Austrians and Cavalry UUs

Frostyboy

Frostyboy

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I have just swapped one of my civs for making Austria, and I want to use the Hussar unit (the same graphic unit as in Napoleon wars)

But I am confused to what statistics I shall give it. The Ottomans have to PAY 20 for 2 extra attack, the Russians 10 for Blitz.

I though about giving the Hussar 10 shields DISCOUNT, which isn't really much per se, but it will do the upgrade from knight to hussar FREE!

Any comments?

Second: What traits should Austria have (I suggested Mil Sci - same as germany)

I also have though about swapping German Panzer for the "Cuirassier" (found in Napoleon) since I almost never play til Motorized transportation anyway.

The Cuirassier is a Cavalry UU, which should be well armored (But so is the Siphai supposed to be in historical terms). Which benefits should this unit have? I thought 6/4/3 is to weak (the same as Cossacks in Normal/PTW)

Should Siphai be cheaper? What about Hussars and Cuirassiers?

Please help me with som fairy objective comments and experience.
 
I dont think it should be cheaper so it upgrades free. I think it should have 1 attack and an extra 5 or 10 shields. I think for Austria is should be military and industry. The panzer does come pretty late, but the cuirassier should maybe have -1 attack and +2 or +3 defence, because you never hear anything good about German cavalry (always the french who charge suicidly). The Siphai shouldn't be cheaper. Its too powerful if cheaper.

I like the ideas about cuirassiers and hussars.
 
Thanks, but Why should they have to pay for only 1 extra attack. I mean a rise from 6 to 7 is far less steep than for example the mounted warrior from 2 to 3 or Immortals 3 to 4.

The Siphai was earlier 7/3/3 - 80shields remember and the Cossack 6/4/3 - 80 sh.

Isn't it more fun to give a Unit some specialty?
 
From COTM7, which was Austria:
- Civ traits were Ind/Mil.
- Hussar was 7.3.3 and cost 80 shields.
 
But 7.3.3-80 vs 8.3.3-100. Don't you see the unbalance??

COTM7 ? Remind me, what is it again?

Are the Mil/ind traits historically supported?
(I thought since Austria is so close to German culturaly, they could have the same traits)

But I do want to play a civ nearly the same way as other people.

I have modded Musketmen from 60 to 50 shields.
Turned Jav throwers from 2.2.1 to 3.1.1
Hitittes to Assyrians (3-man chariot from 2.2.2-30 to 3.2.2-35)
Numidian Mercs from 30 to 25 shields

Can you agree on those as well?
 
Frostyboy said:
But 7.3.3-80 vs 8.3.3-100. Don't you see the unbalance??
Click to expand...

Sipahi would be even more overpowering at 90 shields, whereas 80 is a fair price for Hussar. You have cavs at that point in the game, all the way up until tanks, so 1-2 extra production turns is no biggie

I have modded Musketmen from 60 to 50 shields.
Turned Jav throwers from 2.2.1 to 3.1.1
Hitittes to Assyrians (3-man chariot from 2.2.2-30 to 3.2.2-35)
Numidian Mercs from 30 to 25 shields

Can you agree on those as well?
Click to expand...

I agree with makets and jav throwers- no big deal.

3-man chariot change is horrible
1. same power as gallic minus the iron resource+horses, but cheaper.
2. you get the wheel as a first level tech

N. Mercs are already a great deal.
 
I reckon Cavalry gets quite useless after the appearance of riflemen, and at least infantery (fortified behind walls / cities / metros they have defences up to 14 and 24 respectively). I usually have to wait for tanks to start conquering again. But usually I win (or give up) before the Ind area.

I still don't see how 1 extra attack should be 20 shields. I thought only 7 in attack for the PTW siphai was too bad, and 4 defence for the Cossack as well.
I don't mind paying 100 for the siphai, but I rather pay 80 for a 7-3-3 Hussar :)

Regarding the other units, I don't get your point. I thought that my Assyrian Chariots 3.2.2 is equal to tha Gallic Swordssman except for 2 things:
- Swapping Rescources (Isn't Iron and Horses equally accesible - if not arrest me on this one!
- The Chariot can't pass mountains and Wetlands w/o road which after my opinion is a big deal and therefore I gave a 5 shield discount.

And the Num. Mercs. By forcing the Carths to pay 30 for a defensive unit which doesn't need 2 in attack (since you can build Swordmen or Archers), much of the benefit is lost. 25 is perhaps a bit too good, but if you are struggling what would you choose: A 20 shield Hoplite or a 30 shield Merc?
 
I forgot about the chariot's defects so yeah, I'll go with you on that, cost-wise.

The N. Merc's attack value is useless to me as well.
 
Justification for the 80-shield 7.3.3 Hussar can be found in many other UUs which are the same cost as the unit it replaces, but with a single stat raised (C3C - some differ in PtW).

IIRC:
Bab Bowman, Hoplite, Immortal, Legion, Mounted Warrior, War Chariot, Swiss Merc, Rider, Musketeer, Samurai, amongst others.
 
Sounds good then.

Ok, I think late UU's should get some extra benefit, like the German Panzer.
Do you have experience with the Spanish Conquistador? Isn't 70 shields a lot for a unit
that in combat values is outdated. I reckon it's nice for pillaging though. But Spanish have to pay 70 for an explorer which is outrageous.
 
I only have receiving-end experience of the Conquistador. Ironically, it's a unit that's far more dangerous in AI hands than human hands. Given most human player's liking for not leaving defensive units in cities that "don't need them", forgetting a unit that can penetrate 5 tiles deep, regardless of terrain, whilst at war, can lead to some embarassments.
 
But still - 70 shields s a bit too much for a UU that is't much of a fighter?
I thought 50 should be enough. That means the bonus Spain gets is free road-movement
 
You might want to make austrians focus on building atleast at happiness and culture, as religious and cultural buildings are widely present at the austrian cities! IMHO a very good addition as a playable civilization.
 
I thought either Mil Rel or Mil Sci for the Austrians

Does anybody know where the "official" Austrian stats are?

(I know there has been made an older looking hussar as well, with the feathers, but I stick to the Napoleon War unit)
 
COTM7 featured Austria, so I'd use those as the official stats.

The Game Release Thread is here. Note that the tech tree got a little mixed up, mainly with some units and improvements getting moved around. But it's a good place to start.

Try the game, it's a tough one ;)
 
Alright! Thanks.

But tell me: COTM7 is a abbrevation for?
(I'm not so updated these days)
 
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