Artists

PaulLaverty

Chieftain
Joined
Dec 28, 2006
Messages
4
Location
Glasgow, Scotand
I am a newbie to this game and I play against a friend online who is much more experienced. He always beats me.

He seems to be able to get loads of artists and uses these to increase his land borders.

How do you get more of these and is this the best stratagy to use or what should I do to counter this stratagy

Cheers in advance
 
I am a newbie to this game and I play against a friend online who is much more experienced. He always beats me.

He seems to be able to get loads of artists and uses these to increase his land borders.

How do you get more of these and is this the best stratagy to use or what should I do to counter this stratagy

Cheers in advance

Firstly, welcome to Civ4 and CFC!

I'm also not an experienced player, so take my advice with a pinch of salt.

His artist specialists each produce 4 culture (6 with Sistine Chapel) with causes borders to expand quickly. And they increase the odds of a Great Artist being born, which would cause borders to expand even faster.

You have not clearly stated your problem though. Are you having a problem with cultural pressure or what?

I can't really give a detailed advice unless you clearly state your problems. Assuming that you have cultural pressure problems, I would suggest that you build culture buildings such as libraries, obelisks, temples and monasteries in your cities bordering him. This would relieve the culture problem.

Note that people who have many artist specialists tend to have low production. This makes them a good target for an military assault. (war! :lol: ) But remember siege units. His cities would have high cultural defence bonus. Or you could send a stack of spearmen/axemen/horse archers to pillage his land if you can't conquer his cities.

There is no one correct strategy in Civ4. But don't be disheartened. Multiplayer is usually harder than single player. Just keep trying. I hope this helps.
 
I'm not exactly an expert myself, but here are my thoughts for what they're worth:

1. Are you sure he is using Great Artists? You could be getting cultural pressure from other sources (temples, libraries, palace, wonders).

2. Once you have discovered drama (I think) you can run Artist specialists, which as the above poster mentioned will not only generate extra culture, but will accumulate Great Artist points in that city (eventually spawning a Great Artist).

3. The first faction to discover music gets a free Great Artist.

4. Numerous wonders also accumulate Great Artist points.

5. You can settle a Great Artist in a city, to pump out steady culture (a souped-up artist specialist). Alternatively, you can have the Great Artist create a "great work". This immediately adds 4000 culture to the city in question. Do this in a frontier city, and just watch those borders mushroom out! This is commonly known as a "culture bomb".

As I see it, you can combat this in one of two obvious ways (though as with everything in this game, there are doubtless other strategies):

Play them at their own game: generate your own Great Artists (with specialists, relevant wonders or by racing for music). Consider using them to culture bomb your mutual borders.

Or, get together an army with sufficient siege equipment (culture fortifies a city, and will need to bombarded down if your troops are to stand a chance) and capture and/or raze their high-culture cities. The decision whether to capture or raze is very situational. By razing, you may be destroying some tasty wonders, but on the other hand this can allow your own culture-producing cities to push their borders out over the new "no man's land", and new settlements can't hope to compete with the cultural output of an established city (unless, of course, they/you deviously throw down a culture bomb - aka great work - in the new settlement).

You need to judge which works for you. Can you "out-culture" your neighbour, or do they have too much of a head start? Can you defeat them militarily, or is their defense force too good?

Anyway, good luck!
 
The easiest solution I can offer you is mass catapults and destroy his cities. don't even keep them - just raze them. If they settle or pop Great Artists in that city, they aren't building up a military with those hammers and population. I have never heard of a multiplayer problem where one loses because of cultural pressure.
 
I forgot to add in that all wonders (world and national) produce culture. Build them and you shouldn't have any problem in culture.

And it is also well known in multiplayer that going for a cultural victory usually loses. Why? Because people can see on the victory conditions screen and they will attack you. Because there is too much emphasis on culture, your military suffers and......
 
Or, get together an army with sufficient siege equipment (culture fortifies a city, and will need to bombarded down if your troops are to stand a chance) and capture and/or raze their high-culture cities. The decision whether to capture or raze is very situational. By razing, you may be destroying some tasty wonders, but on the other hand this can allow your own culture-producing cities to push their borders out over the new "no man's land", and new settlements can't hope to compete with the cultural output of an established city (unless, of course, they/you deviously throw down a culture bomb - aka great work - in the new settlement).

i don't play MP except coop with hubby so i can't give real advice except to say good luck :)

i think that what your friend is doing is not what TravellingHat is talking about at the very end of what i quoted above. but, since i just saw a version of what he's talking about in action, i can tell you a little more detail about it. i ramble, so the long story follows, but the short version is: even in brand new cities you just captured, using a great artist to make a great work can (1) end the revolt instantly, (2) grant you border pops and therefore cultural control of the tiles, making your enemy not able to use roads that might be there already, which gives you time to heal and/or bring in more troops since he can't reach you as fast, and (3) grants you an instant and significan boost in cultural defense. great artists used strategically are incredible combat units basically.

earlier today i had Louis (the AI, not multiplayer, of course) down to two cities. he'd been saving up great people for a golden age, and had built a settler, and at some point built a third city, and took along a great artist i guess. i took one city. then i took what used to be his last city. at that point, i would have been able to take his newest city, the one built by that settler, in 2 turns. there were roads connecting it with the city i'd just captured, but the culture connecting the two cities was mostly gone, meaning i could use them. the city was 2 population, had to have just hit 2 recently, he's a creative leader and didn't have any or much cultural defense. that was why i was calculating 2 turns to reach it, i wouldn't need my one-movement siege weapons, i had enough 2-movement stronger units and could take it without bombarding/collatoral damage was my theory.

then he used the culture bomb/great work weapon after i hit enter. it was a brilliant move on his part! he got three rings of border pop, and 60% more cultural defense, so now i did need my siege weapons, and would take 4 turns to get there (no using roads, and having to bring along 1-movement weapons too). i did get there of course. he had his own siege weapons in there, hit me with them a little bit, some retreated, but then he died. the best part was ... when i captured that city (it was very well placed so even at population one i wanted to keep it), it had a military academy in it! those retreats must have given him the exp he needed to earn a great general :lol:

he did this in his own city. he didn't even need the "get the city out of revolt instantly" effect i use it partly for myself at times. but it still helped him quite a bit. it didn't save him, he had no hope...he was down to one tiny city, what could he do to really save his empire at that point? but he did the smartest thing he could, and made my job harder, and i cheered him for the effort.
 
Agreed with the others - the counter to Artists (the worst great person anyway, IMHO), is not necessarily more or different GP, but just basically any kind of military whatsoever (IMO). The best way to win a culture race at a border is with violence. ;)

Hermann Goerring said:
Whenever I hear the word 'culture', I reach for my revolver.

(Note that Hermann Goerring was a despicable person, but I still find that quote quite applicable to cultural border struggles. ;) (Actually, furthermore upon attempted verification it appears that he was not the originator of that line anyway, but regardless, I still think it is apropos to the conversation.))

Good luck!
 
Don't fight paper with paper, or scissors with scissors.

He's using paper, so stab him in the eye with scissors.

"Oh looky, lots of culture. Eat 3 stacks-of-death your culture-whore! MUAHAHAHHAHAHAHA!"

In other words, I agree with the guys who say "Go kill him".
 
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