G
Gedas
Guest
I only wage war then I am fundementalist.But that governmenst jo do in war.
Az
Emperor
Fundy is the ultimate war time government.
------------------
<IMG SRC="http://www.virtuallandmedia.com/img1/flags-4/europe/fra.gif" border=0> Az <IMG SRC="http://www.virtuallandmedia.com/img1/flags-4/europe/gre.gif" border=0>
------------------
<IMG SRC="http://www.virtuallandmedia.com/img1/flags-4/europe/fra.gif" border=0> Az <IMG SRC="http://www.virtuallandmedia.com/img1/flags-4/europe/gre.gif" border=0>
starlifter
Deity
- Joined
- Jun 17, 2001
- Messages
- 4,210
Welcome to CFC, Gedas. I see this is your first post.
When you gain experience, you will also find Democracy is a great government, even for all-out war. After about Corporation, I fight almost excusively with Democracy. The UN may help, but otherwise you have to use a little finesse. Freght can often be used to start a war, for instance.
Nothing can beat the economics of a healthy democracy!
When you gain experience, you will also find Democracy is a great government, even for all-out war. After about Corporation, I fight almost excusively with Democracy. The UN may help, but otherwise you have to use a little finesse. Freght can often be used to start a war, for instance.
Nothing can beat the economics of a healthy democracy!
duke o' york
It don't mean a thing....
If you're going to be fighting a long, drawn-out war or even just to build up troops for a very short war, then Communism is good to ensure that you don't lose too badly in tech. Democracy for growth and fundy for war is probably the most common strategy used by the fanatics here, and it is undeniably effective, but it's not the only one. Having the Statue of Liberty makes switching government types a hell of a lot easier and don't forget that you often get a WLT* day just by having changed to a new form of government. With the Statue you can make yourself as rich as you like with a good infrastructure in democracy and build military units in your many cities, changing to fundy perhaps the turn before you will have produced too many to make your citizens unhappy. You will now have a very powerful army, money to bribe the cities you need to and no more interference from the annoying Senate. Let's hear it for the Hawk Party!
------------------
in vino veritas
------------------
in vino veritas
shadowdale
CFC Drunkard
Well I have to agree with Starlit - Democracy!!!
I never ever use Fundy or communism, not for war or money making Democracy can give me all that I need - This might have something to do with the fact that 90% of all my wars are fought with money
! And the remaining 10% can easily be handled by increasing the Lux rate a little!!!
money money money - could be funny - in a rich mans world.............
------------------
We are species 8472 - assimilation attempts are futile - the weak shall perish
No wait we are species 5618 and we got beer...... don't harm us!!!!!!
I never ever use Fundy or communism, not for war or money making Democracy can give me all that I need - This might have something to do with the fact that 90% of all my wars are fought with money
money money money - could be funny - in a rich mans world.............
------------------
We are species 8472 - assimilation attempts are futile - the weak shall perish
No wait we are species 5618 and we got beer...... don't harm us!!!!!!
starlifter
Deity
- Joined
- Jun 17, 2001
- Messages
- 4,210
Sounds suspiciously like a mix of lyrics from ABBA
greenie
Warlord
It depends how I'm feeling.
If I don't need to research that much, then Fundy becomesit. There is no denying it, but I also love the challenge of keeping my democracy alive, and pumping a 8-1-1 Tax or luxury rate and killing civs while boundlessly growing myself.
I never use Republic or Communism late in the game.
------------------
- Greenie
" Let us take by
cunning what we would
take by force"
If I don't need to research that much, then Fundy becomesit. There is no denying it, but I also love the challenge of keeping my democracy alive, and pumping a 8-1-1 Tax or luxury rate and killing civs while boundlessly growing myself.
I never use Republic or Communism late in the game.
------------------
- Greenie
" Let us take by
cunning what we would
take by force"
A
A.D.S
Guest
I think having statue of liberty is great then you can switch Democracy in peace time you can generate money and then there goes FUNDAMENTAL POWER
Alan_Nicoll
Chieftain
Since a veteran spy is worth 2 divisions of marines in wartime, Communism is my first choice for war.
Simon Darkshade
Mysterious City of Gold
I never use Fundy; I go for Communism for its nice balance, and touch of realism ( hey, lets not make it too easy to win), or bribe me an overseas modern army under Democracy, add one or two units from each city, cry havoc, and let loose the dogs of war.
------------------
Whether you like it or not, history is on our side. We will bury you.
- N.S.Khrushchev
------------------
Whether you like it or not, history is on our side. We will bury you.
- N.S.Khrushchev
starlifter
Deity
- Joined
- Jun 17, 2001
- Messages
- 4,210
At one time, I used to switch to Communism to crank out 100-120 veteran spies; I'd drop everything else to do so.
Now that I've discovered how to control Democracies while growing even during a bitter war, Switching to Communism would result in rampant, almost uncontrollable unhappiness. The only real solution is to increase luxuries in Communism, which I think is insane. Commies don't get luxuries... that's why they're commmies! And without that extra trade of Democracies, Commies+Luxuries=Huge Expense.
So the cost of those vet spies, as much as I love vet spies, is too great. However, there is a solution, and it works well. Produce the spies in Democracy. They won't be vets, but then you send them out to do some dirty deeds. About 1 in 2 or 1 in 3 will become vets. Use the vets to do the expensive city bribing. About half the vets will survive to bribe again anyway. Use the non-vet spies to bribe the small/cheap cities. Some will become vets.
The basic math is this: You're going to spend about 30*3*2/3*100, or about 6,000 extra shields for 100 veteran spies in a Democracy, as compared to Communism. When you compare the single or double government switch (lost science/trade/shields/food/time), the results are overwhelming... it is not worth the switch to Communism to get those vet spies. During that same time, a good democracy can easily give a net of 1000 science/gold per turn over a communist gov't, while costing 250-300 shields of support for units under democracy.
So bottom line: properly run Democracies will absolutely b-u-r-y all other forms of government in Civ II. But an improperly run Democracy will bury *you*!
Warlord56
Warlord
I can't wage war in Democracy, The Senate always interferes with my plans, so my units start leaving the cities after a while I turn to anarchy and I end up going to Fundamentalism.
Bud2998
Bud the Ironfist
I hate usin' democracy during war. The senate always interferes! Plus, my cities go into disorder when they leave the cities to fight. I'll use communism if I still have quite a few techs left to be discovered. Good balance between techs, economics, and military. Otherwise I'll use good ol' fundementalism.
TrailblazingScot
I was kittenOFchaos
Democracy is my government of choice...but a fundamentalist government -horribly overpowered (gold for happiness things -jeez- should if they are comparable sizes win an all out war.
greenie
Warlord
For all of you who can't handle Democracy, SNAP OUT OF IT!
With Mikes Chapel, a Temple and 20% luxuries you OWN the game! The inbcreased population, trade and production are enough of a benefit in War. Even better with Womens Suffrage and J.S Bach's Caherdral.
The only reason why the Senate will continue to rule against you you is becase of reputation.
Wait for the AI to sneak attack a few times and the Hawk party will let you get away with murder. You can play it from the point of view that since the AI doesnt care about ur rep, then why should you? With the Statue of Liberty, your back to Democracy in a turn
------------------
- Greenie
" Let us take by
cunning what we would
take by force"
With Mikes Chapel, a Temple and 20% luxuries you OWN the game! The inbcreased population, trade and production are enough of a benefit in War. Even better with Womens Suffrage and J.S Bach's Caherdral.
The only reason why the Senate will continue to rule against you you is becase of reputation.
Wait for the AI to sneak attack a few times and the Hawk party will let you get away with murder. You can play it from the point of view that since the AI doesnt care about ur rep, then why should you? With the Statue of Liberty, your back to Democracy in a turn
------------------
- Greenie
" Let us take by
cunning what we would
take by force"
starlifter
Deity
- Joined
- Jun 17, 2001
- Messages
- 4,210
I agree... once the necessary mindset for a warlike democracy is learned, you'll only very rarely even think about major, all out wars being fought in any other form of Govt. A democracy is so powerful in wartime that it almost makes even fundy seem like a distant 2nd. To be fair, there are times when unbalanced unit production in a regionalized conflict might necessitate Fundy, but that's about it.
Sorry, but that is not an accurate statement. In a Democracy, the senate will *always* rule against you, though sometimes it seems to soften nearing the very end of your conquest, when it really does not matter anyway.
BTW, I cannot recall the last time when I had comething other than a "spotless" record. In an OCC game a few months ago, I dropped to excellent in the last few years because I took 650 gold to declare war with an ally. But that was it. I can tell you that it does not help to be "spotless" in late game. But I do it anyway to make things more of a challenge. And guaranteed, speaking as a democratic war-monger with a Spotless rep in every game, that spotless record does not make the Senate more tolerant of my desires to continue a major war!
HIEROPHANT
Videogame God
Fundy govt is great for bribing computer cities.
starlifter
Deity
- Joined
- Jun 17, 2001
- Messages
- 4,210
A mature democracy will generate more gold than fundy. Intermediate democracies (still growing, making improvements) will generate less gold on a given turn than fundy, but withn 3 - 6 turns, the growth of democracy will bury fundy. Freight from a democracy... especially if traded with your own empire.. is worth far more in a democracy than Fundy.
Fundy is nice primarily because you can get away with nukes and dirty tricks, and the Senate will not interfere in a sustained campaign. The mid/late game financial "incentive" is just smoke and mirrors, LOL
greenie
Warlord
I must admit, Democracy BURIES people alive.
I'm playing a game right now, Pacific map, Prince level, 7 civs, Raging Hordes. Everyone is turning to Fundy right now - cept me. I'm a strong Democracy, and because of ppl sneak attacking me, I can do whatever I want. Also, there are 4 civs in Asia (I'm in America, Indonesia, Hawaii), and of course they want me to attack their enemies. So under rep or democracy, the easy way to declare war is to make someone else "force" you into it.
------------------
- Greenie
" Let us take by
cunning what we would
take by force"
I'm playing a game right now, Pacific map, Prince level, 7 civs, Raging Hordes. Everyone is turning to Fundy right now - cept me. I'm a strong Democracy, and because of ppl sneak attacking me, I can do whatever I want. Also, there are 4 civs in Asia (I'm in America, Indonesia, Hawaii), and of course they want me to attack their enemies. So under rep or democracy, the easy way to declare war is to make someone else "force" you into it.
------------------
- Greenie
" Let us take by
cunning what we would
take by force"
Magnus
Diplocat
Do you realize (or care) that this type of thing will damage your reputation?
