animepornstar
Deity
beckenbauer, lead germany to a lot of victories as player and won wc 90 as manager. now he is the president for bayern münchen. i hope you understood the underlying meaning of this post.
Best Leader of History?
- Thread starter Fayadi
- Start date
Sultan Bhargash
Trickster Reincarnated
Julius Nyerere of Tanzania! The country went independent same time as Kenya and Uganda. THose countries went capitalist, Nyerere went for agrarian socialism. He also emphasized literacy in Swahili for the 140 different language tribes of his nation. He translated Juliu Ceasar into Swahili. He sent in the army that beat Idi Amin despite no funding from outside nations. The result, 30 years later, was that Tanzania was self sufficient in food production while most other African countries who had pressed their farmers into capital development faced famine and food subsidies. ALso, Tanzania remains a haven of peace while tribal fighting over resources has demolished most of its neighbors. Today, in Tanzania, Nyerere is scoffed by youngbloods who want mo'money right away and cant believe there isnt more "infrastructure" in the country. I like to point out to them that they would still be poor, they would just hate each other alot more...
joespaniel
Unescorted Settler
I've been to Kenya, and theyre doing just fine.
CurtSibling
ENEMY ACE™
- Joined
- Aug 31, 2001
- Messages
- 29,455
Originally posted by Juize
ROTFLMAO! It's a good thing that we have humorous people in CFC!
I'm sorry I do not speak USA abbreviation talk!
What the hell does ROTFLMAO mean?
Anyone?
CurtSibling
ENEMY ACE™
- Joined
- Aug 31, 2001
- Messages
- 29,455
Being from a region in Scotland that used to be called "Antium" by the resident Romans, I am quite aware of my Roman History.
I am also aware of JG Caesar's methods, but he's not any less bloody than any other warlord of the time.
He didn't kill millions of roman citizens in gas chambers or death factories like the "heroic" Stalin, or Adolf, did he?
Depends on what you see, really.
Sultan Bhargash
Trickster Reincarnated
Joespaniel, if you were moved enough to write that Kenya is "doing fine" how about including some details of your visit? Were you staying in expensive hotels on a paid safari where you would be treated like Young Buddha and not allowed to suffer, were you doing peace corps work in a small village far from paved roads where they are too poor to complain, or were you beaten and robbed by twelve year olds on the streets of Nairobi so they could have money to buy more gasoline to sniff?
Fayadi
Technocrat
Originally posted by CurtSibling
Being from a region in Scotland that used to be called "Antium" by the resident Romans, I am quite aware of my Roman History.
I am also aware of JG Caesar's methods, but he's not any less bloody than any other warlord of the time.
He didn't kill millions of roman citizens in gas chambers or death factories like the "heroic" Stalin, or Adolf, did he?
Depends on what you see, really.
Stalin?Gas Chamber never heard that?I guess it is Hitler 's way of killing,Stalin kills only his opponents........Millions died of Famine not by killing under Stalin,If not for Stalin USSR will not be superpower ,If not for USSR strength ,Germany will not be defeated,nobody credit him for that,USSR saves the world!
amadeus
Apply directly to the forehead
Once again Fayadi's wonderful Chinese Communist-run school has taught him pro-communal rhetoric.
The USSR never saved the world, and if it had "saved" the world from Hitler, it would have been Stalin to lead a campaign through Europe, and he would have been successful.
ROTFLMAO = Rolling On The Floor Laughing My Ass Off
RyanR75
Chieftain
What about George Washington? He did lead the Americans to establishing a new country, and this country is today's (supposedly) only surviving world superpower. If not Washington, then Abraham Lincoln, who united the South and the North. If his leadership wasn't there, there may be a CSA and a USA today. Think of how strange that would be! (And the consequences on world powers...)
~~
RyanR75
Go USA!
~~
RyanR75
Go USA!
Simon Darkshade
Mysterious City of Gold
quote:
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Originally posted by Fayadi
Stalin?Gas Chamber never heard that?I guess it is Hitler 's way of killing,Stalin kills only his opponents........Millions died of Famine not by killing under Stalin,If not for Stalin USSR will not be superpower ,If not for USSR strength ,Germany will not be defeated,nobody credit him for that,USSR saves the world!
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"Once again Fayadi's wonderful Chinese Communist-run school has taught him pro-communal rhetoric.
The USSR never saved the world, and if it had "saved" the world from Hitler, it would have been Stalin to lead a campaign through Europe, and he would have been successful."
Actually, what he said made sense, in a rather perverse manner, and I think those were "pro-communist" values rather than "pro-communal".
So, grasshoppers, let us look at what the man said:
1.) Stalin did not use gas chambers, Hitler did.
This is correct, Stalin had people shot. No problems there.
2.)Stalin kills only his opponents.
Again, this is correct, in a perversely twisted way. From the perspective of Joe Stalin, they were his opponents, if only in his own dark mind. Thus, even though his paranoia had no basis whatsoever in reality, the notion makes a small modicum of sense. Most dictators kill their the opponents, not their friends. Hitler did, even though they were undeserving.
So what we have here is a case of some garbled sense coming through
3.)Millions died of Famine not by killing under Stalin
Millions did die only of famine. Millions more died of shooting or other means. So this to is correct in a sense, but it was probably not intended to be taken this way, but rather the one we have seen before
4.)If not for Stalin USSR will not be superpower
This is arguable, but Stalin did play a role in the industrialisation of the USSR, and in WW2, his staying out of matters military, as compared to Hitler did play a role. So this is true to a certain limited extent.
5.)If not for USSR strength ,Germany will not be defeated
This is a matter that has been heavily debated, by historians, and on these boards. In short, the role of the USSR was very important in the defeat of Germany, so there is again some unintended hidden merit.
6.)USSR saves the world!
This is very shaky upon first appearences, but it can be twisted to suit any meaning you like. If the defeat of Germany counts as saving the world, then perhaps. My own, very twisted interpretation is that the USSR did save the world. By collapsing, and doing so RELATIVELY peacefully.
My point? He may write this, and we condemn it as we know that a lot of it is on shaky historical grounds. But, if you can take the most vehment ideological rhetoric possible, and look at it in isolation and objectively, then we are better able to understand WHY Fayadi and others still think this.
(Warning: The above analysis is the product of an evil, bored mind and a darkhearted bastard. Evil Enterprises Inc. takes no responsbility for the veracity of the above comments.)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Fayadi
Stalin?Gas Chamber never heard that?I guess it is Hitler 's way of killing,Stalin kills only his opponents........Millions died of Famine not by killing under Stalin,If not for Stalin USSR will not be superpower ,If not for USSR strength ,Germany will not be defeated,nobody credit him for that,USSR saves the world!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Once again Fayadi's wonderful Chinese Communist-run school has taught him pro-communal rhetoric.
The USSR never saved the world, and if it had "saved" the world from Hitler, it would have been Stalin to lead a campaign through Europe, and he would have been successful."
Actually, what he said made sense, in a rather perverse manner, and I think those were "pro-communist" values rather than "pro-communal".
So, grasshoppers, let us look at what the man said:
1.) Stalin did not use gas chambers, Hitler did.
This is correct, Stalin had people shot. No problems there.
2.)Stalin kills only his opponents.
Again, this is correct, in a perversely twisted way. From the perspective of Joe Stalin, they were his opponents, if only in his own dark mind. Thus, even though his paranoia had no basis whatsoever in reality, the notion makes a small modicum of sense. Most dictators kill their the opponents, not their friends. Hitler did, even though they were undeserving.
So what we have here is a case of some garbled sense coming through
3.)Millions died of Famine not by killing under Stalin
Millions did die only of famine. Millions more died of shooting or other means. So this to is correct in a sense, but it was probably not intended to be taken this way, but rather the one we have seen before
4.)If not for Stalin USSR will not be superpower
This is arguable, but Stalin did play a role in the industrialisation of the USSR, and in WW2, his staying out of matters military, as compared to Hitler did play a role. So this is true to a certain limited extent.
5.)If not for USSR strength ,Germany will not be defeated
This is a matter that has been heavily debated, by historians, and on these boards. In short, the role of the USSR was very important in the defeat of Germany, so there is again some unintended hidden merit.
6.)USSR saves the world!
This is very shaky upon first appearences, but it can be twisted to suit any meaning you like. If the defeat of Germany counts as saving the world, then perhaps. My own, very twisted interpretation is that the USSR did save the world. By collapsing, and doing so RELATIVELY peacefully.
My point? He may write this, and we condemn it as we know that a lot of it is on shaky historical grounds. But, if you can take the most vehment ideological rhetoric possible, and look at it in isolation and objectively, then we are better able to understand WHY Fayadi and others still think this.
(Warning: The above analysis is the product of an evil, bored mind and a darkhearted bastard. Evil Enterprises Inc. takes no responsbility for the veracity of the above comments.)
Fayadi
Technocrat
Communist what Communist ?I dun live in China(but plans to) and only been there once.I am Indonesian Born Chinese who study in Singapore,sick of hearing communist run school..Too narrowminded!? I dun like the Chinese govt,i find it strange i am talking about my fav leader as Stalin and u jumped to moron conclusion I am being brainwashed?Strange i guess....Things are not as simple as u think and i find u r quick to underestimate people..Rmshape sorry i find u r stupid and too short sighted of thinking me being brainwashed,u dont even kniw what Chinese schools like,what they taught,i dont even know too ,u r talking with ur wild opinion i guess.
CurtSibling
ENEMY ACE™
- Joined
- Aug 31, 2001
- Messages
- 29,455
Fayadi,
I hope you will learn more about China once you live there a while.
I find your views on Stalin and his sinister career to be odd.
And please if you do not under stand Europe's history do not make crazy statements about it!
Stalin did not save the world! Come ON!
Don't be so reckless with your words...
Millions of dead Russians did the real job of stopping the Third Reich's eastern agenda, not Stalin.
He just killed off people, He was only a political despot.
The USA and UK along with 49 allied nations (including China) also played the role of stopping the Axis's plans.
So don't be tempted to get carried away in the "epic" histroy, remember the human struggle.
The countless acts of silent heroism from civilians in occupied Europe,
The hidden agony of millions of Jews, Disabled, Gays, Kulaks, Gypsies, and all the others cursed by the evil dictators (like your beloved Stalin)
The boy soldiers from Allied and Axis sides, not to mention thousands of young kids killed in Germany, pressed into service by a desperate despot.
The Merchant saliors, civil engineers, nurses, padres, all the non-combatants...
War ain't just about glorious soldiers, Fayadi.
Remember war affects the real people too.
PS
This post is not designed to offend you, but educate you further.
If you choose to answer it with rhetoric and anger, I will just take my dissapointment in you and say no more.
Hope you get my point...
Fayadi
Technocrat
Come on CurtSibbling thought we are friends?I wont be angry in these sort of stuffs,I am a happy go lucky person,i was angered by keep on hearing people calling me brainwashed by govt and i feel that they are underestimating that Chinese people are too stupid to be brainwashed,if they think Chinese are so easily brainwashed,why many chinese students dont like the govt,stupid right?I listen to views curt ,I NEVER answer with "rhetoric and anger" . dont think bad of me curt ,I find u r nice person ,and a hope a nice person wont think bad of me and we can always debate professionally even though there are disagreements
Regarding USSR saves the world,I think I have put that wrongly,USSR plays a major role in saving the world,ok now
if u think the evil superpower of the world has defeated the good superpower,what makes u think the evil superpower wont conquer the world if nobody could be able to resist them,
Anyway get my point a great leader no need to be a caring,loving one.Alexander the great,Gengkish Khan they all ruthless too
Of course I dont like Stalin's way of killing or harsh rule that millions died,I like his positive side and contribution ,no leader is perfect .A favourite or a great leader is liked because of their positive side not negative side
,and a hope a nice person wont think bad of me and we can always debate professionally even though there are disagreementsRegarding USSR saves the world,I think I have put that wrongly,USSR plays a major role in saving the world,ok now
if u think the evil superpower of the world has defeated the good superpower,what makes u think the evil superpower wont conquer the world if nobody could be able to resist them,
Anyway get my point a great leader no need to be a caring,loving one.Alexander the great,Gengkish Khan they all ruthless too
Of course I dont like Stalin's way of killing or harsh rule that millions died,I like his positive side and contribution ,no leader is perfect .A favourite or a great leader is liked because of their positive side not negative side
It must be Alexander The Great - who else is known as 'The Great'?
"When Alexander saw the breadth of his domain, he wept, for there were no more worlds to conquer"
- anon. (attr. Milton)
Julius Caesar was once asked about the world's great leaders:
"To which Caesar made answer seriously, 'For my part, I had rather be the first man among these fellows, than the second man in Rome.' It is said that another time, when free from business in Spain, after reading some part of the history of Alexander, he sat a great while very thoughtful, and at last burst out into tears. His friends were surprised, and asked him the reason of it. 'Do you think,' said he, 'I have not just cause to weep, when I consider that Alexander at my age had conquered so many nations, and I have all this time done nothing that is memorable?'"
- Plutarch
Alexander the Great died at the age of 33. He had conquered the known world at an age where the more substandard kind of ruler has only just had the notion of going into politics.
No contest, really.
"When Alexander saw the breadth of his domain, he wept, for there were no more worlds to conquer"
- anon. (attr. Milton)
Julius Caesar was once asked about the world's great leaders:
"To which Caesar made answer seriously, 'For my part, I had rather be the first man among these fellows, than the second man in Rome.' It is said that another time, when free from business in Spain, after reading some part of the history of Alexander, he sat a great while very thoughtful, and at last burst out into tears. His friends were surprised, and asked him the reason of it. 'Do you think,' said he, 'I have not just cause to weep, when I consider that Alexander at my age had conquered so many nations, and I have all this time done nothing that is memorable?'"
- Plutarch
Alexander the Great died at the age of 33. He had conquered the known world at an age where the more substandard kind of ruler has only just had the notion of going into politics.
No contest, really.
animepornstar
Deity
some years ago a man from hungary came to my school to talk about his experiences from ussr prison camps in siberia. he was a partisan fighting against the germans during ww2, but when the war ended the russian sent him to sibiria for preparing a american invasion of soviet. he was just allowed to sleep two hours per 24 h and was close to die many times, which many of the other prisoners did. he was finally set free after ten years, not because of any legal reason, it was beacuse stalin has died.
Well, yes, Genghis Khan was so successful because he revolutionised the way wars were fought. He moved so quickly that he tended to arrive at the next town before they received news that the previous town had been sacked. It was large-scale rushing tactics. All members of the Mongol army were mounted, and his army would often hold as many as 250,000 men. He also never attacked the most powerful cities until he had a crushing majority of fighters, and his spy network had sounded out weaknesses.
He was a good diplomat, obviously as he united all the warring Mongolian tribes and chieftains by the age of 25.
At the end, his empire stretched from Poland to China.
Genghis Khan's family was Mongolian semi-aristocracy as well, but was brought down by local trouble while Genghis was still young.
One of the greats, to be sure, but he lived 'til he was sixty. What would Alexander have done with another thirty years?
I'd give him a top 3, personally.
He was a good diplomat, obviously as he united all the warring Mongolian tribes and chieftains by the age of 25.
At the end, his empire stretched from Poland to China.
Genghis Khan's family was Mongolian semi-aristocracy as well, but was brought down by local trouble while Genghis was still young.
One of the greats, to be sure, but he lived 'til he was sixty. What would Alexander have done with another thirty years?
I'd give him a top 3, personally.
Animepornstar,
My father, aunt, grandma, grandad and great grandma were sent to the Siberian camps by that wonderful humanitarian Joe Stalin. That's what you got for being a Pole with a lot of land (a gift from the Tzar to my great-grandfather, a long, interesting and unbelievable-to-many story.)
My family have no love whatsoever for that sicko. And if you even thought of naming a child 'Joe', well.....
My father, aunt, grandma, grandad and great grandma were sent to the Siberian camps by that wonderful humanitarian Joe Stalin. That's what you got for being a Pole with a lot of land (a gift from the Tzar to my great-grandfather, a long, interesting and unbelievable-to-many story.)
My family have no love whatsoever for that sicko. And if you even thought of naming a child 'Joe', well.....
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