tens of thousands of innocent people every year?

 

[King Kalmah]

I'm pretty sure that adding pot smokers to the highways in greater numbers will not make the roads any safer.

They've always been on the road...its just more people actually being open about it...

before people were worried someone would narc them out,but now it doesn't even matter...

 

[Skwink]

I'm not a big fan of anyone driving in an altered mental state.

 

[shadowplay]

Yeah, all those people hopped-up on coffee and SSRIs need to have their asses thrown in jail.

 

[King Kalmah]

Yeah, all those people hopped-up on coffee and SSRIs need to have their asses thrown in jail.

Don't forget energy drinks like Red Bull and Rockstar...

I needed that boost!

 

[Borachio]

I'm in favour of banning cars. SOLVED.

Yes, me too.

Did you know that Jains are supposed to walk everywhere they go? I was quite interested to learn this recently.

I think it would be a rather good idea - where possible. If everyone lived within walking distance of where they worked, shopped and played, would this help mitigate the worst effects of global warming? I think it might. And also improve people's quality of life.

Would it be possible? I don't see why not. In the great majority of cases.

Is it going to happen anytime soon? No. I very much doubt it.
------
But, on the subject of driving under the influence of marijuana: while alcohol tends to make you drive more aggressively with reckless abandon, marijuana is more likely to have you pulling over by the side of the road, quivering in fright.

I once knew someone who claimed to have driven while tripping. I don't believe he went more than 10 feet down his own drive, though. He may not actually have moved the car. Nor even got in it.