BOTM 51 Final Spoiler - Game submitted or abandoned

neilmeister

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BOTM 51 Final Spoiler



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Stop! If you are participating in BOTM 51 then you MUST NOT read this thread unless
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..........................................

How did you go at Immortal?

Did you have fun? (What did you like, what did you not like about the game?)

But most importantly, Did you complete the Sampo challenge?
 
Well, that didn't go so well.

I really put alot of work into this half-hearted attempt at a science victory.
Pacal II launched a full ship while I was poking around launching something
I built in my backyard.

Oddly, it never got off the ground.
I did finally hop a boat and went to the little island on the left and the longer
island on the right.
I'm just not "wet rex" skilled.
My plans of getting the lowest losing score >0 might not pan out.

Moral of this story ... don't play sleep deprived just because you're excited.
... get some sleep and play with a clear head 8)

Still, there is always BotM52 ... let me check the calendar on that.
:cry:
 
I was reading your event log.... it looked like a long hard struggle.
 
One city diplo 1862AD.

This played more like Emporer than Immortal to me. Over-powered BFC and small maps (less AI) helps with one city attempts.

Should have won at least 20 turns earlier but I made a foolish tech trade with Alex late in the game and got a -3 penalty from GK for worst enemy blah blah blah. Took some time to decrease to -2 and in the meantime GK researched Fascism so I was able to get +1 from civics (police state). On the bright side, that allowed me to complete Cristo for the Sampo challenge in 1832AD. Not going to win any awards, but oh well.

Also could have shaved off some turns if I'd found the crazy fishing grounds earlier where Pacal had 4 cities...which guaranteed he would be the UN opponent. Wasted several missionaries going to Pacal rather than GK in the 1600 timeframe.

Highlights after 1AD:
500AD second GE which was saved for the UN (first went to rush Pyramids)
980AD Alex/Pacal go to war with GK, reducing the threat of DoW on me
1030AD - converted Alex to Confu
1190AD liberalism->Electricity sling. Couldn't pull off the Radio sling so I had to hard-research Radio (and use two GArt bulbs).
1230AD - converted Boudica to Confu
1695AD Mass Media finished with research + 1 GA bulb
1700-1800AD spreading Confu to GK so he would get out of his Hindu religion. Couldn't convert him to Confu, but he went to Free Religion. Good enough.
1832AD Cristo Ren SAMPO
1834AD UN <-- building it sooner would have been smart for some other resolutions.

Lost the first UN diplo vote (expected). Very little chance of war at that point, so just waited for the diplo modifiers to improve with GK and won on the 2nd vote.

Built 30+ Confu missionaries this game to overcome the bad religious spread of the AI. Took a lot of hammers away from research and slowed me down. GK founded Hindu. Pacal founded Bud/Jud. Boudica founded Christianity. I founded Confu/Tao. Not sure who founded Islam...probably Pacal.

I was surprised we didn't have any strategic resources in the culture reach of the capital...not that it mattered much in my game. Someone will really milk this game for base score with all those fish (Sushi corps). :splat:

cas
 
Space Victory 1988 :sad: Couldn't get that diplo victory was trying for :crazyeye:

Space was way too late to give a good standing, but I was suckered in to building Christo Redentor and was constantly delayed by having to beef up the forces and researching what was not necessary, due to the threatening neighbors, who kept going to war with each other - figured I was next.... Christo Redentor built late in 1735.

Still... for a space victory - it was a fun game - Thanks for setup!

Never went to war as I had tech lead most of game, and only had 12 cities, with the last three captured from barbs to get oil, iron and copper.
 
Around 1800 I had tech and power lead, but it was far tooo late for good score. I think I could finish with 100k, so I decided to go for Crapthalon and delayed victory by a century. Culture 1980 AD.
Milking Sushi will just send Cow score to space! I installed Sushi in few cities, food +50 or something like that...
 
Got my butt kicked on this one, but did learn some valuable lessons like the use of forts (id never seen the point before!) was massively behind on tech till 1600s when i overtook all but pacal. I have noticed in previous games that I am TOO carefull when DOWing, I go for absolute certainty of a win (often twice over!) and am sure this has delayed most of my wins and left my scores weak. So this time I thought id man up and cut it a bit finer... too fine. launched a stack against the celts that I figured would reasonably safe// celts then vassaled to GK who landed a stack of trebs and cannons and halted my invasion. had to struggle to nick 2 of GKs outlying cities to give him one back for peace. Rebuilt my army and found the right number of troops on the second attempt to take and hold the western islands that had been celtic. Launched into peaceful expansion and caught up in tech and strength etc, built the UN but lost control to pacal who had enough votes on his own! noticed then that pacal was already building a spaceship and had lots of mech inf to defend himself. knew that in civ 3 taking the capital killed of the spaceship.. so waited for modern armour and went in heavy as per my old method.. took his capital and the other big city on the island but he still had his spaceship! how do you kill it? hope sabotage project is not the only way as I dont invest heavily in EP. Decide to carry on with war as it was a walkover and my only chance of stopping his space race, I ask pacal what he wants for peace to see how worried he is..(ie does he want paying or is he willing to pay me/ capitulate) and accidentally accept his offer! was tired... so game over from there really no choice but to reload as he is only a few turns from launch. Didnt find the great big signature W till I invaded Pacal! surrounded by fish/ rice. I own sids sushi so would have liked to spot that early. Not got the knack of corps yet at the moment they are just costing me LOTS of gold know I need too spread to enemies to cover costs but dont want to give them the food advantage...Also dont have the excess health /happies to run enough merchants to cover costs so sids sushi is a millstone at the mo. Gave up and reloaded about 1999 so probably would have got myself another lowest scoring even if I had snuck a victory anyway!:) Good game tho.. not had much practice at island maps as all my learning games were on huge Pangaea, have noticed tho that the AI is very poor at attacking land on wet maps.. which adds a big safety margin.. Still great game good challenge, thank you!:worship: (an keep em coming!)
 
Till 1300 AD nothing special happened. All this time all AIs where in WHEOOHRN mode.
Small detour for Literature (GLib in 560 AD) and I continued building my navy, which meant Machinery 475 AD and Optics 640 AD. The same year I constructed Colossus in my second city. Without Bronze it took forever and I still was able to get it. Then CS as noone was willing to trade it. 800 AD +1 move from circ the world.
840 AD first GA from Gperson - GA I suppose.
Now Lib path, 980 AD Edu, 1020 Philo.
And now cherry on the cake - Mids at 1080AD!!! I've built NE and saw that they are still available. It took me about 10 turns to finish it in capitol.
I was able to get Lib any moment and AIs were well back at this. One had Paper and one had Philo. So again wandering through tech tree. Guilds for Gunpowder, then Banking and Economics for GM. And another GA 1160 AD thanks to him.
To that time I founded 2 cities on Rice-Fish island. But they had no trade routes, so I needed Astro. Before it Nationalism for Taj Mahal. My GE constructed it in one turn after seond GA finished.
I traded Edu then for Gunpowder and Engineering.
Another cherry - Hanging Gardens 1280 AD. My capitol bagan to be GEs infinity source.
1310 Chemistry. Now I could muster serious fleet of frigates. Khan was most advanced and close to Lib, so I didn't delayed it further. 1340 AD Lib-> Steel, adopting FR and FS at the very end of GA. GE built Ironworks in capitol.
I captured 3rd city on Rice-Fish island from barbs.
Time has Came to think about victory. I had 15 cities, second Khan had 11. Ther was a buffor of Pacal and Alex between us. Khan's spy industry was focused on me, I couldn't even see his Demoghrapics. But Alex had twice my power and Khan declared on him 1340 AD.
I had 2 Frigates and 6-8 Carracks. 3-4 Macemen, that was all my army worth mentioning.
I decided to attack Pacal and capture his main island, with 3 cities which founded 4 religions. He was slowly gaining in techs and had 8 wonders in capitol.
1490 AD I discovered Rifles and was prepared to attack Pacal at 1520 AD. 1535 AD Khan asked me to assist in war against Alex. As I had sea superiority I agreed altough I didn't have enough forces to simultanoesly fight him and Pacal for real.
The same turn I captured wonder-full Pacal's capitol.
1565 AD Boudica DoWed me. I was sending Prvateers to her territory and one of them incidentally met her sea stack. He killed one of Caravels and she backed away. This gave me time to bring up reinforcements to threathened city. She put just 3 units ashore and I finished it and her sea stack and that was the whole war. My Privateers hunted for her Caravels for centuries. 2 of them were later upgraded to powerfull Destroyers.
1575 AD Pacal capitulated giving me Dram and Democracy.
Khan already had Chemistry, so to make my advatage bigger I researched MScience for Ships of the Line.
1595 Alex captured my city 3 turns away from his borders. It just delayed my invasion on his land. I captured his capitol and island city between our lands to get access to Athens via sea. Then I sued for peace in order to bring up reinforcments.
I discovered Assembly Line, traded for SM, got Communism and at 1750 launched 4th GA using GP, GM and GSpy.
I adopted Slavery again, US and State Prop. I needed just 30 years to speed up my infrastructure and army building. Discovered Combustion meantime.
1780 AD DoWed Alex and he capitulated 1802 AD.
One turn later I got Physics. I could win domination easily now for about 90k. But 19th century domination is not impressive as a date and 90k on this map is surely far from medals. So I decided to go for late culture win to collect another shield. But even with this aim I was lousy. I captured 2 central Khan's islands and all cities with modern resources. It was 1876 AD when I finished it. Then captured main Boudica's island - my goal was to eliminate both of them from tech race.
Then I constructed several wonders and national wonders, stopped growing cities and waited for tipping legendary. I delayed it as much as I could, but I should give all conquered territories to my enemies and vassals to be sure of gaining shield. Eh, warmonger's habits - to keep everything you conquered ;)
 
Ive been looking thru the forums, info centres and war academy but cant find an answer to this: How do you destroy an enemies spaceship? Im guessing you cant in this incarnation except for using a spy to sabotage project? (if you have 10s of thousands of EP) managed to stop launch of Pacals in this game by capturing all his production cities (the idiot wouldn't launch with one engine!) and vassaling him, thought that vassals could still launch tho? IS there another way apart from wiping them off the map?
 
In BTS you have to capture his capitol AFTER launching spaceship, but before it arrives of course. I had the same problem in one of my first BOTMs. And it's different in Vanilla or Warlord, check the thread with differences between expansion packs.
And yes, vassal could still launch a spaceship.
 
:thanx: greeder! Managed to vassal pacal and alex and sneak a diplo victory about 2036 for less than 20000 adjusted points.... cant submit tho as I explained earlier, a cockup accepting peace made me reload.
 
1957 Space victory. I think Joao is realy strong on watery map. I did not have a impression to play on immortal level. Map was overpowered. But that was a perfect setting for me (I guess I am maybe ''monarch'' level player). I have learn a lot from this game. Thx Neilmeister for this one! I have a lot of fun. Sorry for my terrible english.

Siema Greeder. Widze ze sporo sie juz nauczyles. Pozdro i powodzenia w drodze po medal ;)
 
Certainly not the fastest time or the best score out there, but this game was far removed from my normal play style. I like continents or panegeas with low sea level and tons of land. This was nothing like that. :)

Well, from my 1 AD spoiler I was doing just fine, with 6 cities, the Great Lighthouse and tech parity. I soon picked up the Colossus and was focusing on my cities. I didn't do a great job of expanding past 8-9 cities or so and the AIs quickly gobbled up all of the good islands. I was still the leader in tech and used Liberalism to grab Constitution (I delayed Liberalism because no one was close to it). Representation was very good on this food-heavy map which makes me think I should have grabbed the Pyramids early.

I was able to pop a Great Merchant for a Mausoleum-powered Golden Age which ramped up my production. I followed that up with the Taj Mahal and a Great Scientist. I then used Economics and the Great Merchant to have 36 straight turns of Golden Age.

Boudica was falling behind, so I made a play for her territory. I declared in 1310 AD and quickly grabbed 2 island cities at the same time. My stacked merged at her capitol and took it down. I took all 5 cities on her island and ended the war in 1515 AD, leaving her with 1 island city. I had to stop because the colony maintenance combined with my Golden Age finally ending crashed my economy. Fortunately, I was close to Communism and State Property saved me.

I had fallen a bit behind after my crash, but I was able to pull it back together. But focusing too much on the economy left my military behind. Pacal declared in 1690 AD and Alex came demanding a tech that same turn. I gave him the tech and bribed him with another to join the war on my side. Pacal bribed GK into the fight and The Great War began.

It's too bad that the AI doesn't know how to fight inter-continental battles. The AIs never took a single city from each other. Naval vessels were everywhere. I took a few cities of Pacal's that were close to me and I was the first one to Destroyers. My Destroyers took out every single one of Pacal's seafood and he finally sued me for peace.

I thought about making a run at a Diplomatic victory, but The Great War meant that GK and Pacal were fast friends. I built the UN just in case, but could never pull off the victory. It didn't matter anyway, as I was running away in tech. GK declared on me late, but I was way too strong at that point. I saw Sushi Island, and even had a city on it, but didn't bother trying to milk a higher score. I launched a fairly late 1968 AD Space Victory with a measly 30k score.

Fun game and a crazy map. A few good and bad parts of my game:

BAD - my 3rd city was built in the south and tried to get both the Cows and the off-shore Copper. This was a terrible move because it took forever to pop the border and the city was useless until then. On this map, the Copper wasn't even necessary and I could have built an ice city later to get it.

GOOD - The Great Lighthouse. Duh, I know, but as I said I play huge land games and didn't know how powerful it was on this map. I forced myself to build it early and was glad I did.

BAD - Not nearly enough early REX. I had the Lighthouse for crying out loud. Every city immediately paid for itself as soon as I put it down. I should have had 12-14 peaceful cities built, not 8. This is the main reason for my late win time.

GOOD - Focusing more on my Navy than my Army. It seems obvious, but I bet a lot of people just didn't realize how big of a Navy an Immortal AI can get. There's no way to launch an invasion of another AI if your Transports can never reach their shore.

I look forward to the next BOTM!
 
Quite frustrated by this game. :mad:
I mean strong opening, but I played so much according to what I am used I forgot I have almost no land to settle Mining Corp. along fast Factories and Coal Fact. In the end, my economy didn't surpass 3500 BPT. All water maps are really unfriendly indeed.

Given my economy couldn't sustain without Rep, then I had to lift the happy cap far away than normal cap. There I thought about my experience in original Final Frontier mod where happy cap was a serious problem. I remember vassals were the only early path to get higher than usual happy cap.

Thus I decided in this game to create a multitudes of colonies of 2 cities(I ended with 11?).

I crushed Boudica but a city because she refuses to be vassalized.
I played around with Genghis, trolling him with colonies protected with two instantaneous and free infantries.

My corps were producing +57 :food: and +29 :hammers:. The world is at my feet, thus the high amount of goods. Glad I waged the war with a small company of high levels of soldiers and spies.

I completely crashed my empire in the last turn.

I did a small error in my micro, which led the last SS part to delay the victory date by one turn.

I can't believe that date. The last archipelago (on emperor that time) map gave my in the early 1700s. But this...I did something wrong surely.

Score: Near 200k.
Base (for cow award?): ~9900.

I am sure either ZPV, C63 or bcool(I see you) will arrive to a decent date compared to this.
 
I ignored Christo Rendentor although I had a swift three turns at it sufficiently early, but my victory was more important to me.

The huge fish and rice package was a trap btw.
Only use those at the end, otherwise the economy will crash.
I prepared 90 % of necessary WBs, then 15 turns before victory, I started the final assault to high pop.
 
Oh yeah - my 'well developed' empire went into strike - it couldn't believe it. Ok I didn't have experience with Sushi :crazyeye: -- now I'm warned :lol:

There is a way to overcome little mistake like this when controlling a vassal. Giv'em a sushi corporation, then dispose momentarily of costly surplus. That I what I did with those rice plots.
 
After 1 AD:

Wonders and Great Persons:
- The Clossus (175 AD), The Pyramids (275 AD), Mausoleum of Maussollos (760 AD), Shwedagon Paya (760 AD), University of Sankore (1260 AD)
- GM (350 AD): settled in Lisbon, GS (920 AD): Academy in Lisbon, GP (1110 AD): Golden Age (12 turns), GM (1230 AD): settled in Lisbon, GS (1360 AD): Academy in Oporto, GS (1370 AD): Academy in Guimarães, GM (1470 AD): settled in Guimarães

The game:
- I met the Maya Empire in 475 AD
- The Mongolian Empire declared on me (1470 AD) :huh:
- Guimarães has been captured (1525 AD)
- Lisbon has been captured (1565 AD)
- After that, there was nothing else to do… :(

- I can not understand :think:. This game (at least for me) was perfect: I adopted Representation, Bureaucracy, Caste System and Pacifism. I would complete Mass Media in 4 turns (when Mongolian Empire declared war). All empires were pleased. My situation with the Mongolian was good. I did not expect that someone would attack me and once again I did not bother to defend myself. It would be a cool victory and my first at Immortal level. I was quite upset… :sad:

Tell me the more experienced: even in a pacific game is it necessary to maintain troops to defense? I think I’ll have to put at least 4 archers (and upgradind them) in each city, despite taking time and money, to prevent the cities be captured in a sudden invasion… (by the way, I lived here in Brazil) :)!!!
 
1884 AD Conquest Victory

Quite happy because has been my first victory on Inmortal. Indeed I was surppraised I was able to maintain the tech race as I lost by far on my test games, and that was the main reason I decided to run a mixed espionage economy.

I gold rushed the Redentor in 1862AD.

At 1AD I ended plotting my assault on Alexander's territory. Main reasons for this choice was he only had 2 cities at end of BC's, he had 1 holy city (also got the Taoism later) and even if Boudica was nearer, his territory was a nice base to go against Pacal, the technological problem, and Gengis, the militar power. For the invasion I overcame the lack of metal by setling a mountanous island to the NW, next to Boudica's territory. A nice thing about this map was the strategic resources were outside the main islands so you could attack them an take the AI resources in the first turns of war, or settle them and even avoid them to built any meaningful unit.

After the GLighthouse I pursuit the pyramids and got them in 50AD. Looking at the skinny but food rich islands I noticed an specialist economy was the point here.


I used my first two Gspies to setle in Oporto and built the Scotland Yard. Later I got a GMerchant I used to bulb banking in 680 AD. In 700 AD I already had carraks and was able to circunvalate, that +1 was great, and discovered the sushi island in 760 AD, which I inmediatly settled.

I started greek's invasion by removing of the map Corinth, a just setled city over Iron, so he just had horses at that moment. I was belining optics for the wonderful carraks but the invasion still started with galleys. His capital and second city felt by the time I was producing knights in 1340AD when I accepted his capitulation living for him a couple of tundra cities.

After Alex I inmediatly went against Pacal who was the tech lider. I took Mutal and Lakama in 1560AD, were almost every wonder in the world was built. So at that time I controled everything. I was the AP leader but I was running free religion :lol:. I also had 2 shrines, one built by me in Alex juda city, and the hindu (I guess) by Pacal.
In 1585AD Pacal vassalized to Gengis, who was overgrown with 14 cities. That alliance and the fact GK was so big delayed me much more than expected. At 1685AD Pacal understood I was wining the war and capitulated, but GK was so dam stupid he did not capitulate until I was sieging his last remaining city in 1810AD. It was very stupid from him because I captured all his cities with access to oil or iron in the first 10 turns of the war.

After that, preparing the final assault to Boudica was a kid's game and I ended her in 1884AD. My espionage was very useful here because at that point I could see all her territory by the magic of espionage city scouting and preparing the invasion was very easy, knowing exactly were to land my troops to block all her logistic and capture the poorly defended capital.

The main problem of the map were the colonies costs. I gave freedom to most of them, I even built some setlers in just conquered islands to get rid of that crappy cities in ice but with nice oil or iron I didn't want to end in my opponents hands. The 2 units free defenders were very handy to protect those resources for me.

Pacal kept researching even as a vassal so it was a great input for my empire. I even used him before he was a vassal, stoling him Divine Right and Gunpowder (this one was key to get Chemistry to defend my navy). Before the last attack I also stole Assembly Line from Boudica.

The Sushi island was incredibly productive. Even before the Sushi, one of the cities there was a Super Great Farm power house (3 Golden Ages in the end :crazyeye:) and gold generator, another I built the GlobeTheater and drafted and whiped as I have never seen before and still the city grew to 30 pop :crazyeye:, another was my Navy builder with the Moai, and I had another city there wich was barbarian and I captured in the mean time. One problem with the Sushi was it was crashin my economy, +40 food or something, but I gave some food away to my vassals and colonies. I bassically expanded the Sushi to some poor food cities and some ice/resource islands. Respect the rice, I just workshoped it which was very nice and produced a quite good amount of hammers over there. At the end my score was increasing fast each turn and still getting +1600gold but I decided to just finish the game because I did not feel my conquest competitive anyway. Indeed my objective here was just to have a victory and I am happy it was more easy than expected.

I ended with 104k or close.
 
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