Blind Tech/Civic Option in CIV VI?

[AntSou]

I think seeing how CIV VI brought back the idea of organic technological advancement, represented by tech and civic boosts, this idea could be taken even further.

One way to do that would be to have not one but two boosts (or even three) to each tech, all of them hidden. The game would automatically research the tech or civic which has had the most boosts triggered. Three boosts represent 100% researched, so you can potentially get a new tech by triggering all the boosts. These would be drawn from a pool of up to six, so that each game is different.

This blocks Civs from bee-lining and early tech and civic advancement would depend entirely on your environment and how your Civ reacts to it.

Upon discovery of Scientific Theory you'd finally be able to direct research. The Enlightenment does the same for Civics.

Furthermore, techs and civics are passively adopted by neighbouring Civs at a certain rate per turn (e.g. 2% per turn), depending on distance, roads, etc. Open borders and other diplomatic choices can speed this process up. Certain techs such as Printing Press and Globalisation can speed this even further, but you can use secrecy policies, buildings, governor abilities and spies to slow the rate of adoption of your own techs/civics by enemy Civs, or speed up your own adoption of foreign techs/civics.

I doubt such a game option would be added to the game, but do you find this interesting?

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

I believe there is already a Mod (although I don't know if it still works after GS and the latest Patch) that provides 'blind' Eurekas in that it scrambles exactly which Eureka applies to which Tech so that each game they are different. I posted some time ago my own solution, which is to have 3 Bonuses for each Tech, which you can get in any sequence but the first would always give a 10% Bonus, the second 15%, and the third 20%, for a total slightly better than the original 40% from a single Eureka. The idea is to really reward concentrating on a given line of research but, by increasing the Base Cost of the Techs, make 'casual' research much more difficult.

Scientific Theory doesn't really allow you to 'direct' Research, it just speeds up the application of human effort to research. Directed Research comes first, from the Scientific organizations of the late Renaissance like the Royal Academy or the major universities (Cambridge, Oxford in Britain, Sorbonne in France) and, then, even more, with the Government and Industry sponsored research of the Modern/Atomic Eras - Bell Labs, Max Planck Institute in Germany, Office of Scientific Research in the USA in WWII and its successor, DARPA, etc.

The other side of those Accelerators of research is that the Societies also coincide with increased publishing of scientific discoveries, so that the 'passive' spread of research is also accelerated in the Industrial, Modern, and Atomic Eras tremendously. In fact, I'd go so far as to say that there were no real Scientific Secrets in the 20th century, just an inability to make use of them by a given country for lack of an advanced enough Industrial Capacity. For example, everybody knew about Germany's Haber Process for manufacturing Nitrates for explosives (and fertilizer) in WWI, but France, Britain and the USA all had access to plenty of natural Nitrate deposits so didn't need it and hadn't bothered to develop the advanced chemical industry Germany had to take advantage of the new Technology. By the late 1930s everybody knew about atomic theory but only the USA had the resources available to develop a working nuclear 'pile' and later, to turn theory into an atomic weapon - at the end of the war, Germany still didn't even have a working reactor, because the knowledge was there, but not the industrial resources.

 

[AntSou]

Thanks for the History bit.

Assuming the idea above of blind research and the ability to direct research at some point, what then do you think should unlock that ability? The first University? A plaza building? Traditionally new mechanics are unlocked by researching a new tech or entering a new age.

I think the passive spread should slowly increase upon discovery of some techs, and by the modern and atomic age the spread should be fairly quick. That could help the AI not trail too hard behind the human player. Those going for culture or science victories would still have the advantage.

This would also give an additional purpose to dark and golden ages. Depending on what kind of age you find yourself in, you may suffer penalties or bonuses to spread in your empire.

I found the mod you mentioned, and it seems to be up to date! You can even hide the boost trigger and the guy made a bunch of them so that they can be randomised at the beginning of the game. It's fairly close to what I was asking. Thanks! This has made me quite excited.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=886630163

Also, I just found out it's the same guy behind Real Strategy. He seems to have some good mods in his page.

 

[AntSou]

So I just loaded a new game with the mod and tried the invisible trigger option. At first I thought it didn't work, then I started reading the 'triggers'.

Edit: Unlocked foreign trade!

This is so good.

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

Thanks for the History bit.

Assuming the idea above of blind research and the ability to direct research at some point, what then do you think should unlock that ability? The first University? A plaza building? Traditionally new mechanics are unlocked by researching a new tech or entering a new age.

The Civ VI University Tech is Medieval Era (Education), which is too early. However, the Renaissance Tech Printing comes at about the right time, and has a justification (if we need one!) in that after the first bunch of bibles were printed, most of the early printed books were non-fiction 'manuals' on practical technology and techniques. That put a lot of information in circulation for people to work with, and it contributed hugely to the spread of new technology throughout Europe.

I think the passive spread should slowly increase upon discovery of some techs, and by the modern and atomic age the spread should be fairly quick. That could help the AI not trail too hard behind the human player. Those going for culture or science victories would still have the advantage.

This would also give an additional purpose to dark and golden ages. Depending on what kind of age you find yourself in, you may suffer penalties or bonuses to spread in your empire.

Some candidates for Spreading technology Techs would be, I think:
Classical Era:
Mathematics
Medieval Era:
Education
Renaissance Era:
Printing
Industrial Era:
Scientific Theory
Modern Era:
Chemistry
Atomic Era:
Computers
Information Era:
Telecommunications

I think keeping the 'boost' down to one tech per Era is about right. The amount of the Boost should vary so that it is comparable to the Tech Cost in each Era, keeping the boost at least equally if not slightly increasingly effective in spreading the technology around.

I found the mod you mentioned, and it seems to be up to date! You can even hide the boost trigger and the guy made a bunch of them so that they can be randomised at the beginning of the game. It's fairly close to what I was asking. Thanks! This has made me quite excited.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=886630163

Also, I just found out it's the same guy behind Real Strategy. He seems to have some good mods in his page.

Sounds like he's improved the Mod since I tried it some time ago. I'll have to fire up a game and try it out again!

 

[TahamiTsunami]

Looks like there's another mod that I'll have to check out!

 

[The googles do nothing]

I doubt such a game option would be added to the game, but do you find this interesting?

It depends on how much difficulty it adds to the game. I played a game this weekend called 'The captain is dead' and and one of the aspects of the game is maintaining the ability to see what problems are happening next. The first two games we played we lost quickly and a big factor was that didn't know what was coming. Once we were able to find ways of knowing what came what was coming next.

Assuming the idea above of blind research and the ability to direct research at some point, what then do you think should unlock that ability? The first University? A plaza building? Traditionally new mechanics are unlocked by researching a new tech or entering a new age.

Building Wonders should be on the list. Perhaps not permanently direct research but someone had to think about how to get that cap on the top of the pyramid.