CivSmith - Mod Editor

[Agent327]

Perhaps a silly question: will the editor be (or even need to be) updated w/patch 3.19?

 

[Senap]

I haven't had any problems with CivSmith and BtS 3.19. The XML files should be the same as before so I don't expect any problems.

However, the next version will "officially" be for BtS 3.19

 

[dark_sheep]

You could just open the config.xml file and put the correct path for each base (game and expansions).

Ah yes!! I missed that. I'll give that a shot!

 

[the1sean]

This thing looks like it has a ton of potential! Thanks again for coding stuff like this for us programming illiterates, i look forward to seeing the next update!

 

[Senap]

This thing looks like it has a ton of potential! Thanks again for coding stuff like this for us programming illiterates, i look forward to seeing the next update!

Thanks.

Unfortunately I "coded" myself into a corner , so basically I have to rewrite certain parts to make it faster and more flexible (it's a memory hog in its current form). Working with XML files directly is so slow...

I think I'll take a more conservative approach and allow you to edit stuff independently of Civ and then allow you to "compile" all your mod changes into an XML file instead of working with it directly as it is today.

 

[the1sean]

Unfortunately I "coded" myself into a corner, so basically I have to rewrite certain parts to make it faster and more flexible (it's a memory hog in its current form). Working with XML files directly is so slow...

I think I'll take a more conservative approach and allow you to edit stuff independently of Civ and then allow you to "compile" all your mod changes into an XML file instead of working with it directly as it is today.

That sounds like a good idea, hopefully it is easier to implement as well in the long run, and not just a resource saver. I poked around on your blog and have to say again it looks like you are heading in a great direction. The Tech editor/graph is especially sweet!

I was wondering, will you be able to make the changeover to being database driven and not real-time without losing all the work that you have done so far on the unit and tech editing menus and such? Also, are you planning on including building/wonder, civilization, and civic editors, etc, in addition to the unit and tech editors?

Thanks again for providing this for the community, I hope that the cold you had is long gone and wont keep you from your creative coding

PS: I dont know if you already saw this post: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=231917
It is an XML editor by Kael, I'm not sure if it might have any code that might give you a jump start, but I thought that I would mention it. It's cool but I dont think it has caught on with novice modders. Plus it cant load previously created mod info...

Oh yeah and there was stevo32's editor: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=311239

 

[Senap]

I was wondering, will you be able to make the changeover to being database driven and not real-time without losing all the work that you have done so far on the unit and tech editing menus and such? Also, are you planning on including building/wonder, civilization, and civic editors, etc, in addition to the unit and tech editors?

I would probably have to rewrite the two editors. I'm not sure if I want to continue making it semi-open source with Python either. One thing I've noticed is that it is really time consuming and boring to make the GUIs through code (as it is now), even if Python is amazing and one of my favorite programming languages. If I continue with Python I will at least make an editor that will allow me (and you) to easily design a GUI and then compile or translate the whole thing to Python. It will make my life so much easier and will boost productivity by 200% or something. .

The plan is to make a fully working Civ editor, I just need to decide what approach I want to take in terms of it being somewhat open (Python) which would allow anyone to adapt it to their liking or fully close sourced (no Python) which would allow for really advanced graphical editors (think of the tech editor but 2-4 times better). I'm trying to come up with a solution that would allow both. At this point, I am considering making it completely open source (which would require Pascal/Delphi skills if anyone wants to customize) and get rid of Python. I am just not sure what to do at the moment.

I've looked at nearly every (if not all) editors available here so I have a pretty good idea of what works and what doesn't. Code doesn't help me much because I don't use Java, C, C++ nor C#, but thanks anyway for your suggestions.

Thanks again for providing this for the community, I hope that the cold you had is long gone and wont keep you from your creative coding

At least that gives me an excuse to stay home from work and code from the couch

 

[the1sean]

I would probably have to rewrite the two editors. I'm not sure if I want to continue making it semi-open source with Python either. One thing I've noticed is that it is really time consuming and boring to make the GUIs through code (as it is now), even if Python is amazing and one of my favorite programming languages. If I continue with Python I will at least make an editor that will allow me (and you) to easily design a GUI and then compile or translate the whole thing to Python. It will make my life so much easier and will boost productivity by 200% or something. .

The plan is to make a fully working Civ editor, I just need to decide what approach I want to take in terms of it being somewhat open (Python) which would allow anyone to adapt it to their liking or fully close sourced (no Python) which would allow for really advanced graphical editors (think of the tech editor but 2-4 times better). I'm trying to come up with a solution that would allow both. At this point, I am considering making it completely open source (which would require Pascal/Delphi skills if anyone wants to customize) and get rid of Python. I am just not sure what to do at the moment.

Well, I am not going to be designing any GUIs anytime soon, thats way out of my league
There is also very little chance that me or most of the blokes who need something like this the most will be adapting the editor with Python, either. I think there are veritable hordes of guys out there like me who want to help with grunt mod tasks (like changing flavor text or making basic unit, tech, and improvement changes). However because we are functionally coding illiterate we have a hard time making a decent contribution to the modding community. So my vote is whatever makes this project easier for you to code and make shiny, even if it comes at the expense of ease of CivSmith cusomizability at the code level. Thats my two bits, keep it simple for us simpletons (I am assuming that we are your target crowd).

At least that gives me an excuse to stay home from work and code from the couch

 

[Senap]

Well, I am not going to be designing any GUIs anytime soon, thats way out of my league

Hehe, of course not I'm just saying that I want people with Python knowledge to be able to adjust it to their liking.

But you're right of course, if I can make a better editor by keeping it closed source, then maybe that's the way to go. I am currently working on an add-on for Flight Simulator X but I will be coming back very soon with a working Tech Editor demo as a stand-alone program. I need to make a demo to see how a database driven CivSmith would work compared to the current version (Probably better ).

So make sure to come back and check it out in a couple of weeks!

 

[Altha]

Incredible work, thank you.

 

[the1sean]

But you're right of course, if I can make a better editor by keeping it closed source, then maybe that's the way to go. I am currently working on an add-on for Flight Simulator X but I will be coming back very soon with a working Tech Editor demo as a stand-alone program. I need to make a demo to see how a database driven CivSmith would work compared to the current version (Probably better ).

So make sure to come back and check it out in a couple of weeks!

I definitely will, I am excited to see what you come up with, and I think a lot of other people are, too!

 

[Tygari]

Wow, Looks really amazing and very simple to use mew.
Do you plan to add more editors mew?
Ones for Civilizations, Buildings, Wonders, and Promotions would all greatly flesh it out into being an all encompassing program mew.

 

[rocklikeafool]

Can this be used to edit improvements and such? Or civics? Cuz I downloaded someone else mod and dislike a few minor things. If I tweak those things easily, that'd make me happy. Nonetheless, I downloaded your utility anyway, just cuz it seems very useful.

 

[Lord Tirian]

Hehe, of course not I'm just saying that I want people with Python knowledge to be able to adjust it to their liking.

But you're right of course, if I can make a better editor by keeping it closed source, then maybe that's the way to go.

Also, people that can edit the editor are probably able to edit the Civ4 files directly without a lot of hassle. The mod editor has two uses 1) make modding way more accessible to those who are not very well-versed with computers and 2) make modding easier for those who already have a grasp of what they're doing.

I think focussing on the former is more important, because it allows more people to participate in the modding fun - whereas people who are willing to venture into the editor code are probably ambitious and knowledgeable enough to reach the limits of any editor very quickly anyway (like editing the Python and/or SDK parts of the game)

Cheers, LT.

 

[Senap]

Do you plan to add more editors mew?
Ones for Civilizations, Buildings, Wonders, and Promotions would all greatly flesh it out into being an all encompassing program mew.

That is the plan; a bunch of editors in one application.

Can this be used to edit improvements and such? Or civics?

At the moment, no. The current preview version that is available can only edit units and technologies, though it's not 100% complete (It is a preview after all).

Also, people that can edit the editor are probably able to edit the Civ4 files directly without a lot of hassle. The mod editor has two uses 1) make modding way more accessible to those who are not very well-versed with computers and 2) make modding easier for those who already have a grasp of what they're doing.

I think focussing on the former is more important, because it allows more people to participate in the modding fun - whereas people who are willing to venture into the editor code are probably ambitious and knowledgeable enough to reach the limits of any editor very quickly anyway (like editing the Python and/or SDK parts of the game)

Cheers, LT.

Absolutely. However, the original idea was that more advanced and larger mods (with custom tags and so forth) could be supported by allowing devs and users to make their changes/additions to the application through Python. The sad thing is that a fully close sourced editor wouldn't be able to fully support all mods - only standard Civ/War/BtS/Col mods.

It seems like I will have to abandon the original idea after thinking about this for over a month now sad but hey, this will lead to a better editor with more features so it will most likely pay off D).

 

[the1sean]

...the original idea was that more advanced and larger mods (with custom tags and so forth) could be supported by allowing devs and users to make their changes/additions to the application through Python. The sad thing is that a fully close sourced editor wouldn't be able to fully support all mods - only standard Civ/War/BtS/Col mods.

It seems like I will have to abandon the original idea after thinking about this for over a month now sad but hey, this will lead to a better editor with more features so it will most likely pay off D).

I am really looking forward to a "basic" editor with a plethora of useful features! It still hasnt happened yet (going on how may years since Civ4's release now? ).

I used to be a quality assurance lead at a software company for a couple of years. Sometimes the hardest decisions are made before any code or art for a project is started, what features do we include? How much will this benefit the average user? Is this interface intuitive? etc.

In the end, the coding savvy can always go back later and add custom elements to their mod, or a "basic" user can hand the nearly finished product to someone else to spice up (Plus CivSmith could still edit the "basic" content of an "advanced" mod right?).

Later on you could always code another follow-up app (in python, or whatever) that would help more advanced users easily manipulate custom elements to a mod...

But I am not trying to pile more work on your plate

I am just trying to suggest another approach that may more easily achieve your desired goals

 

[Atum]

when I attempt to run this program I get this error:

Error 193: Could not open Dll "python25.dll"

followed by:

Python could not be properly initialized. We must quit.

I made sure that all pre-requisites were properly installed. I also made sure that I ran the program as an administrator (Vista). Any assistance would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

 

[Senap]

I am really looking forward to a "basic" editor with a plethora of useful features! It still hasnt happened yet (going on how may years since Civ4's release now? ).

Yeah I'm surprised too and was hoping that someone would have made an editor when I came back here a year ago. I suppose my project is the very definition of taking matters into your own hands

I used to be a quality assurance lead at a software company for a couple of years. Sometimes the hardest decisions are made before any code or art for a project is started, what features do we include? How much will this benefit the average user? Is this interface intuitive? etc.

You'll receive a PM when it's time to test

Plus CivSmith could still edit the "basic" content of an "advanced" mod right?).

Yes, only custom tags would be affected and not truly supported (Though I might be able to still add some basic support).

Thanks for your suggestions

when I attempt to run this program I get this error:

Error 193: Could not open Dll "python25.dll"

followed by:

Python could not be properly initialized. We must quit.

I made sure that all pre-requisites were properly installed. I also made sure that I ran the program as an administrator (Vista). Any assistance would be greatly appreciated.

So you have installed both Python 2.5 and the lxml package? Tricky problem. You could try copying Python25.dll to the CivSmith folder and see if it runs then. Python25.dll is usually located in C:\Windows\System32.

Other than that, it sounds like Python hasn't been installed properly.

 

[Atum]

Tried placing Python25.dll in the CivSmith folder and in the System32 folder. Neither option worked. My IDLE gui works just fine though. Is there any particular path that CivSmith needs to have or special settings that I need to set in python?

 

[the1sean]

Yeah I'm surprised too and was hoping that someone would have made an editor when I came back here a year ago. I suppose my project is the very definition of taking matters into your own hands

No kidding

You'll receive a PM when it's time to test

I'd be happy to. As you can tell I am full of opinions At least I have some sort of logic behind most of them...