2nd world alliances

[soujourner]

Has anyone had any luck with forming an alliance with other countries that are in the second tier of power?

 

[vmxa]

I doubt it would take luck, but I tend to not make alliances anyway. Mainly you just need a tech to offer them and they will nearly always go for it.

 

[soujourner]

The formation of alliances so that you can overcome a poor starting position in the world has disapponted me. The mutual protection agreements, from my experience, do not produce very much if anything at all in substance..

 

[Snarkhunter]

The formation of alliances so that you can overcome a poor starting position in the world has disapponted me. The mutual protection agreements, from my experience, do not produce very much if anything at all in substance..

I never MP any more & generally only form alliances to avoid/create dogpiles. 2nd tier states are useful for those purposes. I form more alliances with them than 1st tier.

kk

 

[da3dalus]

The mutual protection agreements, from my experience, do not produce very much if anything at all in substance..

I agree wholeheartedly. Short of giving me any security, MPPs usually just end up dragging me into a global conflict against my will.

The only time I use alliances is when I want to create a dogpile against someone else as Snarkhunter said. Sometimes I find them usefull to weaken rival states, by bringing evenly matched civs into conflict and draining their resources/diverting production.

Kinda limited usefullness on both fronts though.

 

[TheOverseer714]

How many times you give away a nice tech for an alliance and several turns later your "ally" makes peace with the enemy, then not long after, turns on you by allying with that enemy?

 

[timerover51]

How many times you give away a nice tech for an alliance and several turns later your "ally" makes peace with the enemy, then not long after, turns on you by allying with that enemy?

Since I have seen far too many comments precisely like yours, Overseer, I have a policy of never allying with any AI and assuming that all AI civilizations will declare war the instant that it appears advantageous. Like when I am tied up with a long-distance war with Greece, and Egypt decides to start planting colonies on top of mine.

 

[TheOverseer714]

They are all enemies, even when "gracious", even when you are giving them luxuries, tech, gold, and cities, they will backstab on a whim.

 

[soujourner]

very well put Overseer and they call it the world..

 

[Lord Emsworth]

How many times you give away a nice tech for an alliance and several turns later your "ally" makes peace with the enemy, then not long after, turns on you by allying with that enemy?

The trick is to not pay the AI with up front goods (and by absolutely no means with luxes or resources either), but instead to make two separate deals. In the first you pay with gpt for the alliance, and in the second you charge gpt (the very same probably ) for your tech*. That way you can be fairly certain that you receive the full payment for your tech. And if your ally decides to bail out of the alliance it is firstly his loss and secondly frees up funds for you to buy him back into the alliance right away. Which you should do - mostly.

ETA:
* But watch out that you don't sink your gold into a negative gpt hole. It may be better to first check if the AI has some gpt available.

 

[Spoonwood]

They'll backstab less with a lower aggression level.

 

[soujourner]

the year is 1968, the Iroquois and Aztecs are the Super Powers. Myself, being the Americans are in a pack with the Koreans and Vikings. A three way alliance to combat the Big Two just isnt going to work. My aggression level is set to average.

To me this game boils down to where you start, and can you grow point wise and keep from being wiped out by more powerful players.

In that regard this game is a disappointment.

(Spelling and syntax improve after my first cup of coffee.)

 

[da3dalus]

The trick is to not pay the AI with up front goods (and by absolutely no means with luxes or resources either), but instead to make two separate deals. In the first you pay with gpt for the alliance, and in the second you charge gpt (the very same probably ) for your tech*. That way you can be fairly certain that you receive the full payment for your tech. And if your ally decides to bail out of the alliance it is firstly his loss and secondly frees up funds for you to buy him back into the alliance right away. Which you should do - mostly.

ETA:
* But watch out that you don't sink your gold into a negative gpt hole. It may be better to first check if the AI has some gpt available.

Hmm, excellent point. I'll try this in my next game, thanks Lord Em.

 

[soujourner]

alliances that never hold up...everyone for himself...a lesson in the world from this game..

 

[Lord Katana]

Personally i never have MPP.. like said above it will just pull you into wars.. One thing i do like to share is an experience i have with a non-normal game.

I'm currently playing (what i called) a Technophobe game. That is i never researched one tech, no, not even 1 beaker worth of science That means buying all techs, paying attention to who techs hard and who can be your rivals. In that game i got into a war with one of the techleaders (playing china myself, maya and inca are techleader, got into a fight with the maya). I signed a MPP with india and the inca's (who where situated between myself and the mayas) and with germany who where above the maya. The plan obviously was to give the mayas more then they could handle. That worked out very well.. so MPP can be adventagious if you sign them once your in war with a nation you cant beat on your own.... in my game the downside was that next turn the mayas made similair alliances with the aztec, iroqious and america to wipe me of the face of the earth .... But must say.. they failed (aztec and iroqious are now minorities in the great chinese empire ) Just dont break them.. (advice repeated many times on this forum and oh so true in a game where you have to buy your tech )