Capitulate or Destroy?

[lankypeter]

If you think you have the ability to just walk right through another Civ and take them out, what are the benefits of having them vassalize instead of just wiping them off the face of the Earth?

And if you do raze some or all of their cities (and the cities are on another land mass), would you start any new cities of your own on that land or just leave the land alone? If you do start new cities, do you then let them be free and become your colony/vassal?

 

[mrt144]

Destroy if they are on my continent, capitulate if they are on another. also turn all cities captured into a new colony. I would much rather have a friendly civ with half their cities than a pissed off vassal.

It isnt pretty but thats how I do it.

 

[jkp1187]

Depends on what my objectives are.

If I'm gunning for domination, am already running State Property (and so don't care about the extra maintenance cost,) I will be more inclined to take every last city. If I'm running Free Market with a couple of corporations, I will be much quicker to accept capitulation -- and, depending on the cultural situation (how much of a pain is it going to be to hold off neighboring civ's culture -- or even the vassal's, if I have to keep an army stationed in my cities to keep them from revolting, if I keep the cities,) maintenance costs (especially if it's on another continent), and vassal % of land vs. master, I may gift one or more of the newly conquered cities back to the vassal and use him as a corporation trading partner.

In the early game, I am more inclined to raze and re-settle....although probably not as much as I should be. I'm an old softie and hate to raze cities unless absolutely necessary.... Unless, that is, if it's the endgame, and I'm playing "whack the legendary city", then I terminate with extreme prejudice.

 

[18lama]

Destroy if you share a continent mainly because of Vassals indulge in spy spamming just like any other rival civ. The issue will be addressed when we have the new patch but until than...Destroy if on the same land mass. If the rival civ is on other continent..I even gift them cities back if they capitulate to me.

I mostly never raise the cities unless they are tundra/desert cities.

 

[Woodreaux]

^^ What they said, plus if the city contains the AP, it's a good candidate for razing. Consider terrain usage, also. The AI seems to have a problem settling on the shores of rivers. If a captured city is close to a river and it doesn't a lot of valuable buildings, raze and resettle on the river.

 

[BYC]

For the most part, destroy is way better than capitulation. The unhappiness bonuses from "we want to rejoin our motherland" really cripples most cities. The player is really limited in future wars or other unhappiness modifiers, so much so, the conquered cities usually cannot very high in population.

It's a bit unfortunate that non-colony vassals aren't particularly useful.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

Basically the only reason to go for Capitulation is the Speed factor.. you get your results quicker.

Things Both a Vassal city+ Your city DOES give you
Resources
Units that fight the same wars you do
50% land+Pop for Domination
'not an enemy' for Conquest
Votes for Diplomatic Victory


Things Your City gives you that a Vassal Doesn't
Research/gold
Maintenance (a negative)
Wonder effects
Units that you control directly
an extra 50% pop+land for Domination

 

[zienth]

Basically the only reason to go for Capitulation is the Speed factor.. you get your results quicker.

Things Both a Vassal city+ Your city DOES give you
Resources
Units that fight the same wars you do

That's assuming they actually fight when you drag them into a war. Most of the time I've gotten into a war when I had a vassal, I'll tell him to attack a nearby city and after several turns a couple of spearmen will wander over that way, see three longbowmen defending, and wander off. I've yet to have a vassal make a noticeable contribution during a war. But I'll admit I haven't fought a lot of wars while I had vassals.

At least I know they aren't going to stab me in the back, unlike some AIs who will backstab at Friendly if you go to war against someone else (yes, I'm talking about you, Ragnar!). Also, anyone trying to attack me from that direction will have to go through the vassal first. So at least I can be fairly sure I won't get any sneak attacks from that flank.

Zienth

 

[BYC]

That's assuming they actually fight when you drag them into a war. Most of the time I've gotten into a war when I had a vassal, I'll tell him to attack a nearby city and after several turns a couple of spearmen will wander over that way, see three longbowmen defending, and wander off. I've yet to have a vassal make a noticeable contribution during a war. But I'll admit I haven't fought a lot of wars while I had vassals.

At least I know they aren't going to stab me in the back, unlike some AIs who will backstab at Friendly if you go to war against someone else (yes, I'm talking about you, Ragnar!). Also, anyone trying to attack me from that direction will have to go through the vassal first. So at least I can be fairly sure I won't get any sneak attacks from that flank.

Zienth

He means that you don't have to spend time finding every last city and razing/taking each one. Sometimes the AI capitulates very early, and that would save a lot of time.

 

[Loopy]

Destroy. Unless they've a lot of cities a long ways away with interesting resources (and me without a relatively quick way of getting there). Capitulate + demand for luxury / essential resource can be faster in the long run.

 

[Larklight]

if nothing else, you get +1 happyness? And get to feel powerful!

 

[BlastDuke]

destroy: when domination victory is ON = more land% and pop% for me
vassal: when domination victory is OFF = land% and pop% are not important, but an ally that must fight and vote for me

 

[MrFrodo]

I'm very happy they put capitulate into the game. It makes domination doable without having to actually kill all the crap you inevitably will capture. I could only bring myself to do all the clean up killing to get conquer/dominate a handful of times in Civ1-4vanilla. The first time I played BtS (( never got warlords) I spent all the time and energy to set up conquering civs on another continent. After conquering the first of 3 civs on that continent very quckly, I looked up and realized my economy was totally destoyed. Just the capital I captured was 100g Colony Maintenance (I guess this will never get that big after the patch yay). I asked around on these boards and realized starting a new colony there and capitulating the other civs was the way to go. Awesome concept and it is implemented pretty well too

The way to do it seems to be:

If you are on the same continent and can wipe out the civ, capture and control their cities. e.g. Early rush.

If you are on the same continent, but can't wipe out the civ, consider destroy, although capture may be needed to provide a forward base for air support or other reasons. You will definitely struggle to keep those cities and make them usable if the other civ remains alive.

If you are on another continent, capture the first three cities. form a colony, add newly captured cities to the colony right away. But never let it get big enough to get out of vasslhood. Meanwhile, whittle down you opponents, with empasis on their capitals, until they a) will capitulate and b) have a small enough empire where they can't get out of vassalhood easily.

 

[Enigma256]

Destroy if they are on my continent, capitulate if they are on another. also turn all cities captured into a new colony. I would much rather have a friendly civ with half their cities than a pissed off vassal.

It isnt pretty but thats how I do it.

i do exactly the same

colonies are just so great, you can lay waste to the enemies land, and they LOVE you for it

 

[Ormur]

I usually go to war to get a bigger empire (more production, money etc.) so I usually destroy civs. But if I've reached my war objectives and if the rest of their cities are poor or far a way I often accept capitulation.

 

[Tee Kay]

Almost always, destroy. There's really no benefit to having a vassal imho, especially a furious one. Their cities costs you maintainance, and there's not really much benefits for you in terms of trade and resources. They could be a burden and drag you off to war and you'll end up fighting their war for them while they just sit on their asses. 50% of their land for domination, so what? Just conquer them and you'll get all their land. And they can still send spies to wreck havoc on your land. Plus, if they ever builds the UN or a spaceship, well...

An exception to this maybe when you can get domination victory by just vassalising it not conquering, or if they're on another continent.