Camels - Best replacement in Modern Era?

[Brew God]

Hello Fellow Civ 7 Fans - What are you doing to expand resources per town and city in the Modern Era? Camels seem to disappear and allocating resources is a bit difficult.

Any helpful information would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

Brew God

 

[chazzycat]

There's nothing like camels, but ports, factories & department stores add a few more slots.

 

[Isca Dumnoniorum]

This is another area where the civilopedia is sorely lacking! To add to chazzycat's items, the expansionist attribute tree has a node that grants additional slots to towns.

 

[Krikkit1]

This is another area where the civilopedia is sorely lacking! To add to chazzycat's items, the expansionist attribute tree has a node that grants additional slots to towns.

I think that is the Economic Attribute Tree. (which also has one that adds slots to cities)

 

[Isca Dumnoniorum]

I think that is the Economic Attribute Tree. (which also has one that adds slots to cities)

Sorry yes, you're right!

 

[Calcifer]

There’s also a policy that gives you +1 resource slot: monopolies, unlocked by capitalism mastery

 

[Dark_Jedi06]

I get sad every time my camel economy comes crashing down in the modern era. It would be nice if they at least transitioned to a happiness bonus resource like horses do.

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

I get sad every time my camel economy comes crashing down in the modern era. It would be nice if they at least transitioned to a happiness bonus resource like horses do.

The problem is, Camel Racing, unlike Horse Racing, is pretty nearly a 'niche sport' confined to the Arabian Peninsula, and I suspect the 'recreational/spectator sport' aspect of horses is w3hat's being modeled there..

On the other hand, the replacements for the Camel as a Trade Route/Resource Enhancer would be Steam Engines allowing steam transport over oceans, which dramatically increased the regularity and safety of naval/sea trade routes, and the Railroads, which made land trade routes just as efficient at hauling bulk goods as ships had been.

Perhaps, for the Modern Age, two possibilities covering these two conditions:

1. Every Modern Age Trade Route also adds as many Resource Slots as it provides new Resources, so you (almost) never have an unslotted Resource from trade routes (only, in fact, if you have resources going to Towns, which are the most restricted in the Resources they can slot).

And/Or:

2. Every Railroad Station or Railyard also adds a Resource Slot to the settlement it is in.

You would still have a period of Beginning of Modern Age disruption of trade and resources, but chalk that up to the disruption of the Industrial Era: you can start acquiring Merchants and establishing Trade Routes from the first Tech Tier of the Modern Age, so that disruption shouldn't last long if you don't want it to.

 

[Canadian Bluebeer]

All those others are nice, and give a couple slots, but....

None is like dropping 4 camels into the capital.
(or more)

 

[SammyKhalifa]

It seems like the issue isn't that other things can't replace camels, but that camels are too good, truthfully.

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

It seems like the issue isn't that other things can't replace camels, but that camels are too good, truthfully.

There are two possible 'solutions' to the perceived Camel Problem:

1. Nerf Camels. Maybe something as simple as making them give only 2 instead of 3 resource slots, of which they occupy one. BUT that is going to make getting the total required Resources slotted much, much harder.

2. Have a 'Camel equivalent' Building or Quarter that gives 1 - 2 extra resource slots to the city.
Right now, I believe in the Modern Age (which is the potential Camel Problem age) only the Port structure gives any Resource increase, of 2 in that city. But of course, that structure is only available to coastal/navigable river cities.

More general Modern Age structures that could legitimately add Resource slots might be the Factory, Rail Station/Yard, Department Store, or Stock Exchange (that last representing the extra monetarization of resources). Any or all of these, of course, would still require more effort to equal the Slotted Camel resource bonus, but even at +2 Resource slot/structure you'd only need one of each to equal the 4 Camel Capital mentioned.

Another point to mention in this regard, right now to max the Resources using Camels practically requires you to seek out desert or 'semi-desert' positions for at least one or some of your cities. To some extent, that makes the Camel mechanic terrain-dependent: if you start as Catherine with a Tundra bias, Camels are not likely to be your neighbors. Hatshepset or Xerxes on the other hand, are quite likely to be given a bonus to the economic game from their desert start bias and the increased Camel Likelihood connected with it - which, by I suspect no coincidence, matches the Economic attribute all of their Personas share. Providing a Camel-Alternative in Antiquity and/or Exploration removes that bias/bonus, which may or may not be what the game design intended . . .

 

[Calcifer]

Factory and department store already give +1 resource slot each.

I think the main appeal of camels is that they are stackable, so one way to nerf them could also be allowing to allocate max one per city.

 

[King Flevance]

I feel the game should make it easier to slot resources as you progress. My immediate thought is to nerf camels by actually changing their bonus to gold production.

I think adding resource slots should always be a building/district thing for multiple reasons. The buildings should be better or more abundant with each Age advance.

 

[SammyKhalifa]

There are two possible 'solutions' to the perceived Camel Problem:

1. Nerf Camels. Maybe something as simple as making them give only 2 instead of 3 resource slots, of which they occupy one. BUT that is going to make getting the total required Resources slotted much, much harder.

2. Have a 'Camel equivalent' Building or Quarter that gives 1 - 2 extra resource slots to the city.
Right now, I believe in the Modern Age (which is the potential Camel Problem age) only the Port structure gives any Resource increase, of 2 in that city. But of course, that structure is only available to coastal/navigable river cities.

More general Modern Age structures that could legitimately add Resource slots might be the Factory, Rail Station/Yard, Department Store, or Stock Exchange (that last representing the extra monetarization of resources). Any or all of these, of course, would still require more effort to equal the Slotted Camel resource bonus, but even at +2 Resource slot/structure you'd only need one of each to equal the 4 Camel Capital mentioned.

Another point to mention in this regard, right now to max the Resources using Camels practically requires you to seek out desert or 'semi-desert' positions for at least one or some of your cities. To some extent, that makes the Camel mechanic terrain-dependent: if you start as Catherine with a Tundra bias, Camels are not likely to be your neighbors. Hatshepset or Xerxes on the other hand, are quite likely to be given a bonus to the economic game from their desert start bias and the increased Camel Likelihood connected with it - which, by I suspect no coincidence, matches the Economic attribute all of their Personas share. Providing a Camel-Alternative in Antiquity and/or Exploration removes that bias/bonus, which may or may not be what the game design intended . . .

Yeah, I don't think directly nerfing camels like you said would work (changing to two). I guess you could change them altogether to something like adding trade route range or some such. That should help econ as well.

And I think you're right for the need to add some more slots to modern.

I think there needs to be a rebalancing for resources in general at some point down the line. Some are incredible (like camels), while others borderline useless.

 

[Taefin]

Camels are good, but to utilize them you need trade, and if you are trading, you can get camels through trade. I think it’s better to start without camels, so that your starting resources are useful, then make your first trade routes to settlements with camels.

I like that modern era limits the resource slots, so that you need more infrastructure to slot factory resources.

Before that, camels allow you to utilize the vast numbers of resources you can gain access to. I don’t think finishing silk roads would be difficult with a camel nerf (2 slots instead of 3) but it would cut off the value of trade at around 8 routes instead of the 12 I am getting in trade heavy standard length games.

 

[stealth_nsk]

I think there's quite simple reason we don't have stacking analogue of camels in modern - that would allow using a single city for huge factory resource pile. Economic victory is supposed to require heavy investment in building infrastructure.

 

[UWHabs]

My last game I had a ton of slots in modern, but I went Carthage -> America which both get bonus resource slots. I wouldn't hate if everyone by default got a few more slots from factory/railroads (or policy cards), since it's annoying when you do only have like 3 or whatever default slots that you start the era with. Even with all those bonus slots, sure I ran out of factory slots, but I still had a bunch of regular resources that I couldn't slot in for most of the era.

I do think Camels are too strong - I'd rather see them only give maybe 1 bonus slot plus like +3 gold or something, and then maybe give other ways to get those couple extra slots to use.

Camels are good, but to utilize them you need trade, and if you are trading, you can get camels through trade. I think it’s better to start without camels, so that your starting resources are useful, then make your first trade routes to settlements with camels.

I like that modern era limits the resource slots, so that you need more infrastructure to slot factory resources.

Before that, camels allow you to utilize the vast numbers of resources you can gain access to. I don’t think finishing silk roads would be difficult with a camel nerf (2 slots instead of 3) but it would cut off the value of trade at around 8 routes instead of the 12 I am getting in trade heavy standard length games.

I think it depends on your starting spot, but yeah, getting resources through trade isn't actually that hard. My last game there was a city-state with 2 camels, in the end I waited for a neighbour to suze them and then just traded with it to get them, until the Exploration era when I went on a little military kick and wiped out the new one that cropped up and went to settle a city to get them.

 

[sixty4half]

Economic Dark Age gives you +1 Resource slot in all settlements. I'm about to give it a go.

Been playing as Hatshepsut with Egypt/Shawnee so far so my cities are huge with lots of production but I'm playing Continets. No islands between. Both continets are V shaped and I'm in the global south so it took forever to settle the new lands and I didn't even get 1 Treasure before I was researching Future Civics.

I've had massive trade networks so far and had kind of geared the empire towards Econ victory anyways. Even though I had 2 Golden Ages (Culture and Science) I think I'm going to take this opportunity to use the Dark Age.

+1 Resource slot per settlement seems powerful and may just replace the 6 Camels I had access to.

 

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

The problem is, Camel Racing, unlike Horse Racing, is pretty nearly a 'niche sport' confined to the Arabian Peninsula, and I suspect the 'recreational/spectator sport' aspect of horses is w3hat's being modeled there..

On the other hand, the replacements for the Camel as a Trade Route/Resource Enhancer would be Steam Engines allowing steam transport over oceans, which dramatically increased the regularity and safety of naval/sea trade routes, and the Railroads, which made land trade routes just as efficient at hauling bulk goods as ships had been.

Perhaps, for the Modern Age, two possibilities covering these two conditions:

1. Every Modern Age Trade Route also adds as many Resource Slots as it provides new Resources, so you (almost) never have an unslotted Resource from trade routes (only, in fact, if you have resources going to Towns, which are the most restricted in the Resources they can slot).

And/Or:

2. Every Railroad Station or Railyard also adds a Resource Slot to the settlement it is in.

You would still have a period of Beginning of Modern Age disruption of trade and resources, but chalk that up to the disruption of the Industrial Era: you can start acquiring Merchants and establishing Trade Routes from the first Tech Tier of the Modern Age, so that disruption shouldn't last long if you don't want it to.

That means 'Steam Engine' automatically adds 1 resource slot once researched ?

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

That means 'Steam Engine' automatically adds 1 resource slot once researched ?

It would make sense, because the first use of Watt's steam engine was as a fixed power source for factory machinery. -And a surprising variety of factories were powered: textile mills, brass/tin fabricators, cast and wrought iron mills, and machinery working wood, like the pulley-block mills for the Royal Navy. That means 'steam engine' could multiply the output from almost any 'raw' Resource, which providing a new slot for the resource benefits would represent.