[1.0.9.9] Windows users, help please with Firaxis and crashes

[jwolf713]

You are sharing too few files to apply / check the rules: rule of law: say a war, make peace, or break an alliance. At first, I was also skeptical about it. But when I ran out of ideas and the standard methods did not work, I started to combine this principle. First one game, then another game that I got stuck in before, and so I hit 10 and finally stopped counting.
self-closing > game crush - game bug / crash and game end

I did declare an alliance and a surprise war on the same turn. With different Civs, of course. The crash still happened.

Finding the right combination of declaring war or concluding peace is not always that easy. If you have, for example: 3 players, the mathematical number of combinations can of course be calculated. Sometimes you miss the first time you declare war on your civilization. Or canceling which will crash the game in a few turns.
After that, I would recommend checking it, not in the turn when it crashes, but sometime earlier.

Hmm, At the moment I myself am working on solving the voting error problem in the world congress. But if you have the files, you can share what you have for one of these 'PACHACUTI' games / maps, which is a maximum of files. If I have time, I will experiment and maybe find something.

 

[Qwan]

@jwolf713 please read my posts thoroughly. And note that I do not post everything I try, as I try many things, but if it doesn't affect the crashing and I find something that does, I consider the former irrelevant.

If you have ideas of what might fix any of the cases I posted, first load the saved game yourself and see if it crashes for you. Then let me know which specific prior saves you want, to try out your ideas. I have ALL the autosaves for cases #1-#4. (Ditto anyone else who wants to try their ideas out.)

If you're working on something else for now, that's fine. I'm currently going forwards with case #1, seeing if I can get past turn 252. I've lost interest in finishing the other games. It was hard to let go when I initially got stuck, but after hundreds of turns in the case #1 game, I have.

 

[jwolf713]

@jwolf713 please read my posts thoroughly. And note that I do not post everything I try, as I try many things, but if it doesn't affect the crashing and I find something that does, I consider the former irrelevant.

If you have ideas of what might fix any of the cases I posted, first load the saved game yourself and see if it crashes for you. Then let me know which specific prior saves you want, to try out your ideas. I have ALL the autosaves for cases #1-#4. (Ditto anyone else who wants to try their ideas out.)

If you're working on something else for now, that's fine. I'm currently going forwards with case #1, seeing if I can get past turn 252. I've lost interest in finishing the other games. It was hard to let go when I initially got stuck, but after hundreds of turns in the case #1 game, I have.

I can make the same request for careful reading. But without picking on it, I have a question. In the previous post # case1 you write that you cannot go through turns180, and in this post that 252 turns in the file # case1. The spread is a bit large, you can end one alliance, make a new one, and perform a lot of other actions. Either you write about other games or you somehow got through those 72 rounds.

I tested files from the 'PACHACUTI' series and I also had a game crash, so I suggested a solution. Since you do not use mods, especially those that affect the save state, the proposed solution / method of searching for a bug seems to be the most appropriate. While it may not be the fastest, it does require patience in finding the right combination.

My problem is even more complex, unfortunately, but it is related to mods from the 'affects the save state' category, which cannot be excluded from an already started game. And I am also getting bored of it, looking for a solution to the problem of voting errors.

 

[Qwan]

I can make the same request for careful reading. But without picking on it, I have a question. In the previous post # case1 you write that you cannot go through turns180, and in this post that 252 turns in the file # case1.

Yes, initially I could not get past turn #180. But if you look at the 12th post in this thread, you'll see in detail the workaround I discovered.

And in the 18th post in this thread, where I reply to your initial post in this thread, I presented subsequent crashes of the same kind post turn #180, since you asked for an update.

 

[jwolf713]

Yes, initially I could not get past turn #180. But if you look at the 12th post in this thread, you'll see in detail the workaround I discovered.

And in the 18th post in this thread, where I reply to your initial post in this thread, I presented subsequent crashes of the same kind post turn #180, since you asked for an update.

In my opinion, this is a dead end, the method described in post 12. It reminds me of the combinations that I made by changing production in cities. For example, once I made tanks, other times ships or workers or some buildings, I bought units for gold, faith points, concluded various trade agreements, changed governors. When I skipped a turn or two, I was convinced that it was all over. And then it crashed anyway.
Using the method that I described with declaring war or making peace, etc., I have completed many games in which I got stuck early due to a game crash.

 

[jwolf713]

Case #1: Pachacuti 180 1190 ADe.Civ6Save (Feb 14, 2021)
Crashes when you take the next turn.

Also, if one starts with the autosave from turn 176 (or later), and simply do nothing, it will still crash when trying to get turn turn 181. (To do nothing, force the next turn with shift-return.) [This proves it's nothing I did leading up to turn 180 that caused the crash.]

1) I refused to make friends and then alliances with Canada / India / Germany - I chose 4 'goodbye' option
2) I have made peace with brazil
3) on turn 181, I have declared war to Frederick / + Canada (automatically)
4) on turn 182, I made alliances with Nubia and Scotland
5) passing turns 182 to 183 without any problems and 183 to 184 etc...
ps I started combinations from the auosave176 fiile and finished on the turn187.

 

[PiR]

All that investigation versus the fun of playing?

 

[jwolf713]

Case #2: Pachacuti 212_Crash_Eleanor2.Civ6Save (Feb 6, 2021)
Crashes when you take the next turn.

Also crashes when you take the next turn from Pachacuti 196 1350 ADe.Civ6Save.

BUT, it will NOT crash from turn 196 IFF you send 3 envoys to Armagh, thus wresting away suzerainty from Eleanor.
==> I'd think this would be rather helpful to Firaxis, as they could investigate why this small change would make a difference.
And yet, this workaround is temporary: after I got to turn 212, nothing I tried worked to avoid a crash.

Turn 196 - alliances: Canada economic expires 4 turns, USA military expires 4 turns, Nubia scientific expires 4 turns, England declared friendship expires in turn 29,
Turn 196 - Sending messengers to: Anshan +4, armagh +4, Hong Kong +3

Turn 201 - friendship: Canada, USA, Nubia, war Russia, Montezuma condemnation expires 6 turns, declared friendship with England,/ messengers anshan + 2, kabul + 1,
Turn 201 - alliances concluded: scientific - Nubia, economic USA, military - Canada,
Turn 202 - 2 messengers to Venice,/

Turn 206 - re-condemnation by the Aztecs, Turn 206 / 207 - a new era of gold - the choice: a steam heart
Turn 207 - world congress: cost of erecting buildings 50%, great works ..., 2 points of diplomatic victory, world exhibition
Turn 208 - 2 messengers to Venice +4, change cards and system to merchant
Turn 208 - St. Petersburg / Russia seizures
Turn 209 - resolution - military crisis against PACHACUTI / rejected by 3 to 3 votes
Turn 217 - uranium discovery / end of testing

Actions that could cause the game to crash: entering into an alliance with England, making peace with Russia and then another war or war with the Aztecs
ps: I made a regime change and chose other cards / in my opinion it was more beneficial at the moment for the development of the civilization

There is also probably an error in the government cards, in the economic cards section you have a 1 card from military inserted./ turn212

 

[jwolf713]

Case #3: Pachacuti 272 1802 AD-B4rail.Civ6Save (Jan 11, 2021)

Crashes going to turn 274 -- if on this turn 272 you railroad the Holy Site east-adjacent the Military Engineer that has yet to move. While originally I did things on turn 273, such doesn't matter, as you can simply shift-return to skip doing anything on turn 273. (And escape thru any AI dialogue.)

This crash actually generates an autosave for the next turn (274), but I never get control on that turn, and the autosave for that turn (274) will crash when trying to load it.

If you do not railroad on turn 272, but railroad a different tile with a different Military Engineer on turn 273 (e.g. the sheep pasture twice northeast of Kashamarka), it will still crash going to turn 274.

If you do not railroad any tile on turn 272 or 273, you CAN get to turn 274. But it will crash going to turn 275, even if you do nothing. Note that on this turn 274, the World Climate screen says "Next sea level change expected in 1 turns."

I tried doing many other things, but nothing else had any affect on the above.

Again, I think what I investigated to tightly bracket this crashing ought to help considerably in figuring out the problem.

For this case3 game, you should load some previous file and try one of the two(5) options:
1) declare war on one of the civilizations: a) Canada, b) England or c) Mongolia
2) maintain friendly relations or even form an alliance with Norway or USA
Of course, until you jump from 274 to 275.

Case #3: Pachacuti 272 1802 AD-B4rail.Civ6Save (Jan 11, 2021)

Crashes going to turn 274 -- if on this turn 272 you railroad the Holy Site east-adjacent the Military Engineer that has yet to move. While originally I did things on turn 273, such doesn't matter, as you can simply shift-return to skip doing anything on turn 273. (And escape thru any AI dialogue.)

This crash actually generates an autosave for the next turn (274), but I never get control on that turn, and the autosave for that turn (274) will crash when trying to load it.

If you do not railroad on turn 272, but railroad a different tile with a different Military Engineer on turn 273 (e.g. the sheep pasture twice northeast of Kashamarka), it will still crash going to turn 274.

If you do not railroad any tile on turn 272 or 273, you CAN get to turn 274. But it will crash going to turn 275, even if you do nothing. Note that on this turn 274, the World Climate screen says "Next sea level change expected in 1 turns."

I tried doing many other things, but nothing else had any affect on the above.

Again, I think what I investigated to tightly bracket this crashing ought to help considerably in figuring out the problem.

If we load the file from turn 272, you don't have alliances there, but you have binding friendships for about 30 turns. It is worth loading the old save file and refusing to make friends by selecting the option 4 'goodbye'. It is likely that the entry into friendly relations with one of these 3 countries (England / Canada / Mongolia) later generates problems. And then wait until the turn 274/275 and only then possibly take some friendly or hostile action against one of these 3 countries.

Of course, the possible friendship with these 3 countries should be approached carefully and certainly not with all three at once, so that you have as many open options as possible, including the possibility of declaring war at any time.

If relations with these three countries were not the problem, then the problem probably lies in the relations with Norway and the USA. At the moment, it is still analyzing the possibilities based on the file from turn272.

Unsatisfied but even improved relations with Egypt, opening the way for Egypt to offer the possibility of concluding the declared friendship. And then improved relations with Norway and the US, and their proposals did not.
The problem, in my opinion, is the blockades in the form of declared friendship with England, Canada and Mongolia.
My opinion should start from the earlier file and not be friends with these three countries or any of them.

There is also probably an error in the government cards, in the economic cards section you have a diplomacy card inserted.

 

[jwolf713]

Case #5: Frederick 134 CrashNextUnless.Civ6 Save (Oct 13, 2020)
Crashes when you take the next turn.

Will NOT crash if you sell India one (1) iron.

Unfortunately, I didn't finish this game, so I don't know if avoiding the crash was temporary. While I have correspondence that says it crashes from autosaves 131 onwards (using shift-return to skip any actions), I don't have any other saves from that game anymore.

I also have a question. On what basis did you choose that selling iron to India, or in another game, sending emissaries to the city state will prevent the game from crashing. Lucky luck, a tedious combination of performing various activities with units until you hit something?. If, instead of iron, we sell saltpetre to India, it will prevent the game from crashing.

As for the February update, I must disappoint you here. I had the game updated before I started testing the files you shared here, and I had exactly the same crash symptoms as you.

In general, there is no guarantee that the game will not crash again. Once I had a game in which I started from turn 105 and until turn 383 everything was fine. Then until turn 447, I had a notorious game every time I went from one turn to another, for example from 389 to 390 a game crash. Then by the end of the 629 turn everything was fine again.

 

[jwolf713]

As for the games 'PACHACUTI - case3 and 4' some previous files would be useful. It is best when you do not have active alliances or even declared friendships. Both of these states work like blockades, and in the situation you have in the game, the declaration of war cannot be tested.
Active / ongoing war, condemnation or, to some extent, hostility can also act as a blockade.

 

[jwolf713]

Case #3: Pachacuti 272 1802 AD-B4rail.Civ6Save (Jan 11, 2021)

Crashes going to turn 274 -- if on this turn 272 you railroad the Holy Site east-adjacent the Military Engineer that has yet to move. While originally I did things on turn 273, such doesn't matter, as you can simply shift-return to skip doing anything on turn 273. (And escape thru any AI dialogue.)

This crash actually generates an autosave for the next turn (274), but I never get control on that turn, and the autosave for that turn (274) will crash when trying to load it.

If you do not railroad on turn 272, but railroad a different tile with a different Military Engineer on turn 273 (e.g. the sheep pasture twice northeast of Kashamarka), it will still crash going to turn 274.

If you do not railroad any tile on turn 272 or 273, you CAN get to turn 274. But it will crash going to turn 275, even if you do nothing. Note that on this turn 274, the World Climate screen says "Next sea level change expected in 1 turns."

I tried doing many other things, but nothing else had any affect on the above.

Again, I think what I investigated to tightly bracket this crashing ought to help considerably in figuring out the problem.

hmm, I don't know if it's important, but I noticed that the game crashes as relations with Norway worsen. Depending on our moves in the game, it is when from friendly to hostile, or from hostility, Norway condemns us. Then we have a series of automatic AI moves / actions during which the game crashes.

Update: unfortunately, but even improving relations with Norway and Egypt to the level of: friendship, declared friendship or alliance does not solve the problem. Nor do those who were condemned by Hungary or the USA or by declaring war.
The problem that blocks further tests is the declared friendship with Canada, England and Mongolia.

 

[PiR]

Reproduced & submit to 2K: http://support.2k.com/hc/requests/8441723


FYI, I have already seen (and reproduced) other bug reports in this forum about a crash at a change of climate level, but never created the conditions for this myself.

23 emails and 27 days later: Firaxis agreed to transfer it to the devs.

Finally...

 

[jwolf713]

23 emails and 27 days later: Firaxis agreed to transfer it to the devs.

Finally...

Linking your report to 2k does not display it for other users anyway. Information is displayed that the page does not exist.

 

[PiR]

I know but if ever a dev comes here hopefully it can help them.

 

[Qwan]

Sorry @jwolf713 I just saw this (and your other posts) -- I had gotten so disheartened by NEVER being able to get to the end game that I suspended playing Civ. I only checked in because I finally got an unhelpful reply from Aspyr, and wanted to give them a link to this thread.

Anyways, in the game I sold 1 iron to India, I noticed that it crashed on India's turn, so I tried interacting with India to change what it did.

Likewise, on the game I sent envoys to a Armagh, I noticed it crashed on Eleanor's turn who had sovereignty over that city state, so by sending envoys, I was taking away sovereignty.

In both cases, I stopped trying things when I came up with One way to avoid the crash, feeling this should be sufficient for developers to see what is causing the crash. Clearly your research shows there are additional other ways to avoid the crashing.

Only later did I come up with the idea of trying the game in multiplayer hotseat to see what the particular AI was doing when it crashed on their turn.

@jwolf713 while you've shown that changing alliances and such will avoid some of the crashing I experienced, such is not a *satisfactory solution*, because it forces choices the player may not want. Also, I doubt such is a permanent fix, because as I posted, I was able to get to turn 252, i.e. 72 turns past the first crash, for case #1, before crashing became unavoidable -- whether I liberated a city or let it flip to an enemy, it would crash, and I couldn't raze it because I was allies with the original owner. And it's very frustrating to have to stop railroading merely to avoid crashing next turn -temporarily-.

Anyways, thanks for your research. It'd be nice if Firaxis and/or Aspyr paid attention to the work done in these forums.

And thanks so much @PiR for persisting with Firaxis to get them to believe there is a problem. (Actually, I think there is more than one, because I think the pollution/railroad crashing is different from the crashing on an AI's turn.)

Alas, I lost interest in trying to get further in case #1 after accepting the February update, which nerfed the Earth Goddess pantheon. I can understand why that was needed for [NFP] because of Preserves, but I was playing [GS], and it really hurt my playing the Incas.

I also have a question. On what basis did you choose that selling iron to India, or in another game, sending emissaries to the city state will prevent the game from crashing. Lucky luck, a tedious combination of performing various activities with units until you hit something?. If, instead of iron, we sell saltpetre to India, it will prevent the game from crashing.