Allied militaristic CS "stop spawn units" command

[mrddt]

On a quick speed it says that CS will give you units approximately every 11 turns. Does anybody know mechanics of this? Is it random? Something like with the Great Prophet borning? Or it's points accumulation system?
And how "stop gifting units" works? Is it resets counter and then starts from the beginning when resumed? Or it just paused and then start ticking from the point where it was paused?
It's just my allied CS may give me Longbow. I'm researching Machinery and then going for Terracotta Army, and then attack. It would be perfect if CS give me Longbowman after finish Machinery and before I finish Terracotta =)
Thanks!

 

[kamex]

I can't answer you're question, but I'd like to ask why would anyone ever use the 'stop spawning' function. If you don't want the unit you can always disband it for gold or gift it to another CS (or even the same CS).

 

[Crus8r]

I also can't answer OPs question, but I can definitely see the rational behind it:

Let's say that 11 turns since allying CS is turn X, and that he'll finish Machinery on turn X+2, and Terracotta on turn X+5...if 'Stop Unit Spawning' pauses the timer, then he can use that until he finishes Machinery and get a longbow before finishing Terracotta. On the other hand, if it resets the counter, then he'll NOT get a longbow before Terracotta finishes... I have to admit, if it does just pause the counter, its the first good use I've heard of for that feature.

Crus8r

 

[docbud]

I sometimes turn it off because the gifted units are sucking up my strategic resources.

Or, I've been friends with a militiaristic CS who keeps gifting me horse units, and I don't have any horses. Of I have limited aluminum and they keep giving me rocket artillery (and using up my precious aluminum).

Or they keep giving me pikemen, and I don't need anymore, or don't have enough horses to upgrade them at a later date.

I'l usually try to gift the units to another city state, but sometimes it becomes too annoying.

 

[Smokey McDope]

There is no reason to turn it off though. If you don't want the unit just disband it, for gold. It's like saying you don't want free gold.

 

[mrddt]

Well, I guess only Crus8r reads the whole post. Everybody else reads title only, and post coments based on their guess what is written in the description

Moderator Action: Please do not get personal, stick to the subject of the thread.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[Smokey McDope]

No I did read the whole thing, don't insult me. I was replying specifically to docbud. Why don't you save the game, test it yourself, and see what happens? Then there is no need to come to the forum making passive-aggressive douche posts when someone else doesn't do it for you.

Moderator Action: Please report the post instead of answering like this.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[mrddt]

No I did read the whole thing, don't insult me. I was replying specifically to docbud. Why don't you save the game, test it yourself, and see what happens? Then there is no need to come to the forum making passive-aggressive douche posts when someone else doesn't do it for you.

If you have read the whole thing, why did you post such a silly comment?

There is no reason to turn it off

It has been explained TWICE (in my post, and Crus8r's), why you would want to turn it off. If you still don't get it... well... you probably should be ready for some sarcasm incoming

And I can't test it by my self because I'm playing via GMR (PBEM type of game).

 

[Hakan-i Cihan]

Trying yourself is a good option. I dont know much about GMR/PBEM games, but if you can start a new test game on quick speed with mods (in game world editor) without disturbing your current game then it is pretty easy to learn it.

Verstuurd vanaf mijn Nexus 6 met Tapatalk

 

[Smokey McDope]

If you have read the whole thing, why did you post such a silly comment?

I'll type really slow this time so you can understand. I was replying specifically to docbud.

 

[Der_Zorn_gottes]

I also can't answer OPs question, but I can definitely see the rational behind it:

Let's say that 11 turns since allying CS is turn X, and that he'll finish Machinery on turn X+2, and Terracotta on turn X+5...if 'Stop Unit Spawning' pauses the timer, then he can use that until he finishes Machinery and get a longbow before finishing Terracotta. On the other hand, if it resets the counter, then he'll NOT get a longbow before Terracotta finishes... I have to admit, if it does just pause the counter, its the first good use I've heard of for that feature.

Crus8r

How do you know when a CS will get a certain tech?

 

[beetle]

Everybody else reads title only, and post comments based on their guess what is written in the description

You have just described every thread on the forum! It can be a little frustrating.

Anyway, stop gifts resets -- does not pause -- the counter.

I don't know the nominal gifting cycle, but the first shows up faster than the rest, and there is some RNG, not unlike GPr spawning. So you can game the system a little by going into and out of allied status -- as opposed to just staying allied.

Apparently, one has to be allied -- not just friends -- to get any available UU.

What you are trying to do, get longbow from TA, should be pretty easy to time so long as you don't have to worry about an AI sniping it out from under you: (1) delay allied status (sit on some gold) until just before machinery; (2) once TA is down to a single turn, put something else in your build queue until the gifted long bow spawns. If you don’t mind missing out on a lesser unit or two then, while researching machinery, click stop spawning until 5 turns (half of the nominal 11) before machinery is researched.

How do you know when a CS will get a certain tech?

Gifts depend on your tech, not the CS tech.

 

[Der_Zorn_gottes]

I see. Thanks.

 

[mrddt]

beetle

Anyway, stop gifts resets -- does not pause -- the counter.

I don't know the nominal gifting cycle, but the first shows up faster than the rest, and there is some RNG, not unlike GPr spawning.

How do you know that?

I wish I can afford to delay TA, but I can't.
So, the numbers are: I allied CS 3-4 turns ago. I will get Machinery in 6 turns. After that TA will be built in 5 turns. So, if CS will give me Longbowman after 10 turns being ally, I'm good. If earlier, that's fail
Now I have 10 turns before TA will be done. If I order to stop spawning and next turn resume, that's 9 turns (before TA). Feels like I should just leave it and hoping that CS won't give me UU before Machinery is finished. What do you think?

From my experience CS gives units very close to 11 turns. I would say +/- 1 turn. Well, maybe +/- 2 turns, but I'm not sure.

 

[mrddt]

How do you know when a CS will get a certain tech?

Open CS screen. Hover cursor over CS's type ("Militaristic"), it will show you what unique unit it will grant you and what tech you should have to get this unit

 

[beetle]

How do you know that?

Mostly from browsing this forums. Sorry, but I cannot offer an authoritative citation.

So, the numbers are: I allied CS 3-4 turns ago. I will get Machinery in 6 turns. After that TA will be built in 5 turns.

Given that the mouse-over says ~11 turns, I think you can expect your first gift 5-7 turns from ally status. So, I think you should stop gifts now for 1 turn and only 1 turn.

Were you friends for many turns before allied status? Have you already gotten one or more gifted units?

So, if CS will give me Longbowman after 10 turns being ally, I'm good.

I really think you will be gifted your first unit before those ten turns are up.

Feels like I should just leave it and hoping that CS won't give me UU before Machinery is finished. What do you think?

How do you feel about reloading?

From my experience CS gives units very close to 11 turns. I would say +/- 1 turn. Well, maybe +/- 2 turns, but I'm not sure.

That is consistent with my experience as well. The RNG involved does not seem to range as much as the GPr spawning. But the 11 +/- only seems consistent after the first gift and only if I stay allied the whole time.

 

[whoward69]

Sorry, but I cannot offer an authoritative citation.

It's in the released source code, specifically CvMinorCivAI:: DoSeedUnitSpawnCounter()

The RNG involved does not seem to range as much as the GPr spawning. But the 11 +/- only seems consistent after the first gift and only if I stay allied the whole time.

On standard speed the base is FRIENDS_BASE_TURNS_UNIT_SPAWN(19), plus ALLIES_EXTRA_TURNS_UNIT_SPAWN(-3) if you're their ally, then adjusted for policies / common enemies, finally plus 0 to FRIENDS_RAND_TURNS_UNIT_SPAWN(3)-1 for randomness.
The first unit occurs after UNIT_SPAWN_BIAS_MULTIPLIER(50) percent of turns

All variables are in GlobalAIDefines.xml

 

[mrddt]

Were you friends for many turns before allied status? Have you already gotten one or more gifted units?

No, we never been friends before, and I never receive anything from this CS. It always been neutral until I destroyed barb camp and liberate worker 3-4 turns ago

How do you feel about reloading?

I feel fine about it. But I can't reload even I want I'm playing via GMR (PBEM game).

That is consistent with my experience as well. The RNG involved does not seem to range as much as the GPr spawning. But the 11 +/- only seems consistent after the first gift and only if I stay allied the whole time.

From my other recent game I can tell that I got first unit after about 10 turns. I might be wrong, but feels like it wasn't less than 10 turns.

But thanks for advice anyway! I'll probably will stop it for 1 turn

 

[mrddt]

It's in the released source code, specifically CvMinorCivAI:: DoSeedUnitSpawnCounter()



On standard speed the base is FRIENDS_BASE_TURNS_UNIT_SPAWN(19), plus ALLIES_EXTRA_TURNS_UNIT_SPAWN(-3) if you're their ally, then adjusted for policies / common enemies, finally plus 0 to FRIENDS_RAND_TURNS_UNIT_SPAWN(3)-1 for randomness.
The first unit occurs after UNIT_SPAWN_BIAS_MULTIPLIER(50) percent of turns

All variables are in GlobalAIDefines.xml

That's awesome! Thanks a lot!

So, for standard speed it's 19 turns if friends. -3 = 16 turns if ally. Quick speed modifier * 0.67 = 10,72 = 11 turns (if ally).

then adjusted for policies / common enemies

Can you tell more about it, please?

And, can somebody explain this please?

finally plus 0 to FRIENDS_RAND_TURNS_UNIT_SPAWN(3)-1 for randomness.

The first unit occurs after UNIT_SPAWN_BIAS_MULTIPLIER(50) percent of turns

 

[beetle]

@OP, this is the line that make the 1st gift show up faster:

The first unit occurs after UNIT_SPAWN_BIAS_MULTIPLIER(50) percent of turns

Thanks whoward!

But thanks for advice anyway! I'll probably will stop it for 1 turn

Let us know how it went!