Awesome Pack Discussions

[Urkedurke]

Yes Hello,
I'm posting this thread to ask when about the awesome pack and will it be finished and what will be the changes. Maybe someone has new ideas for Ryika.
On that note I wanted to discuss changes that will be implemented to Awesome Affinities. Now i have fell that with the new changes to vanila affinities every thing is just to random. What i mean is that i don't want to have harmony points if I'm going supremacy. Furthermore just getting two points in a affinity gives you some great buildings like the Gene Garden and the Feedsite Hub. I think this is stupid and that the affinity level requirements should be at least 6 or more. Same goes for units. You simply should not get the first unique units on level 4 but 6. Speaking of which the affinity happen too suddenly for fifty turn you will not get a single point and then suddenly you get 3-4 points. Some technology's are worth the same as some easy ones. What i mean is why do PhotoSystems for example worth the same amount of exp like Alien Domestication (that might not be true but you get the point), instead of there being different values to each tech.

I'm posting this so Ryika will hopefully implement the following mods into the Awesome Affinities:
--http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=510593643&searchtext=affinities
--http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=333993487&searchtext=affinities

This will make the game more immersive and ritualistic. Oh boy, so I was righting this and stumbled onto a great mod to that will force player to chose carefully their next tech.

--http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=364063169&searchtext=affinities
Values of the debuff should be reduced. This one is less important but i may help Ryika.

So with this mods implemented into Awesome Affinities the game will be so much better making the game so like this:
Land,
Next to me Firaxite and geothermal. (muffled I've Got The power in the distance),
Knowing my plan,
Starting to build lots of nodes even tho not needed,
Going full industry,
Getting them affinities,
Getting them unit,
Annihilate Kozlov,
SO MUCH ENERGY,
???
Win.

By that I mean i don't like to mish-mash bunch of affinities I like to go one a be really good at it. If I'm going supremacy spamming nodes, Harmony biowells, or Purity Domes that yield something. Marching those Unique Units to the enemy, felling they're power. So fun.

NOW ABOUT THE HYBRID AFFINITIES

The idea is nice but the execution not so much. Hybrid affinities should have they're unique building and units, unique play styles, and PLEASE INCREASE the affinities requirements. Why do i get the immortal at 3-3 that's so easy to get. Ultimate units at 6-6 I MEAN REALLY. I get that but accident. At least 8-8 or 10-10. So they need a change too.
There is lots more to talk about like:
What about the unique play styles,
What unique building,
New units maybe (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=553006),
Changes to affinities requirements ...

But for now this should be enough.

 

[hevans900]

This should be in the mod forum... but:

I'm posting this so Ryika will hopefully implement the following mods into the Awesome Affinities:
--http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=510593643&searchtext=affinities

This is already implemented in Rising Tide - stem techs already have 7/7 affinity points...?

--http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=333993487&searchtext=affinities

This is just a bad idea. The game already ends too fast to make any real use of hybrid units.

This will make the game more immersive and ritualistic. Oh boy, so I was righting this and stumbled onto a great mod to that will force player to chose carefully their next tech.

--http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=364063169&searchtext=affinities

NO NO NO NO NO - do you want people to have ANY incentive to play hybrid? Not to mention this makes absolutely no sense lore wise/immersion wise. Why should my colony find it harder to research photosystems if I'm a dominant purist?

 

[poom3619]

Welcome to the forum, Urkedurke. May I kindly teach you how to use private message?

 

[Lord Shadow]

I'd sooner make non-dominant affinities more difficult to raise than making related tech sources more difficult to research. The technologies themselves aren't the problem, but rather the affinity progression scale. You get plenty of random affinity increases, and tech costs would ramp up by 50% or more on many technologies without any conscious player decision, using that mod.

As for incentivizing hybridization, at the moment it's far too easy to reach the disproportionately advanced hybrid units, compared to their pure affinity analogues. It's simple, really: affinity 1-6 progression is easy, and doing it twice, especially in parallel, is markedly easier than doing the 7-12+ climb on a single affinity.

So if anything, hybridization should be harder to fully attain.

 

[leif erikson]

Moderator Action: Moved to this forum in C&C.

 

[Ryika]

Once I get around to updating the mod (Currently working on Awesome Stations -> Awesome Pods and Ruins -> Who knows what's next!) I'll change the Affinity progression. Early Techs (both, leaf and Branch) will yield less Affinity, later techs will yield more Affinity. That should also delay Affinity Units, especially the Hybrid ones, because one will need more expensive techs to get 2 Affinities up to that level (with the idea of still being available earlier than normal Units, just not that much).

Haven't thought too much about Hybrid Affinity Playstyles yet, so feel free to give your suggestions!

 

[Galgus]

In my opinion the game would benefit from both stronger affinity buildings and powerful ones requiring high levels of affinity.

Most would probably require levels of a single affinity that is hard to access by hybrids, though some truly hybrid buildings could exist.

Currently hybrids get two core affinities' buildings fairly easily, which would bias the game towards hybrids if the victory conditions weren't so poorly designed to be core only.

Just throwing in my two cents on affinity playstyles.

 

[Urkedurke]

This should be in the mod forum... but:

Well first off It should be in the mods forum but i didn't really know off its existence.

This is already implemented in Rising Tide - stem techs already have 7/7 affinity points...?

Now for you first answer:
True, its in the game but its not enough, some are lower but it 7-8 exp OR 20 exp for leaf techs. This mods makes it so that some techs like Alien Adaptation(the one that you get the ZenoSwarm) are 27 exp and Alien Science is worth 20 exp (the values might be off but you get the point).

This is just a bad idea. The game already ends too fast to make any real use of hybrid units.

Second answer:
Maybe, but i was just looking at the primary units not really thinking about hybrids.

NO NO NO NO NO - do you want people to have ANY incentive to play hybrid? Not to mention this makes absolutely no sense lore wise/immersion wise. Why should my colony find it harder to research photosystems if I'm a dominant purist?

Third answer:
This is true it would make me not want to go hybrids ever, oh but about the lore yes, I see the logic about PhotoSystems but that not the tech I mean. Lets say I'm all Supremacy, so naturally alien science is harder to get.

 

[Urkedurke]

I will try my best to think of some ideas tho I think I'm a bit too 'tupid for that Ryika-sempai.

 

[Urkedurke]

I'd sooner make non-dominant affinities more difficult to raise than making related tech sources more difficult to research. The technologies themselves aren't the problem, but rather the affinity progression scale. You get plenty of random affinity increases, and tech costs would ramp up by 50% or more on many technologies without any conscious player decision, using that mod.

The mods values it at too much i would make it so that its like 2% harder for each point in the dominant affinity for the affinity that has the least points and for the second affinity 1%, but alas hevans900 said it himself:

NO NO NO NO NO - do you want people to have ANY incentive to play hybrid? Not to mention this makes absolutely no sense lore wise/immersion wise. Why should my colony find it harder to research photosystems if I'm a dominant purist?

As for incentivizing hybridization, at the moment it's far too easy to reach the disproportionately advanced hybrid units, compared to their pure affinity analogues. It's simple, really: affinity 1-6 progression is easy, and doing it twice, especially in parallel, is markedly easier than doing the 7-12+ climb on a single affinity.
So if anything, hybridization should be harder to fully attain.

And for your second point I agree.

BTW I love you work.

 

[DefiantMars]

NOW ABOUT THE HYBRID AFFINITIES

The idea is nice but the execution not so much. Hybrid affinities should have they're unique building and units, unique play styles, and PLEASE INCREASE the affinities requirements. Why do i get the immortal at 3-3 that's so easy to get. Ultimate units at 6-6 I MEAN REALLY. I get that but accident. At least 8-8 or 10-10. So they need a change too.
There is lots more to talk about like:
What about the unique play styles,
What unique building,
New units maybe (http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=553006),
Changes to affinities requirements ...

But for now this should be enough.

Glad to see my unit concepts being flung around every now and then. The Ultimate units I felt were pretty... Not-ult worthy. (Well, maybe the Aquilon.) I targeted the units because I felt it was probably the easiest of the 4 points listed here. I wasn't sure where one would begin for Hybrid buildings.

The vaguest impressions of playstyle are present in the Affinity wheel perks and unit philosophies. But they lack any real definition as of now. I mean, even the core affinities are on the nebulous side.

 

[Galgus]

The issue with adding hybrid buildings is that hybrids already have the edge in buildings, typically gaining two sets of affinity buildings fairly early - though not all affinity buildings are very good.

Adding hybrid buildings would worsen this problem without some way to force them to commit to the hybrid, barring them from core affinity buildings and/or creating core affinity buildings that require such commitment.