AI can apparently...

[capnvonbaron]

... rush things even though it isn't their turn.

I DoW'd an AI civ * during the course of my turn * who was under a commie gov't. So happened as soon as I did this, I saw the population # drop by 2 in every city I had in view. As I rolled in my Panzers, OH LOOK AT THAT! A BRAND NEW REGULAR INFANTRY THAT WASN'T THERE BEFORE! WONDER HOW THAT GOT THERE?!?

At least most of the cities had dropped below the magical 7 pop that makes them twice as tough to deal with...

 

[Padma]

There is a known bug that seems to allow something like this.

For what you described, though, I *think* at least part of the answer is that the 'turns' aren't as cut and dried as one would think. It'll take some searching to find the exact details, but the turn sequence is actually something like:

1. Player production
2. AI Production
3. Player moves
4. AI Moves

So, if you DOWed on your 'turn' (your 'movement phase'), the AI could have had another 'Production phase', during which it could rush defenders.

OTOH, if you DOWed, and moved to attack without hitting 'End Turn', then it sounds like you got bit by the bug.

 

[chrisman1]

Interesting, I've never seen that happen. What version are you playing? Does anyone know if this bug is in Vanilla, PTW, C3C or all versions?

 

[Sweetchuck]

I've had that happen to me a couple of times.

I just chalked it up to the AI advantage.

 

[capnvonbaron]

Vanilla 1.29F

Nope, I DoW'd and moved right in, didn't end my turn or let the computer have any time to move any units into my turf before I started rolling. Squished several of their stupid longbow units that were camped on my border before moving in as well, which I assume they would have moved if given the opportunity.

I've had an inkling that it happens, but if the computer is running a cash-hurry gov't, you can't really tell for sure except that before you go to war they have hundreds of gold, and yet the cities you take on the first drive inexplicably give you nothing or next to nothing. "We have captured PARIS and 'liberated' 2 gold." Give me a f*ing break. Did Joan have 526 gold hidden in her bra when she fled the capital before my panzers rolled in?? When its pop-hurry, the population in all the cities drops as soon as you declare. I'll see if I can reload it to just before I declare to see for sure, but I'm 99.9% sure its the AI exercising a hidden advantage.

 

[Sweetchuck]

The AI cheats like hell in that respect.

Another one I like is when I redline one of their units. That unit runs back to a city (without a barracks), hits that city three tiles over (the units max movement distance), and suddenly on the next turn it's fully healed.

Amazing.....

 

[Moosezilla]

What I liked was: playing RaR a Roman unit healed two health in enemy territory and then took a city. No hospitals no battlefield medicine. sheesh!

 

[darski]

I am so ticked with the AI creating units out of thin air on my turn. Conscripts may be annoying but when they create Vet units form nowhere and nothing I am ready to "strike any Key to continue"

 

[capnvonbaron]

Perhaps its just my 'cognitive bias' speaking...

It has always seemed to me that the enemy will tend to beat superior units more often if you don't stack them. ie, you are more likely to lose one knight sent to kill one spearman than one knight within a stack of ten knights sent to kill one spearman. Almost as if they see that they are doomed-no-matter-what and don't put up as much as a fight. I find this to be true when taking cities especially... the more oppressive the stack you send to take it, the fewer losses that tend to be incurred. Anyone else feel this way?

 

[darski]

Perhaps its just my 'cognitive bias' speaking...

It has always seemed to me that the enemy will tend to beat superior units more often if you don't stack them. ie, you are more likely to lose one knight sent to kill one spearman than one knight within a stack of ten knights sent to kill one spearman. Almost as if they see that they are doomed-no-matter-what and don't put up as much as a fight. I find this to be true when taking cities especially... the more oppressive the stack you send to take it, the fewer losses that tend to be incurred. Anyone else feel this way?

We may be getting into Whack Job territory bus I swear that at a certain point in the war, the enemy sees that it is losing and morale is shot. Then it seems they can't defend themselves from a wet paper bag.

And just to stay with that analogy, there is always one unit that stands and fights against all comers and against all odds but eventually he too succumbs to the onslaught of superior numbers. Ok, maybe I have watched too many John Wayne moves on Saturday afternoons during my childhood.

All this just to say that I agree with your observations.

 

[capnvonbaron]

And just to stay with that analogy, there is always one unit that stands and fights against all comers and against all odds but eventually he too succumbs to the onslaught of superior numbers.

... and its usually one of the last dudes in the last capital city of any circumstance. Also the one where I usually run out of units just as I beat him, thus having to defend my new pile of rubble with a battered and bruised longbowman <commence operation "burn city to ground and bring in settler">

Ok, now I'm really starting to do the 'whack job' soapboxing. I relent!

 

[againsttheflow]

This may prove of interest. (posts 61 and 63)

 

[drakonius]

the AI cheats like hell and hits one up with all kinds of inexplicable crap.I guess that one just has to accept it and pay it no mind.

 

[againsttheflow]

Conversely, paying mind pay prove to sharpen your skills.

 

[capnvonbaron]

*sigh*

Thats not it. What I'm talking about is different.
1) I am ON MY MAINTURN, just finished managing build orders and such, and attention pops over to my newly constructed panzers.
2) I set up all my troops for an invasion.
3) I initiate a dialogue with Joan by right-clicking a random rifle guy.
4) I tell Joan that I want all her gold, maps, and some cities and she refuses, becoming furious.
5) I say, "Thats it! Prepare for war!" and tell sarg to destroy them
6) In this EXACT SECOND, all the population numbers on every french city I can see drops by two.
7) WITHOUT ENDING THE TURN, I move in panzers and start destroying, and what do I find? FRESH UNFORTIFIED INFANTRY IN ALL THE CITIES THAT I AM ATTACKING.

REPEAT: THIS ALL HAPPENED ON MY MAINTURN. I did not end my turn at any point, and the computer was not allowed a chance to have either a interem or a mainturn before I rolled in. The computer created units on MY TURN. Its hogwash. When the AI declares on me during its turn, I certainly don't get a chance to rush and complete units before they swarm over my borders!

 

[darski]

*sigh*

Thats not it. What I'm talking about is different.
1) I am ON MY MAINTURN, just finished managing build orders and such, and attention pops over to my newly constructed panzers.
2) I set up all my troops for an invasion.
3) I initiate a dialogue with Joan by right-clicking a random rifle guy.
4) I tell Joan that I want all her gold, maps, and some cities and she refuses, becoming furious.
5) I say, "Thats it! Prepare for war!" and tell sarg to destroy them
6) In this EXACT SECOND, all the population numbers on every french city I can see drops by two.
7) WITHOUT ENDING THE TURN, I move in panzers and start destroying, and what do I find? FRESH UNFORTIFIED INFANTRY IN ALL THE CITIES THAT I AM ATTACKING.

REPEAT: THIS ALL HAPPENED ON MY MAINTURN. I did not end my turn at any point, and the computer was not allowed a chance to have either a interem or a mainturn before I rolled in. The computer created units on MY TURN. Its hogwash. When the AI declares on me during its turn, I certainly don't get a chance to rush and complete units before they swarm over my borders!

YEP! You are right and it drives me crazy when they do that.

In any given battle, they always have the (currently) best defender on top and then they fall back on the offensive units like Cavs or whatever. In one game, I had wiped out every unit including the conscript rifles when they suddenly had a full strength VET rifle in the city. cheating dogs!!!!

 

[Sashie VII]

In any case, it's a reason to always throw in some extra crew in your assault stack

It doesn't bother me, really. AI is dumb, we all know that. What's a few more things to help them cope with us

 

[Chamnix]

Do you happen to have the save still capnvonbaron? I'd like to play around with it some.

 

[capnvonbaron]

Do you happen to have the save still capnvonbaron? I'd like to play around with it some.

I might, but I still haven't figured out how to get them off the old 'puter, which around a year ago decided to stop talking to USB mem cards and any networks I try to put it on. No CD burner or zip drive either... I may just have to break out the old floppy drive for it and see what I can manage I haven't made much effort since then to get stuff off of it, but once I work that out, I'll post a save. Recall that I am running vanilla 1.29f, if that makes a difference.

 

[capnvonbaron]

Also; if I have the presence of mind, next time I reload the save, I will make sure to investigate a couple of the cities (since I have enough gold to toss around... extremely late-game golden age) and see what units are in them before I attack. My guess is that I will not find the infantry that was there when I began my attack. I'll get screenshots, too.