Classic GOTM 32 Spoiler 1: End of ancient age

[Bede]

Oddly enough, it was over 50% Aztec when it flipped...Just took it back from the Iro (1000 years later) and it was still 40% Aztec...

 

[smackster]

I usually starve down the population for this exact reason. You can hurry workers or settlers, too.

The town is not very productive for awhile as it regrows, but tends to be much more loyal.

And whatever you do, if your culture is low, and further from your capital than theirs, then you will get some flips. Be prepared for that, and recapture them. That is just the way it works.

If you are trying to capture just one city (for example ) then you may be very disappointed as it flips, after a long siege.

That is life, or is that Civ3.

Smackster (still stuck in a bar at Heathrow)

 

[Wotan]

Thankfully StarAlliance have a few lounges at Heathrow... Where one can sort of recuperate...

 

[Dynamic]

Hi! This month we play the militaristic & scientific civ it is sign Aztecs can quick expanding by war & culture. The unique unit Jaguar Warrior is cheap & fast and allowed fast explore the map like expansionist civ (no hut bonus however). JW may be used for early war but after discovering Bronze Working alien civs build spearmens and war stay very hard. Another bad thing is early golden age with a little cities under despotism.
My first move was settler to S. This position allow to build ring 3 on north coast. And I found Tenochtitlan here… Some turns later my first JW discover my mistake: my capital has not access to the wheet. I built 3 JW and sent NW, SE, NE, than granary. My scientists go to Alphabet at 10%.
My first JW met Iroquois scout and trade Pottery. In 3200BC JW reached Salamanca and capture it! Iroquois have respown near Tenochtitlan and got additional settler and spearmens. I built barracks and then several veteran JW (1JW/turn). Then I attack and capture 2 Iroquois towns, but the last town defended strong and I spent more time to capture it. 3 JW were promoted to elite and in last attack I got GL! Very well bonus at 1800BC! I save it and then rush FP in the new city near Salamanca in 1500BC.
Interesting thing, in my second war against Americans (many times later, out of this spoiler) I win ~30 horsemen battles and get only 1 elite unit! Bad luck. Why JW promoted so fast?
After win in Iroquois war I set my science at maximum for reach Republic and got it in1025BC. I trade Mathematics & Construction from Americans and my MA started in 650BC.
In 1000BC I had 15 Cities (4 from Iroquois ).

 

[Dianthus]

Ooops, wrong thread, meant to got to the Conquests one!

 

[samildanach]

Looks like someones shuttle pod has dumped him on the wrong planet. And Denyd thought he had it bad.

I got a settler from that hut as well.

 

[Dianthus]

Looks like someones shuttle pod has dumped him on the wrong planet. And Denyd thought he had it bad.

Took me a while to work out what you were talking about, but I've got it now . Guess I need to try reading past the 1st letter of each word .

 

[Karasu]

Here I come, once again trying to improve my understanding of the 100k cultural game... (Civ 1.29f, Open)

The starting position was puzzling. I decided to move south with the settler, towards the dyes and out of all those river branches. Seeing nothing, I settled there and started building a few Jaguar Warriors -mainly for exploration.

I considered trying to research directly to Republic, but being Religious Monarchy would be discovered earlier, and two changes of government would not be a problem. So I set research to Mysticism at 100% funding. Knowing that Expansionis civs were in the game, I hoped I would be able to trade for Pottery.

The first Jaguar warrior showed the Wheat and the Game. The tricky point there was that you wouldn't get both staying along the river. I founded my second city there anyway, which was a reasonably good settler factory throughout the game.
In fact, Tenochtitlan built its settler after the third Jaguar Warrior.

Tenochtitlan was actually founded in 2950 BC, and built Temple (to pick the Game and Fish with border expansion), Granary and then Workers and Settlers. The settler factory started operating around 1500 BC.
Tenochtitlan built a couple more settlers with Temple and Barracks in between, then mainly military units.

Contacts and trades begun in 3450 BC, when I met an Iroquois scout. America was met in 3200 BC by the third wandering Jaguar.

I spotted a three huts in the meantime. Hoping they would give me a tech or two, I patrolled them with my Jaguars and set research to Alphabet at minimum, waiting for the others to discover Masonry and/or The Wheel. Trades and discoveries went actually like this:
3200 BC - Warrior Code to Iroquois for Bronze Working, Pottery, 12 gold
2900 BC - Discover Mysticism. No trades.
2550 BC - Ceremonial Burial to America for 66 gold
2550 BC - Mysticism +13 gold to America for Masonry
2550 BC - Masonry + 20 gold to Iroquois for The Wheel
2550 BC - Horseback Riding, map, Iron Working from huts. Good, but I was hoping for Polytheism.
2470 BC - Switch research to Polytheism at max
1500 BC - Mysticism and Horseback Riding to Iroquois for Alphabet + 65 gold (the idiot had researched Iron Working first...)
1500 BC - Alphabet to America for 72 gold
1450 BC - Discover Polytheism. Start Monarchy at 70%
950 BC - Polytheism to Iroquois for Writing + 94 gold
900 BC - Discover Monarchy and revolt.

I founded a couple more cities around the capital (at distance 3-4), which were similarily ordered to build Temple, Barracks and military.

When I got Iron Working, I saw that no sources were within easy reach. America had both relatively close and Iroquois had Iron next to Salamanca and would soon reach their Horses. So I devised the following plan:
- Settle next to the 'Iroquois' horses, to deny them their UU.
- Settle next to the Iron source north of Washington, send there 5-10 Jaguars for a local upgrade to be followed by an invasion.
- Start building horseman only.

In 1200 BC Calixtlahuaca was founded next to the Iron. It built a Spearman, a couple of workers to connect the Iron, and Barracks.
In 710 BC Malinalco was founded to deny Iroquois their only possible Horses.

900 BC: revolt to Monarchy.
At this time (forgot to check or save at 1000 BC... ) I've got 8 cities, 402 culture points.

In the meantime the Iroquois, much as they did in GOTM31, built the Pyramids and the Great Lighthouse. Unfortunately, I was already set to invade America at that point, and conquered those wonders later on. This probably cost me a few turns and several points on the final date.

With MapMaking, I sent a few suicide galleys through the seas, looking for contacts. The first one sunk immediately, while the second amazingly survived the oceans for three turns and gained contact with Germany. I got a lot of money and maps through trades, and realized that access to the other continent would probably require the Great Lighthouse. This was good news indeed for my purposes.

In 270 BC I was finally ready to attack the americans. I believe now that I should have made a better effort for an earlier assault, both the Americans and the Iroquois had extremely poor armies. I actually only met three American Swordsmen throughout the game, and only Iroquois Archer (in spite of their having Iron at their doorstep).

The only difficulty was in taking Washington: 2 horsies redlined, and 1 killed to kill the two defeinding Spears.
The conquest of America proceeded somewhat slowly because of the lack of roads for my Swordsmen. I also had used quite a few units, so I could not attack more than one city at a time.

So it was that 150 BC came, when I finally traded for Construction with Germany and entered the Middle Ages.
I had around 1300 culture points at this time.

Things are looking quite good, but I believe I should have expanded faster, conquered America earlier and built more temples.
Anyway, the plan at this point is:
- No great leader has come, so I will jump the palace to Washington (move 4-8 Settlers there to complete a first ring around it and grow its population to the necessary size). The terrain is not wonderful, but it has great growth potential.
- The FP will stay in Tlatelolco for the time being, but I will move it to Salamanca later on.
- Start the Golden Age as soon as the area around Washington is reasonably developed (send at least 7 workers there)
- Upgrade 10-15 Knights and wipe out the Iroquois
- Switch to Republic as soon as it is available (someone should be researching it now! )
- Research to Education, then reassess
- Encourage wars in the other continent

 

[civ_steve]

1.27f, Predator

I didn't start this game until the 25th, and with COTM2 starting, along with the July 4th holiday activities, I doubt I will be able to complete. But I've reached Middle Ages in 190 AD.

I started the game thinking about doing a 20K city. So ... here's how NOT to go about doing this!! Founded Tenochtitlan 2 spaces SE (River and coastal access), thinking I would form a 20K city just North of original start spot and give them the BG's over time. However, saw a spot about 5 spaces SSE or so that was on a River, on the coast, and had 6 BG's within it's expanded radius. Bingo, I thought.

This is a good spot, but I delayed founding this city too much; I decided to build a Granary in Tenochtitlin first; in retrospect, with no food bonus in the capital, I'd been better off building 2 Settlers, and founding my 20K city down south and a Worker/Settler factory to the West (Game/Wheat/Fish area). I had good production at the 20K city, but also a lot of Waste. At size 6 Teotihuacan produced 13 Shields, but only 10 were useful. I was trying to beat Salamanca to Oracle, and lost by 2 turns (tumbling me to the Colossus). Salamanca was landbound, so I thought I'd have a shot at both if I completed Oracle first. What did me in was the Waste, and the delay in getting Teo started.

I'm very interested in Kuningas' start, which uses the Capital as the 20K city. One of the problems is limited scouting available before founding the Capital, but he has found and chosen a decent location. Another problem is the inability to store shields in a palace build, or cascade to the palace if the AI completes your current Wonder first. But, being Religious, he has raced down the Myst - Poly - Monarchy line. The Hanging Gardens now acts like a Palace shield storage device for a while, if needed! And with the short anarchy period, you don't mind doing a few Revolutions if necessary, so there's no issue with being a Monarchy or Republic first. (In fact, that's beneficial when building the Colossus; I saw almost no benefit due to all the River spaces I had in Teo; under Monarchy, they would each generate the +1 commerce for me.) By the time you're in the Middle Ages and you have to complete Hanging Gardens, you'd typically switch to GL farming to rush as many Wonders as possible, so the lack of Palace build capability is minimal. Very nice start, Kunigas!

Anyway, I took a circuitous route to Republic (Mysticism, then Wheel, then Alphabet, Writing, some help with CoL, Philosophy, Republic), and switched around 200 BC. I can't believe how many Angry Warriors my JW's came across! (No help from the GHs.) With my large army I had to shut down research until I started a GA with a short war against Iroquois (which also gained me the Silks after taking the Iroquois city to the North, to complement my Dyes and Spice). That allowed me to finish Currency, Polytheism (190 AD), then on to Literature and Monarchy.

The other continent's civs have been very aggressive in building Wonders. Salamanca finished Oracle, and I tumbled to Colossus. Pyramids by someone else; Great Library completed very early by someone else; I was well into Great Lighthouse (about 5 turns to go), when it was completed elsewhere, and I ended up with a slightly overpriced Forbidden Palace. Ditto Great Wall. I did manage the Hanging Gardens during my GA. Shortly after 190 AD, a distant civ completed Sun Tzu's!!

During my GA, my 20K city was producing 34 Shields with only 1 wasted. Not bad, but the timing was - there were no Wonders to build until Monarchy was finished and I could build HG. So only Colossus and HG; not a very good start. Also, I've sent out about 10 submarines; well, they were Galleys, but they're all underwater now with not even a remote coastline spotted! With all the Scientific civs across the ocean, it's real important to make quick contact with them while I still might have some trade value in my government Techs. Sigh! I think I hear the Dutch calling to me!

 

[dshea_32665]

Mac Open 1.29f

I entered the MA in 1300 AD! Needless to say, this is way later than normal for me! I was agressive militarily which I guess killed the research pace and I only had contact with other Civs besides America and Iroquois at the very end of the AA. Should have sent more suicide galleys. I didn't keep any notes on this because I thought I was doing so badly that I wouldn't even submit. However, when I did enter the MA I owned the continent and when I had contact with the other Civs I was way ahead. I guess it isn't all bad, but what a weird game so far.

dshea_32665

 

[Ronald]

1.27f

Preliminary thoughts:

General:
I want another game with a high tech pace. Cotm1 gave me some training and I learned some lessons. So if the game develops well, I want to go for another space ship.

Starting position:
I don't want to start on a bonus grassland and down south is something visible. There are three possible choices to move my settler: SE, S, or SW all look identical. I move SE and found Tenochtitlan. It turns out that it was a lucky move because the wheat comes into play and I can use Tenochtitlan for a settler factory.
For my research, I started with mysticism at max. The idea is to then use polytheism at min for good trading.
The building sequence is jag warrior, jag warrior, settler.

In 3550 I made contact with America and trade potter + 10g for WC. My first hut gives me masonry, my second a settler, great, I found Teotihuacan in 3150 BC) Then I met the Iroquois and traded WC for 35g
In 2850 BC I founded Tlateloco, which will start to produce mainly workers.

Since I want a high tech pace and my two direct neighbors are expansionist, I decided to stop opening huts. The expansionist civs have a better probability to get techs than I have. So lett them get the techs , I do the trading.

City placement:
I wanted to switch to Republic early, so connecting luxuries becomes a high priority. So after connecting the dyes, founding cities next to the silks and the spices is required. It will also help to keep the Iroquois in the north.

In 1950 BC finally Tenochtitlan was ready to produce a steady stream of settlers.
By 1000 BC I had twelve cities and was quite pleaseed with the developments so far.

In 800 BC my third suicide galley made it across the ocean and met the other civs there.

On my home continent I kept settling the unclaimed land. After succesfully conaining the iroquois in the North, I settled quickly in The Sout, West of the American land to prevent them from moving in.

In 310 BC I researched republic and immediately switched governments and in 290 BC I traded my last ancient tech - construction - to reach the middle ages.

Ronald

 

[Matrix]

I died in 3100 BC because an American warrior simply walked into my capital. No s***! They never did that before, when you're at peace!

I have done better.

 

[Dianthus]

I died in 3100 BC because an American warrior simply walked into my capital. No s***! They never did that before, when you're at peace!

I have done better.

Ooops! I've had that happen before, in a GOTM game too. Since then I always build a warrior as my 1st build.

 

[samildanach]

I have done better.

Yes, I remember you lasting till 2000BC.....once.

I've actually lost in 3800 BC in an always war game that I posted about in the SG forum. It was the opposite from your game, I was the americans and a jag took my capital before I could produce my first warrior.

 

[Dynamic]

I died in 3100 BC because an American warrior simply walked into my capital. No s***! They never did that before, when you're at peace!

I have done better.

Alien force don't attack undefended cities if you are strong and have many of them. If you have only one capital without defenders there is high chance they attack. I should do it.

 

[Matrix]

Ooops! I've had that happen before, in a GOTM game too. Since then I always build a warrior as my 1st build.

I did so too, but didn't defend with it.

Alien force don't attack undefended cities if you are strong and have many of them. If you have only one capital without defenders there is high chance they attack. I should do it.

Yea, but your 'Intelligence' isn't 'Articifial'.

 

[ainwood]

Bad luck, Matrix!

Plus side is that you might get a Red Ambulance award! Good to see you back playing though.

 

[Lord Jimbob]

1.27 predator

Well, I ran out of time on this GOTM, but I got to try my 1st Conquest attempt. I focused on an early war with the Iroquois and Americans and, with the help of two settlers from goody huts (vs. zero in COTM01...), I conquered them, and then finally reconquered them after they respawned, in 50bc:

A nice early start to world conquest, however, I failed to realize how important the Great Lighthouse would be for a transoceanic invasion, and by the time I made contact w/ the overseas AIs at the end of the ancient era, I could see that they would have pikes and maybe knights by the time I learned navigation. I could have moved my tech along sooner, but I committed to Monarchy early on for warmongering, and only switched to Republic late. I learned a lot and might even try again next GOTM!

edit: and what a brilliant map by the way! I had fun building lots of canal towns to facilitate naval movement and working out my 5/9 RCP scheme- staff!