CO-2 Monarch Early Conquest

[colony]

Time for another SG I've been thinking about. I'm sure I'm not the only one who could do with a bit more practice at getting faster finishes, particularly for the GOTM (Just wish I could play more of them). I decided on Monarch as it allows a bit more flexibility than Emperor does. I'm still undecided on what leader, speed and map type to use though, but I would like to stay away from Civs with UUs that the AI can't cope with (Mainly the Inca, Romans and maybe the Persians too)

Leader: TBD
Map: TBD
Speed: Normal or Epic
Difficulty: Monarch
Size: Standard
All other settings standard (version 1.61)

So, what leader would people suggest? I'm thinking about most of the aggressive leaders ATM, but I'm still undecided. For map type a land based map would be a good idea, but there are quite a few of them now

Also, would you prefer Normal speed to Epic?

I did think about AW, but I'd prefer to keep to this on standard settings.

Roster:
Colony
Grogs
Doc TK
rdd05
mike p

 

[Doc TK]

I'm up for it, but can't say that I'm going to be much help on early conquest. Not really my game style, but "am willing to learn" ... FYI - I've not done a SG before, so you've got a newbie on that end as well ... And no biggy if you get other folks who are a better fit. Let me know.

 

[rddc05]

I'll join up if you'll have me. I lurked on CO-1 all the way to the end, very nicely done. I typically play Monarch in SP (win some, lose some )

As for leader and map: Alexander is good fun, although the UU is mostly defensive - unless Hatty, Cyrus or the Khans are next door. The fractal map looks cool too.

 

[colony]

Ok, Doc TK and rddc05 I'll add both of you to the roster.

The Greeks could be a good idea, although I don't like defensive UUs much. I haven't played many Fractal maps yet, but from what I've seen they seem to randomly generate a Pangaea/Continents/Archi map, so I'd prefer to keep it to a land based map.

Any preference for game speed?

Doc TK: As long as you don't mind discussing strategy, and aren't going to disappear halfway through I'm happy to have you

 

[mike p]

I'm willing to take the last open spot. Monarch is generally winnable for me in SP. I play a pretty balanced style, but it's always good to get better at early conquest, no?

Japan has nice trait synergy for expansion by conquest. Aggressive makes the fight go easier, and organized means lower upkeep and quicker courthouses. And while the UU is solid, it's not a strategy unto itself like praets or quecha.

 

[autocon]

i'll be lurking this one

 

[Xtream_Rockstar]

ill join in for a leader mabey monty (aggressive, Spirtual) or Genghis Khan (Agressive, Spirtual) mabey Napolean (aggressive, industrious)
Normal speed is fine
for map pangea or contients

 

[Doc TK]

Doc TK: As long as you don't mind discussing strategy, and aren't going to disappear halfway through I'm happy to have you

I am happy to discuss strategy and will not drop out. I may be out for various periods of time, e.g., trips, vacations. But I'll give you heads up when that's going to happen.

On leaders, since I generally play balanced, I often choose a Fin leader in order to be able to get the research bonus.

I do like Creative types to get the city border expansion in order to hook up cities better.

I do agree with Mike P about Japan - the Samuri is a pretty nice UU. They kicked ass in the GOTM.

But, I'm pretty flexible as far as that goes.

Actually, I'm curious - when we are going for early conquest, are we thinking that we are going to build up a bit to get some infrastructure in place so our economy doesn't tank, or are we thinking that we just go for something like Axes followed by Horse Archers (or Keshiks) and just go all out early with mass force?

Pangea is nice for early conquest, but the Fractal maps have been pretty interesting so far in my two games with those maps. Of course the GOTM this month is a Fractal, with Kubli Kahn, so let's not do exactly that.

 

[colony]

mike p: I'll add you to the roster

I do agree with Mike P about Japan - the Samuri is a pretty nice UU. They kicked ass in the GOTM.

But, I'm pretty flexible as far as that goes.

That's two votes for Japan, and I quite like them too, although they don't start with mining.

Actually, I'm curious - when we are going for early conquest, are we thinking that we are going to build up a bit to get some infrastructure in place so our economy doesn't tank, or are we thinking that we just go for something like Axes followed by Horse Archers (or Keshiks) and just go all out early with mass force?

The second option I expect. Since seeing the dates of some of the fastest conquests in the GOTM (especially in GOTM3) has just made me want to get better at them, and conquering half the world with axemen and horse archers is possible. I normally aim for Domination rather than Conquest, and normally only get into a state of being permanently at war with at least one AI after Macemen, so I normally finish quite late anyway.

Xtream_Rockstar: I'd prefer to keep this down to five players, from what I've seen, and my limited experience at SGs, it seems easier to lose focus with more players, something that's needed in a game like this.

Is Tokugawa, Pangaea and Normal speed ok for everyone? If so I'll generate a start. It'll be interesting to see how the changes to chopping have affected this, I still haven't had a chance to play a normal game since 1.61 was released.

 

[Grogs]

Is Tokugawa, Pangaea and Normal speed ok for everyone? If so I'll generate a start. It'll be interesting to see how the changes to chopping have affected this, I still haven't had a chance to play a normal game since 1.61 was released.

Normal does tend to make really fast victories harder since units obsolete in a hurry, but that's alright with with me as long as nobody has any heartache about it. I haven't played anything in 1.61 yet, so it will be a learning experience for me as well.

My strategy militarily, if I feel like kicking over a few ant hills during the game, is to go after a neighbor early, either with axes or chariots, take a few cities, and leave that AI crippled. I usually come back with swords and finish that AI off and maybe another, then take another break until maces, etc. Axes are the easiest way to go, so BW should be an early priority. If we're lacking copper, getting AH for chariots is another way to go. It's a tougher fight, but we can conquer a city or two with chariots and secure copper if we need to. The biggest challenge is usually balancing conquests with finances, so we'll have to keep up on our research to make sure we can afford our military acquisitions.

As far as scheduling is concerned, this is my last week of school and it's exams, so I'm going to be too busy to play until Saturday. Feel free to push back my spot in the roster if my turn comes up before then.

 

[mike p]

Glad to be aboard.

As far as changes to chop yields, I've been trying to focus on getting food resources hooked up earlier and then going to the whip. It might still make sense to chop out a settler, but chopping out workers might be too expensive since it takes more wood and that means that by the time you're done they'll be nothing left for the new worker to chop anyway.

 

[Doc TK]

My strategy militarily, if I feel like kicking over a few ant hills during the game, is to go after a neighbor early, either with axes or chariots, take a few cities, and leave that AI crippled. I usually come back with swords and finish that AI off and maybe another, then take another break until maces, etc. Axes are the easiest way to go, so BW should be an early priority. If we're lacking copper, getting AH for chariots is another way to go. It's a tougher fight, but we can conquer a city or two with chariots and secure copper if we need to. The biggest challenge is usually balancing conquests with finances, so we'll have to keep up on our research to make sure we can afford our military acquisitions.

This is exactly why I'm interested in seeing how you all are going to do this. For me, the reason I don't go for all out early attack is that I hate stalling out. After I kill off an AI or two early, my tech rate is horrible and I stall for so long, that it works out worse than if I had waited. So, my general MO has been, I attack a couple close AIs selectively to weaken them (steal workers first), and then I go for CoL, Construction (cats), Currency (extra trade + Markets so I know I can take folks down and be able to get decent economy. But, that means I'm very slow in conquering. However, once I start, it just rolls pretty easily.

 

[rddc05]

I'm good with the stated civ/map/settings. Looking forward to a fun game.

 

[colony]

I've generated a start now:



So, first off, should we move the Settler onto the Plains/Hill for the extra hammer at the loss of a turn? As for research I'm inclined towards Mining, then BW first. A worker won't have much to do right now, until BW, so this might be one of the few times I don't start with one, so I think I'll stick with a couple of warriors first.

I'll play the first 20 turns later, then the next player can play 15 and after that 10 turns in each turnset, so the game gets going quickly. Also I'd prefer a 24/48 hour limit on "got it" and "played it" posts, but if you need more time just ask.

 

[mike p]

I'd move the warrior onto the hill first. My understanding is that there will always be at least one food resource within the fat cross if you settle in place. Moving the hill may take us out of range of the bonus, and will definitely take us off the river which will hurt for both health and trade.

If there are fishies down there, then moving onto the hill and starting a workboat would be good. But if that's the only hill around, we may not want to settle on it because we'll get more hammers in the long run from mining it.

My bottom line, move south if there's seafood, otherwise settle in place.

In place we can work two flood plains and a mine plus whatever bonus resources are in the fog right now. A good balanced start IMO.

Mining to BW sounds right to me unless the map reveals something that warrants a switch.

 

[rddc05]

I favor settling in place also, for the reasons given and the fact that there will be plenty of forest in the fat cross along with additional river tiles (one of which is a floodplain?) to the NW.

 

[Doc TK]

I'd agree with the warrior onto the hill.

I would be surprised to find enough to convince me to move to the hill and give up the river and the likely resources within our current cross. I am horrible at reading maps. There may be something to the upper left (cows/sheep) given that it looks like the other two squares (middle right) are likely woods.

I like Mining, BW out of the gate as well.

Okay, so far, I guess I just agree.

 

[Grogs]

I'll chime in with the others here and say that settling in place looks like the best option, unless we see something moving the warrior up on the hill. We'll also pop that hut when we found our city, and at this point anything we get from it, even just a map of the area, would be nice.

Also, I've finished up my exams now, so I'll be able to play my turns in the regular spot.

 

[colony]

Just played the first 20 turns. I haven't made a dot-map yet, because there's still 1 turn until BW is finished and Copper could change everything (that and I forgot to take any screenshots ). We were extremely lucky with the huts, getting a Scout and 2 techs. I didn't manage to explore as much as I'd have liked though with the Scout, it looks like we could be just south of a jungle.

Turn 0: Found Kyoto, hut gives us a Scout, start on a Warrior

3: Meet Mansa. Pop another hut and we get Mysticism

7: Mining finished, start on BW

9: Buddhism FIDL
IBT: Scout kills a Panther

10: Pop another hut and get Pottery

12: Warrior finished, start a Worker

16: Warrior kills a Lion

19: Hinduism FIDL

Once we know if there's any Copper around we should be able to work out where to from there.

Also, I've finished up my exams now, so I'll be able to play my turns in the regular spot.

Looks like you're up next then

Roster:
Colony - Just Played
Grogs - Up
Doc TK - On Deck
rdd05
mike p

 

[Doc TK]

I'm at work for a bit. Any chance you can post a current screen shot with resources so I'll have something to do while I'm at work.

BTW, Turn 3, Meet Mansa - he must be pretty close?