BOTM 108 - Final Spoiler - Game submitted or abandoned

[kcd_swede]

BOTM 108 - Catherine at Ladies Night - Final Spoiler

[img=right]http://gotm.civfanatics.net/civ4games/images/botm108civ.jpg[/img]

So how did your game after 1AD go?
Did you get an "Attitude Adjustment" at Ladies Night?


Reading Requirements

Stop! If you are participating in BOTM 108 then you MUST NOT read this thread unless

• You have submitted your entry

Posting Restrictions

• Do not post any savegame file from the game. Discussions and screenshots are fine but not actual games.

 

[MarleysGh0st]

After 1 AD, I completed the Colossus and the Mausoleum.

Boudica got into a war with Victoria and Elizabeth. I attacked Boudica in 1030 and captured Gergovia in 1080, but I had to immediately make peace to prevent her from recapturing it with a large stack she had in reserve. Boudica then capitulated to Victoria in 1260, which ended any idea I had of further land wars.

I built the Great Library and I was first to Liberalism, taking Nationalism as my free tech, but I traded that away too soon, allowing Elizabeth to finish the Taj Mahal first, despite my head start.

I settled down for a space race, while Isabella attacked Elizabeth and was soundly beaten by her and became an English vassal. Boudica broke free from Victoria, so I took advantage of the opportunity to attack, conquering three cities (with Victoria taking one more) before I accepted Boudica's capitulation.

I built the Space Elevator, I had finished eight spaceship components and had all but one of the required space techs to finish it, and all seemed well.

And then Elizabeth won a Cultural Victory in 1958.

 

[georgjorge]

I retired from this game.

Shortly after 1AD, the game was completely won with regard to military (Horse Archers!). The game was also completely lost economically. By that point I had killed off three AIs and taken all their cities (plus founded a few of my own), for about 20 cities. I thought I could get to Domination that way, especially since "ah it's only Monarch maintenance is low there". I made a few errors though...

1. Got a Great Merchant and used it to bulb Metal Casting since I thought it would be useful. I definitely should have done the trade mission to stay afloat longer and tech Code of Laws which I never got due to crashed economy - Courthouses would have been kinda crucial.

2. On the other hand, I wrongly played with the mindset of "don't go into strike". Which is right almost always but not here. I played on for some time afterwards, and permanent strike didn't cost me anything. I didn't need any more units except Settlers (Hatty had built the Great Wall for me). So instead of building Wealth in many cities I should just have built Settlers, founded enough for Domination all along the arctic, and won early while in permanent strike.


I also thought I would get domination treshold much earlier. This screenshot shows my cities at 1150AD.

Spoiler :

To me, looking at the small map almost everything is covered in red. But I barely break 60% land (population is quite over the threshold). What gives?


Anyway, thanks for this very enjoyable game!

 

[georgjorge]

Out of curiosity, I replayed from my 580AD save when Hatty was gone (so far, far too late to change tactics). I whipped out 15 Settlers and then put everything on Research instead of Wealth. The result?

Spoiler :

Keep in mind that at this point many cities for many turns had been building stupid stuff like Granaries, Lighthouses or Workboats - and above all: Wealth - when all that was needed was Horse Archers (enough to kill Hatty) and Settlers. I can easily imagine 500-700 AD Domination without all those things. Permanent strike is your best friend here.

It's worth noting that I was going by the description of strike of the Civilopedia. There it states that permanent strike will first disband units, then destroy buildings and even stop production in cities. Most of that didn't happen. True, I had no roaming units left (one garrison per city stayed) and no Workers but I never lost a Settler to strike and production of Settlers never stopped. Under these circumstances - being Creative and having the Great Wall up - permanent strike isn't scary at all.

It is also worth noting that for the cost of losing all my workers (keeping the Horse Archers as garrison in all my cities) I could easily have gotten Code of Laws in just four turns by producing nothing but Research everywhere.

And: even after many turns of strike, so almost all my army disbanded, I am still the most powerful of the remaining three.

I might try some more striking for Cuir breakouts to stay at 100% research when all my army consists of Warrior garrisons and my workers don't have anything left to do ; )

 

[Minou]

After spending many hours on a mediocre Space Victory last BOTM, I was interested in trying something faster for this one and set out for a quick AP victory. My original plan was to build the Oracle for Theology while having a bunch of workers start building the presumably long roads into AI territories needed to get Missionaries around quickly. Given that I anticipated a relatively short game, I settled in place and quickly took the Gold and Silver sites as cities 2 and 3 merely to work those tiles and speed towards Priesthood and Monotheism.

Things feel apart rapidly. My first scout, and then my replacement scout and a scouting warrior were all eaten by animals / killed by barbarians, which combined with the maze distance and the "corner" start resulted in my having met only 3 of the 5 AIs even as late as 1000BC.

In 1640BC, the Oracle was built in a distant land. This was a bit of a surprise on Monarch but it sounds like others saw it go even earlier so I suppose one of the AIs started near Marble. I considered quitting once the Oracle was gone, but decided to push on and research Theocracy. Though many turns slower than the Oracle plan, I managed at least to not be beaten out by an AI lightbulb. Right around this time though I misclicked and agreed to a demand to close borders with someones worst enemy - normally not horrible but in this case it was Boudica and now the path for my missionaries was closed. Even if I convinced her to reopen or sailed past, it was going to take centuries for those Missionaries to walk to the farthest AIs.

The whole situation was too demoralizing, so I decided to call it a day and save my energy for the BOTM that starts tomorrow. In retrospect, I probably picked the worst victory condition for this type of map.

 

[georgjorge]

Yeah, miscklicks such as these are really harsh in those games! Better luck in the next one...

 

[neilmeister]

georgjorge, tough game!

I learned the hard way in HoF trying to get fastest dominations.... the timing to mass whip settlers is crucial and hard to get right. I have had many, many games where I am a few turns behind the curve. Its horrible being stuck 1% below domination and your settlers all die due to strike before they can settle.

Anyway, I had a similiar start, but backed off when my economy was hurting. I ended with a Conquest win in 1545ad.
And I managed to have just 1 battle with a Cossack.... shame really as they are uber

 

[georgjorge]

The thing is, as I learned in this game (and in other threads after that): Settlers never die to strike!

So with Great Wall for barb defense + Creative + all the AIs far away and weak, early permanent strike would definitely have been the way to go here.

 

[kcd_swede]

The thing is, as I learned in this game (and in other threads after that): Settlers never die to strike!

So with Great Wall for barb defense + Creative + all the AIs far away and weak, early permanent strike would definitely have been the way to go here.

That's one of the nice things about the GOTM series- there is always something to learn.

 

[greatbeyond]

Culture loss to Elizabeth in 1975AD

I went for the all out military option right away, beelining to Horse Archers. With Chariots I was able to eliminate Boudica, then with Horse Archers I came close to being able to eliminate Victoria but couldn't quite get her capital due to protective Archers and then Longbowmen. Instead I periodically attacked to pillage her into the stone age.

At the same time I had shipped units to Spain and was busy razing cities and the countryside, effectively keeping her in the dark ages until late in the game. I had met Elizabeth but left her alone as I didn't quite have a quick route to get to her. So at the same time I was at war with Spain and Vicky land, I declared on Hatty who was starting to expand northward up her peninsula. With a terrible rng I came within .3 strength of her remaining archer in her 3rd city, to rolling her up. However she was able to rush units in and I satisfied myself with blocking her in. I didn't realize until much later how much land she could settle to the south.

My economy crashed and took awhile to get back into shape. From there I tried to play catch up but Elizabeth pulled away and was way ahead of the rest of us in techs. My earlier war mongering apparently kept everyone but Elizabeth in the tech dark ages. It also affected wonders as the Pyramids didn't get completed until 1655AD. I played out the rest of the game trying to keep the peace and catch Elizabeth but it was not to be.

It was a different map and the 4 wide setting made city placement decisions harder.

 

[georgjorge]

It also affected wonders as the Pyramids didn't get completed until 1655AD.

Yes, economic crashes and Horse Archers seem to go together really well!

Would you have been able to take Viccy's cities if you hadn't fought Isabella and Hatty as well at the same time?

 

[greatbeyond]

After trying a couple of replays, tech research seemed to hold some of the answer as going for currency first then picking up calendar enabled me to stay afloat while warring with just Hatty and Vicky.

My strategy in my first try and submitted save probably should have left one of them out of the fight until later. Liz and Izzy seem to be natural enemies, so perhaps it should have been her.

Vicky was fortunate to settle her early cities on hills. That combined with the protective bonus was just too much.

 

[High King J.J.]

Once again I fail to submit a game. Just couldn't keep awake while playing this. Also spreading the red plague across the map wasn't my idea of a worthy cause. I'd rather annihilate Russia than work expanding it. Enough of my people have given their lives defending against these 's instruments on earth.

So when is Botm 110 going to start? And let it be something other than a commie leader or country.

 

[kcd_swede]

Once again I fail to submit a game. Just couldn't keep awake while playing this. Also spreading the red plague across the map wasn't my idea of a worthy cause. I'd rather annihilate Russia than work expanding it. Enough of my people have given their lives defending against these 's instruments on earth.

So when is Botm 110 going to start? And let it be something other than a commie leader or country.

Too bad the game was no fun for you. In my history, Catherine and her prodigy were the victims of the red plague before anyone in your homeland, so you should have taken it with the idea of forestalling the marxist proletariat revolt thru good govt... or crushing your opponents. I guess the answer is that as a Tzar, you failed to forestall the red plague- try harder next time... that is the fun of a game.

 

[High King J.J.]

kcd, I just couldn't stay awake. It doesn't mean I didn't enjoy the game.
When you get this you sometimes need more .
I was the leading power with Mining inc. and sushi just waiting for a GMerchant to found it, I had at least 4 transports loaded full of T-34's to take Spain but just couldn't keep my eyes open. But our civ colour was red so the red plague was spreading on the map even if I never went state property.

Spoiler :

Putin is visiting my country. He has claimed that Russia has no troops closer than 1500 km from Finnish border. That would mean his closest forces are behind the Ural mountains in Asia. I guess he's gotten so used to lying at home in Russia that he doesn't see any reason to stop when abroad. And apparently he thinks like Hitler did: when lying, lie big. Just like Mr. Nimoy quotes on the BtS tech Fascism: "The great masses of the people..."

 

[Deckhand]

I also thought I would get domination treshold much earlier. This screenshot shows my cities at 1150AD.

Spoiler :

To me, looking at the small map almost everything is covered in red. But I barely break 60% land (population is quite over the threshold). What gives?

Anyway, thanks for this very enjoyable game!

You haven't uncovered much of the map!
None of the arctic. Very little of Spain and only half of Elizabethan England.

But yes, this map made domination harder with so much arctic/antarctic and so hard to "visit" the other civs.

Once again I fail to submit a game. Just couldn't keep awake while playing this.

Once again I was pushing the submission deadline and forcing myself to stay awake.

Would have taken any victory. Cossacks had taken White England and were starting on Spain. Hoping for Isabella capitulation or enough for domination.
Won third vote for Religious Victory (Hatty (remaining half) was my vassal); too few votes first two, but took just enough from Spain to win it. iirc, I was about 6 votes from being ineligible as able to vote myself in (of course, if I was awake enough I could have given cities to Hatty and waited for the next victory vote).

Submitted 30 minutes before the deadline!

Spoiler :

3:30 am Pacific Time Zone

 

[neilmeister]

The thing is, as I learned in this game (and in other threads after that): Settlers never die to strike!

Really???

Hmmm, maybe it was Vanilla or something... but anyway, I am glad to learn something!

 

[georgjorge]

After writing that, I read the thread for the current G-Major, where the reason for that was revealed by WastinTime: Apparently, Settlers are coded as having a production cost of zero (while Workers have 60 on Standard) and units with zero production cost never die to strike! To me it seems like an oversight by Firaxis rather than intended. But I wouldn't hold my breath for the next patch

I'm not sure what other units there are with zero production cost besides Great People and Great Generals.

 

[Deckhand]

After writing that, I read the thread for the current G-Major, where the reason for that was revealed by WastinTime: Apparently, Settlers are coded as having a production cost of zero (while Workers have 60 on Standard) and units with zero production cost never die to strike! To me it seems like an oversight by Firaxis rather than intended. But I wouldn't hold my breath for the next patch

I'm not sure what other units there are with zero production cost besides Great People and Great Generals.

Seems intended to me. Similar to how unhappy citizens don't hamper building settlers and workers.