(1-06a) Tradition Changes

[CrazyG]

This hopes to build on ideas from this thread:

[Sponsored] - (12) Proposal: Tradition Changes

Current Tradition: follow link to wiki Problem: Artistry and Tradition are stacked up, and have a few overlapping bonuses that make Tradition/Artistry a bit Too optimal for tall, safe, GP focused play W.R.T. tradition, it has 2 minor :c5goldenage: GA-related bonuses that are fairly small and...

forums.civfanatics.com

Proposed Changes:
Ceremony: Add +1 to Councils only (not Lodges or Herbalists)
Splendor: Remove 50 on GP expend
Splendor: Add +2 culture to Monuments only (not Baths or Gardens)
Majesty: +5 gold (currently +4, this give symmetry with Splendor's 5 food).
Finisher (credit to Pineappledan for these ideas):

• Remove +25%GA length modifier
• Add +1 to all GP Tile improvements
• Add +1 Working Range on Capital

Spoiler Reasoning :

This broadly wants to make tradition + artistry less synergistic, while also making it less snowbally with culture in general. The AI consistently does better with tradition than other options.
Tradition already does science better than progress in general. This limits its wide science and culture.

PS let me know if I've got the formatting right in the title.

 

[Recursive]

Submitting 6 minutes before the deadline, huh? Alright then.

Your formatting is fine except the letters start at a, so this would be proposal 12a - fixed.

 

[Recursive]

Sponsored.

Proposal Sponsors: Recursive.

(Sponsors have indicated that they are able and willing to perform the code changes required for this proposal if the community votes Aye on it. Other coders are free to sponsor this as well. A proposal without a sponsor will not advance to the Voting Phase.)

 

[balparmak]

So this is pretty much a nerf to Tradition? I always felt VP was biased towards wide, so nerfing Tradition feels off. But I don't have half your experience nor skill, so I'm anxious to see what others think

 

[Stalker0]

While there are some buffs, I would agree this is overall a nerf to Tradition.

If the logic is Tall + Tradition > Wide + Progress.....I cannot back that, that is just not my experience. Now if the argument is Wide + Tradition > Wide + Progress.....that's a more interesting debate but I generally haven't gotten that vibe from most people. I think I'd need to see some more evidence before I could back that claim.

 

[CrazyG]

While there are some buffs, I would agree this is overall a nerf to Tradition.

If the logic is Tall + Tradition > Wide + Progress.....I cannot back that, that is just not my experience. Now if the argument is Wide + Tradition > Wide + Progress.....that's a more interesting debate but I generally haven't gotten that vibe from most people. I think I'd need to see some more evidence before I could back that claim.

Just FYI you can basically playtest parts of this proposal. Currently you don't get any of the science to councils or culture to monuments etc and I think tradition still handles itself well.

This suggestion is stronger than the current version of tradition IMO. I'm actually enjoying the national wonder bug since it means that a non-tradition AI might actually be the world leader. I think everything is much more competitive in terms of culture.

 

[Stalker0]

Just FYI you can basically playtest parts of this proposal. Currently you don't get any of the science to councils or culture to monuments etc and I think tradition still handles itself well.

This suggestion is stronger than the current version of tradition IMO. I'm actually enjoying the national wonder bug since it means that a non-tradition AI might actually be the world leader. I think everything is much more competitive in terms of culture.

Your giving up 4 culture and 1 science in every city, and then removing all of the GAP bonuses. Yes the working range and the +1 prod for GPTIs is nice, but I severally doubt it makes up for the losses.

 

[CrazyG]

Your giving up 4 culture and 1 science in every city, and then removing all of the GAP bonuses. Yes the working range and the +1 prod for GPTIs is nice, but I severally doubt it makes up for the losses.

Sorry I wasn't clear. This is stronger than the current version of tradition because the current version of tradition is bugged. So you can playtest and compare science/culture totals, my proposal will give you 2 culture and 1 science more than what you'll currently get.

 

[Recursive]

Sorry I wasn't clear. This is stronger than the current version of tradition because the current version of tradition is bugged. So you can playtest and compare science/culture totals, my proposal will give you 2 culture and 1 science more than what you'll currently get.

We fixed the bug, new release coming soon.

 

[Recursive]

Timestamp post to arrange all the threads in a neat order.