Annoying World Spells

AngelGabriel

Warlord
Joined
Jul 24, 2007
Messages
110
Don't remember any threads covering these - I know there won't be changed anything, but then again: Perhaps they are not carved into stone forever.

So:

1) Illians - Stagnation thingy:

I could puke everytime it hits. The AI does use it whenever it wants without any reason. To be honest: I don't see the reason of the whole power at all. 20 turns of no production or research needs a very large army of the Illians just to hinder the neighboring country to train any more units while trying to overrun them. 20 turns are not that much and large empires could be severely hit at best. Even if wiped out that's all that happened. In the meantime everything stands still and can get quite tedious for any other participant. It's boring just to click away turn after turn for nothing.

2) Infernal - Capturing the strongest city of Ashen Veil

When playing Sheaim (who else would want to rush to Ashen Veil and Demons?) it's my obligation to found Ashen Veil and get the Infernal pact. And yes: I do see story-wise, that every deal comes with a price. So yes: It makes sense, that the Infernal capture the best Ashen Veil city - but playing the game and having that in mind is not very promising. I think it hits the Sheaim (and most times only them) severely, while all other neighbors don't have anything to fear about (in most cases the founder of AV has the strongest AV city). That's quite unfair especially when in war with other civilizations. The only way to be immune is not to set on AV (which is not the best decision for Sheaim, as they profit from the Armageddon Counter) or by going to war instantly against Hyborem and reclaim that city.
Why should Hyborem only aim for an AV city? Why not claim the city of the strongest player (even if Bannor?)? All the adavantage of bringing the apocalypse into the world vanish, if the Sheaim loose their best city, especially in a critical phase. Why would Hyborem want to hurt his strongest and most faithful follower? The Sheaim can be brought to hell, when the world is at an end. But before that?

What's your opionion about those two or the others?
 
Stasis is one of the worldspells I actually like. Sure, if I'm not playing them it's not very pleasant but I still find it useful to give me some time to catch up with improvements.

I'm yet to play the game where AI Hyborem gets so far as Malevolent Designs. But if that should happen and he tries to steal my city I'd immediately DoW on him, take it back and then sue for peace. All you'd lose this way are few buildings that can be easily rebuilt with slave trade.

My personal hate is for Arcane Lacuna. Spells are essential in dealing with AI's ludicrous stacks and this damn spell always coincides with the Sheaim desire to stomp me with their PZ's. So I just disable Amurite civ for AI altogether:king:
 
The most annoying spell for me is Stasis. It is just... bad.
So, I typically disable Illians from my game.
If I sometime play as Illians, I typically use it during first 50 turns - waiting in reality only to spoil someones golden age (esp. Balseraphs one)
 
1) Illians - Stagnation thingy:
<snip>
It's boring just to click away turn after turn for nothing.
Stasis is only as boring as you let it be. Once you know the Illians are in the game, plan to take advantage of Stasis when it hits. It is a great opportunity to wage a war, because you don't have to pay for having your army outside of your territory. If you are playing a civ whose worldspell grants free units, it is an excellent time to use that spell without having to pay for those units. Stasis will be much less boring if you stay active, and if you can turn it to your advantage then it's almost like you've gotten to use two worldspells.


2) Infernal - Capturing the strongest city of Ashen Veil

When playing Sheaim (who else would want to rush to Ashen Veil and Demons?)
Anyone who wants to use Ritualists. Ring of Fire is an extremely effective spell. Play a leader with the Spiritual trait and you can sometimes win the game with just Ritualists.

Why should Hyborem only aim for an AV city?
Hyborem intends to conquer the whole plane. He's not just aiming for AV cities, but neither does he have any reason to avoid controlling them.
Why not claim the city of the strongest player (even if Bannor?)?
Non-AV cities are not full of demon worshipers who would potentially overthrow their current leadership for the opportunity to follow Hyborem. Hyborem's Whisper doesn't subvert an entire populace, it just nudges them slightly.
Why would Hyborem want to hurt his strongest and most faithful follower?
Hyborem has wicked intent for all of Erebus, not just those who don't follow AV. He may act less hostile, or even friendly, toward AV civs but in the end he will burn everyone, so to speak. To put it in game terms, he plans to win the game himself and doesn't care who he steps on in the process.
The Sheaim can be brought to hell, when the world is at an end. But before that?
Once Hyborem enters Erebus you're past the "before the end" stage, and into the "beginning of the end" stage. Hyborem isn't going to wait to bring Erebus to hell, he's bringing hell to Erebus - at that very moment.

If you plan to follow AV then you need to be prepared for the consequences. The Infernals don't come to help you win the game, they come to destroy you and everyone else in Erebus. If you choose not to take control of the Infernals then you need to make it a priority to destroy them. If you don't, then you're in the uncomfortable position of making an enemy more powerful as you make yourself more powerful. Hyborem's Whisper is just one aspect of that.
 
Well said Emptiness! I have to admit I'm not up on my FfH lore as well as some people here, but I always thought of the 'Infernals' representing the 'be carefful when cavorting with demons' theme. You have to view them as potentially useful, and they will feel the same about you. They are NEVER one of your true allies, just a power to exploit and beware of the consequences because they feel EXACTLY the same about you.

I also confirm the power of the ritualists. A nice (gamey)? trick is to start as RoK, get a few levels of the Latar, and switch to the veil. Especially if you are on a board with few metals, the strategy can be poewerful.

Best wishes,

Breunor
 
admittedly im not a fan of World Spells but i play ModMods very often (FF and RiFE) and some civs like the Archos need world spells to even out the game (they use it to summon mother (their Hero)) as for other world spells I dont really mind any,

yes Stasis is by far the most overpowered WS as in my honest opinion the illian civ have more than enough to fall back on with Auric Ascended+ Drifta+ Willbommen and stasis makes them that much more tougher, but as for myself i play Monarch and the difficulty above it and still am always looking for a challenge so i dont mind it.

as for Infernals "Hyborems Whisper" WS i dont really struggle with this, im a hardcore Sheaim player, always have Armmageddon counter on and Hyborem and Basium... i just never have open boarders with hyborem, if i do and i see him approach any of my cities then i settle it through the only means of diplomatic communication i know "WAR!!!"

if any world spell is annoying then i gotta say it is the Grigori's, resetting their Great Person output can prove far too effective (specially on FF and RiFE where engineers can be used to build Master Smith / Fletcher / Rancher / Outfitters to help units)

but the simple ways to work around these world spells if they annoy you is to:
Stasis - Have a sufficient army to fully take advantage of this situation (be it if you are at war with Illians or another civ (though they commonly use it at the beggining of a war declaration either by them or by somebody against them).
Hyborems Whisper - dont let him have open boarders with you or declare war and force him to take the city if he wants it...

or you can turn world spells off, which Vanila FFH and FF both have the option (and im guessing some other ModMods also have)
 
if any world spell is annoying then i gotta say it is the Grigori's, resetting their Great Person output can prove far too effective (specially on FF and RiFE where engineers can be used to build Master Smith / Fletcher / Rancher / Outfitters to help units)

This would probably be powerful in MP (when I first saw this worldspell I immediately thought "cultural victory ahead", though the Adventurer GPP messes up the counter), but I've never seen the AI use the Grigori worldspell efficiently... In fact I hardly saw it used at all.

The one I find the most annoying is probably Arcane Lacuna. It always pops when I'm terraforming or when I need heavy summoning, and apparently for no reason. Though I once saw the AI use it on turn 1 and was extremely relieved.

Stasis comes close second, though I find it more bearable, since I can still use the units I already have.

Sanctuary would probably be the third, when I need to cross the Elohim lands to wage war and that annoying wall appears. But this worldspell is so awesome when I play them, that I am willing to ignore this small problem :)

I don't play AV much, so I currently have no problem with Hyborem's Whisper. Take that, you filthy ritualists.
 
as for Infernals "Hyborems Whisper" WS i dont really struggle with this, im a hardcore Sheaim player, always have Armmageddon counter on and Hyborem and Basium... i just never have open boarders with hyborem, if i do and i see him approach any of my cities then i settle it through the only means of diplomatic communication i know "WAR!!!"
<snip>
Hyborems Whisper - dont let him have open boarders with you or declare war and force him to take the city if he wants it...
I don't know how this works in modmods, but in base FfH2 Hyborem does not need to have open borders, or be at peace, or be anywhere near a city to claim it with Hyborem's Whisper.
 
Arcane Lacuna can be real pain in the ass, especially if you are trying to play caster heavy.

Recently was totally destroyed by it as Sheaim. My strategy was to rush build mages asap and promote them with death II. I had also couple of mana nodes nearby, which I converted to death immediately upon researching necromancy. Spectres was really overpowered at the time (opposition had axemen at the very best)

Everything worked well at first. Without much trouble I fed couple of my neighboring would-be civilizations to spectres. Then I noticed Perpentach had grown very powerful and I decided to weaken him a bit before he grows out of control. Ofcourse Amurites wanted to join the fun and they started with Arcane Lacuna (30 frigging turns of pure joy on marathon). Rest is history..

Note to self: Always build pyre zombies as Sheaim, even if you don't plan to use them ;)
 
Back
Top Bottom