[C3C] COTM 127 Dalecarlia Sid - 1st Spoiler - End of ancient times

Più Freddo · Nov 26, 2016

This thread is for your reports of events and progress in COTM 127 Dalearlia Sid up to the date where you are able to research a Medieval tech.

Do not read or post in this thread until you meet this condition. You may reveal Medieval bonus techs from the end of the last Ancient Age turn.

Please do not post information here relating to later dates, and please only post maps of your home area and no minimaps

Quintillus · Nov 27, 2016

I'm still alive! :banana:

And I even fought a war. But first, the barbarians really were a pain, significantly curtailing my expansion. As a result, the Hittites, who had built the Great Lighthouse, arrived before I'd colonized all of the eastern part of my main area. Deciding that I wasn't having that, I declared war on them, despite my army scarcely being large enough to expand against the barbarians and the difficulty being Sid. In the end, the war was a tactical defeat but strategic victory, as I lost one city (razed), but destroyed two settling parties and established hegemony over the eastern half of the main area.

Rather than attempting to settle the western half, which was rife with barbarians following the Massive Barbarian Uprising, I decided to fortify the mountain dividing the two areas, invest in the eastern half, and let the western half be a graveyard for countless Hittite settling parties, as well as a drain on their treasury as the few cities they did settle were raided. This actually worked halfway decently, with many Hittite settling parties falling to the barbarians, and it took long enough for them to quell the barbarians that they would not get a monopoly on the western area, despite my decision to limit expansion to the mountain.

The decision to not fight for the western half, however, also means that my goal remains merely survival, which would nonetheless be a victory for me at this difficulty level. About the only chance of victory is an accidental victory via UN if most of the AI wind up being conquered, or perhaps a late space race should the AI overwhelm its treasury via unit support in the near future. The date is now 680 AD, which is pretty late for the Middle Ages, and some AI have already reached the Industrial Age. One of the few good things, other than survival, is that my economy has recently picked up significantly, such that I could four-turn Feudalism, so the Middle Ages should, hopefully, be much quicker. Just as long as they aren't much quicker due to meeting an untimely demise :mischief:

.

Map:

Spoiler :

I can see how this would be winnable by a player more used to the higher difficulties and Sid-level barbarians. I'd be fortunate do win it at Demigod, but there are a lot of really good players and I'm sure some will walk away with a victory.

Più Freddo · Nov 28, 2016

Quintillius, I am very happy to see that the game played out along the lines I had imagined with this design!

Did you ever consider trying to build The Great Library?

Kuningas · Nov 30, 2016

Spearman North reveals there is no coast nearby. I build a warrior then settler -> granary.
After that capital operates an archer -> 2 settlers -> an archer -> 2 settlers...
Leksand founded on the coast. 2 curraghs and begin to build Palace prebuild
which swithes to The Great Lighthouse. It completes in turn 1300BC. 2 curraghs
safety pass two turns on sea. Contacts are soon to made with all AIs.
The big landmass to west is swarned with barbarians. As I gather troops I slowly begin
to gain advantage there. In 975BC I trade for Currency and enter to the MA. I'm at war
with Sumerians so can't trade for a Sumerians free tech. Now it's clear I have to tech to Cavalry
as Berserks are not good at inland battles. I won't have to research Navigation
thanks to my GLH.

Cities:
4000bc Mora
3350bc Leksand
2470bc Avesta
2190bc Falun
1990bc Borlänge
1725bc Hedemora
1675bc Ludvika
1600bc Malung
1475bc Säter
1425bc Rättvik
1325bc Orsa
1175bc Gagnef
1100bc Smedjebacken
1100bc Sälen

Techs:
4000bc Masonry, Alphabet, Pottery, WC
2070bc CB, BW (Trade: Sumeria) The Wheel (Trade: India)
1750bc Writing
1725bc Mysticism (Trade: Sumeria) IW (Trade: India)
1625bc Mathematics (Trade: Sumeria)
1600bc HBR (Trade: Aztecs)
1525bc Philosophy
1375bc Map Making (Trade: Hittites)
1225bc Literature. Construction (Trade: India)
1025bc Polytheism (Trade: Egypt)
1000bc CoL
975bc Currency

Contacts:
2210bc Indians
2070bc Sumerians
1700bc Aztecs
1375bc Hittites
1175bc Japanese
1025bc Egypts

QSC Stats (+screenshot):
13 towns 1 city
43 pops
All AA techs except governments and Currency
3 settlers
19 workers
8 warriors
2 archers
1 spearman
2 curraghs
2 barracks
3 granaries
1 library
The Great Lighthouse
1 harbour
6 contacts
1575 gp

lifetap · Nov 30, 2016

at 110BC (few turns after I entered MA)

26 cities (75% of my island, including west)
21 worker
5 settler
16 swords
5 archer
4 warrior
2 curragh
no MA tech, im tech ahead, except for hittites and egypt
have GLib
known all civs, was seriously looking for 7th AI, but fck, theres only 6 of them, haha
war with hittites, i dont want them in my land, they may culture flip me (1-2 turns now)
signed MA all against hittites (is this correct strategy?)

Plans?
Prolly get berserks and get leaders, get smaller islands from powerful/nearest AIs and start ICS.

Jeremy1979 · Nov 30, 2016

I also had a hard time settling the western island. I sent a stack of settlers in protected by 6 spearmen, but they weren't sufficient against all those horsemen. Lost 4 settlers, and the Hittites ended up settling two cities while I fought against barbarians. Later on though those weak cities made nice targets for a few berserks to start my golden age. India also got a city on the western island, much to my disappointment. India surpassed the Hittites as the leading nation in my game around the middle of the middle ages, probably due to a nice golden age of their own.

Early in the game I got lucky and got a galley across the ocean to meet the sumerians, and not long afterwards I'd met all the other civs for some great tech trading opportunities.

Just now entering the Industrial Age with strong infrastructure, total control of my islands, and considering peaceful victory paths. Good luck everyone!

Quintillus · Dec 1, 2016

Più Freddo said:
Quintillius, I am very happy to see that the game played out along the lines I had imagined with this design!

Did you ever consider trying to build The Great Library?

Nope, both because I didn't consider it likely I'd succeed in getting it first, and because I was spending most of my shields on units to fight the barbarians with and thus devoting 400 shields to a not-sure-thing didn't seem especially wise.

If I had succeeded in getting it, though, it would've been a huge boost to the tech. More speculation on what other decisions would have led to in the final thread after I finish the game though

.

templar_x · Dec 15, 2016

well, i am aware now that i was WAY to defensive and could be just so much further than where i stand with this game. yes, I´ll try to find the time for this Sid game...

Initial moves:

Spear north-it´s not coast but a lake

Settle in place, see a 3rd lux

West also lies a lake… this will take some time until we will explore the seas!

Start on gran, both workers irrigate the cow. Then 2 roads. The both irrigate the wine.

Spear goes scounting and finds coast to the NE.

3700 +5fpt established

3650 F3 reports first barb sightings

3600 IBT spear survives first attack

3550 borders expand and show even more juicy land

3400 single barb warrior kills my fortified-on-forest-spear!!!!

3350 granary but no clubs

2 warriors to kick off the 4t-warrior-settler-factory

3150 warrior wins in defense and gets promoted

3050 first settler built

2950 2nd town 2S directly on the furs, connecting my 3rd lux

2750 3rd town 1N2NE by the sea

IBT see first barb horse :eek:

2550 4th town 1W2NW

2470 time chop with factory to have a rax in capital

2350 first curragh out, use is very questionable of course

2310 5th town

2270 Writing in

2150 6th town

2030 7th town

1870 Philo in, and really I am first! Chose MM for my free pick. Lit next.

1750 first curragh makes it over to a seemingly uninhabited island

1700 another curragh makes it over and meets India. They still lack Writing! I open up an embassy, their cap at size-1 :rolleyes:

they give me CB+BW+gold for it. Of course LOTS of towns. I abstain from trading for IW which they also have, so i take only TW for Philo…

also meet Sumeria!!! And they even lack Alpha… maybe the slingshot would still have been worth a try. Trade Alpha+Wri for Myst and their gold. Embassy shows strong capital.

IBT: 2nd granary for WF built.

1650 first galley finds to more borders to the north

Japan: still lacks 3 (!) first tier techs. I get HB and gold fort hem

Egypt: Writ for IW and gold.

I find that i have iron already connected… hope this won´t destroy my combo factory, as i had feared before…

Both are relatively small and might become early victims… however, their caps already show lots of units.

I decide to give MM to Egypt so they hopefully build TGLight for me.

I want to have Egypt fight Japan in the meanwhile… i declare on Japan and have an embassy with Egypt… and Writing of course… but still the MA-options are not there??? Oh, right, even though living on neighbouring islands, they have not yet met each other according to F4 :doh:

But it looks pretty clear that at least i will require Astro fort his.

I still do not fully understand the function of that huge chunk of land next to our island. The 1-tile-bridge is occupied by loads of barbs, so foot units cannot go there at the moment.

looks juicy in the south an hilly in the north.

1600 IBT

3rd gran ready

Capital set for a 6-turner now for 1 archer, 1 worker and 1 settler. Hope it works out, with all the extra strong tiles Piu hast provided us.

1500 IBT 4th lux connected

1425 meet Hittites, they still lack CB – embassy and trade for their little money

Also meet Aztecs the other way, they also lack CB. I would have managed the slingshot for sure! Who would have believed that on Sid… embassy and also rob their bank.

Finally Egypt and Japan know each other, so i draw Egypt into an alliance.

1375 i also give Egypt Lit, my other monopoly tech, so they can build me the GLib

1325 with some losses i clear the mountain spot dividing our island against the barbs.

1250 first lib built

1200 horses connected, Currency in

1150 finally can trade for something… is this really Sid? J trade for CoL…

1125 Egypt builds TGLight… as planned. Ok, so now I need a fleet and to rush towards berserks.

Bc1000 qsc stats:

2 cities, 16 towns

58 pop

Horses, iron and 4 lux connected

2 settlers, 24 workers

7 warriors, 7 vet archers, 1 spear, 1 galley, 3 curraghs

All contacts, all embassies

At war with Japan, allied with Egypt

6 turns into Con, otherwise all AA techs except Mon+Rep (big mistake of course)

1019 gold

925 IBT Egypt gets Con 1-2 turns before me. Enter the MA the next turn.

t_x

Più Freddo · Dec 16, 2016

templar_x, looks like an exciting game. This is indeed Sid. Remember that research costs are very high also for the AI. You have gotten luxuries, rivers, lakes, a large landmass and a commercial trait. Perhaps that was a bit too much of a good thing. I considered changing the Wine tile to one with Wheat, but decided against. It seems maybe I shouldn't have. This is the first Sid game I design and the first one I play (to test it).

Next year we'll be playing Greece on Sid. I'll try to remember considering the commercial balance then.

TheHaze · Dec 16, 2016

I was also the first one to Philo (also took Map Making as free tech), but I actually built the Great Lighthouse myself. First time I hand built a wonder on SID.
Slingshot was definitely possible, in my opinion. I am curious to see if anybody took the gamble.

templar_x · Dec 16, 2016

the game set-up is very cool, i only was too impressed by Sid. especially not playing a lot of Civ any more. i am pretty sure i could have managed BOTH the sling AND TGLight here. but who would have bet that at least one would be more a less a given thing on this level?
t_x

Quintillus · Dec 17, 2016

I was impressed by Sid as well, but this game motivated me to take on Sid in random games earlier this week. I did not far as well, due to not having the advantages of this setup, and always sharing an island due to poor luck, but I actually didn't do as poorly as I expected, and won multiple wars, albeit typically by defeating so many troops while defending that the AI was willing to give me multiple cities/techs for peace. But still, it's given me ideas for how to improve on my play at this level, and some confidence that my one Deity war victory a decade or so again was perhaps less of a fluke than I thought it was at the time. Eventually I may take a look through the War Academy as well, but for now it's enjoyable discovering things on my own and slowly improving.

I'll probably go back and try to win at Demigod first - a much more achievable target - unless I have a breakthrough, but being able to win a war, however defensively, on Sid even on a level playing field is somewhat encouraging.

templar_x · Dec 17, 2016

Deity has been my standard difficulty level for years now, so I think I can advise on that. Sid I played and won several times, including some HoF-entries, but I do not enjoy it. It is a different game you have to play. Like, up to Deity, I overcome the advantages the AIs get. that is practically impossible on Sid. you have to learn to USE THEM AGAINST THEM. Sounds strange, but that is the way.
Regarding you stepping up until Deity, do exactly what you said: read the War Academy, read some Stories, and step up the diff Levels. DG first and Deity next. Monarch->Emperor/Emperor->DG ist quite a step, DG->Deity not so much in my eyes.
When I joined Civfanatics nearly 10 years ago, I was a Monarch level player. I stepped up to Deity and later Sid within a few months, just from the WA and the stories. Then I wrote some of my own.

t_x

lifetap · Dec 17, 2016

Wow! I did not know that wines give +1 food! I was like.. how did he get +5fpt, i only played this game with +4pt.. haha..

and Yeah. I remembered the time that I can only handle DG and Emperor, and what made me learn how to play on deity and sids is one of a thread here that has very SPECIFIC in milestones to achieve. I forgot the thread, but around 50% of the mechanics is there already. They even say that you pick atleast a civ with agriculture or alphabet (prolly as a good stepping stone to try harder levels).

Sids level is a very enjoyable game for me! but make sure you get your CAII working, mines not working in win10, that makes it less enjoyable. I can't wait for the next Sids COTM! Thanks to the sids cotm makers!

Quintillus · Dec 18, 2016

My inspiration continued, and I tried a plain Demigod game. Mediocre at best start from a food/shield perspective, but got Ivory, and SoZ let me win control of my island (small archipelago). Did like in this game and used the next two eras to catch up, finally taking out the leader with Panzers in the late game (which did prove more useful than Dalecarlia's regular tanks) in a long and grueling war, preventing a 20K loss. Learned that I should've let the AI come to me with their stacks, which are far larger than on lower levels, first, though, as my homeland was insufficiently defended and I lost the southern half including my capital before I brought my offensive troops back to retake the home island (only to have to send them across the ocean on the offensive again). Came close to winning with Diplo, but 3 of the 4 surviving civs were candidates so the vote split. In the end the 2nd-place (1st of the remaining) civ was too far ahead of me too, and won histographically, but not before another lengthy war where I wore them down into a clear second in land area... but too late to reach the domination limit before time expired. Needed another 25 or 30 turns.

So this game has been really good for motivating me to play Civ! I'm pretty sure I also need to attack at least one more time before late game, probably against the civ who's farthest behind tech-wise, and may read up on strategies before my next game, but I'm enjoying being in the stage where I'm learning new things about the higher levels each subsequent game I play.

Scratcher · Jan 12, 2017

First of all, I'd like to thank the guys who continue to give their time and efforts to these games. This was a very enjoyable game. The advantages given gave an Emperor player like me a chance to compete, as Sid is really beyond my abilities.

I moved the spear North and the expected coast is actually a lake. Furs also spotted, so I settle in place, immediately connecting silks. Research Writing at minimum. Both workers move to the cow and irrigate. My initial build was warrior, warrior, settler, granary, then settler, settler, archer repeated for a long time.

I settled Leksland to the NE near the cow, and then Avesta to the N on the coast. And quickly sent curraghs out exploring. I continue to expand and explore and complete writing in 1790bc and then research CoL at max. By the time my first suicide curragh makes contacy with the Japanese (1450bc) I have 12 towns settled. The Japanese still don't have Alpha or writing. I then quickly contact the Hittites (1400bc), and Egyptians (1300bc) I am able to trade for many techs but keep them from Philo. I complete Philo in 1225bc and take Republic as my free tech. I draw 7 turns of Anarchy.

Contact made with the Aztecs (1175bc).
Republic formed in 1075bc
Contact with India 1025bc

1000bc Stats
16 towns, Pop 44, Treasury 1245g, Score 707, tiles 156
Lit complete in 4 turns, just Currency left to MA. Lit and Mon unknown.
Units 3 Settler, 16 workers, 2 warriors, 1 spear, 11 archers, 3 curraghs
Builds; 1 granary,

925bc Contact made with the Sumerians.
925bc Hittites complete the Great Lighthouse - My prebuild in Avesta was far to late, I still had something like 16 turns before I completed the Great Lighthouse. I switch the Shields to the Forbidden Palace. But I still have a pre-build for the Great Library in Leksland.
730bc Currency completed and I enter the MA.

My logs for those who are interested.

Towns up to 1000bc

Spoiler :

Techs

Spoiler :

Full log

Spoiler :

Scratcher

Più Freddo · Jan 12, 2017

lifetap said:
Sids level is a very enjoyable game for me! [...] I can't wait for the next Sids COTM! Thanks to the sids cotm makers!

You're welcome! The next Sid game is scheduled for next Christmas. However, we do have some interesting games coming up right now, if anyone is interested in designing them...

I. Larkin · Jan 15, 2017

Wonders

Turn 41 : 2150BC

Hittites created The Colossus in Tarsus

Turn 66 : 1375BC

Hittites created The Great Lighthouse in Tarsus

Turn 74 : 1175BC

Hittites created The Mausoleum of Mausollos in Ugarit

Turn 56 : 1625BC

Sumeria created The Oracle in Ur

Turn 58 : 1575BC

Japan created The Pyramids in Kyoto

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Game line : Curragh met Egyptians, Japan, Hitties, Aztecs, India and Sumeria.

Turn 58 : 1575BC

Phylo +Republic dicoverd

Turn 74 : 1175 BC

Enter MA with Hitties (Republic above).
Egyptians have Monarchy.
Massive Barbarians forced to forget about west part of land.

[C3C] COTM 127 Dalecarlia Sid - 1st Spoiler - End of ancient times

Più Freddo

From space, earth is blue

Quintillus

Resident Medieval Monk

Più Freddo

From space, earth is blue

Kuningas

Deity

lifetap

Chieftain

Jeremy1979

Chieftain

Quintillus

Resident Medieval Monk

templar_x

usually walks his talks

Più Freddo

From space, earth is blue

TheHaze

Chieftain

templar_x

usually walks his talks

Quintillus

Resident Medieval Monk

templar_x

usually walks his talks

lifetap

Chieftain

Quintillus

Resident Medieval Monk

Scratcher

Emperor

Più Freddo

From space, earth is blue

I. Larkin

Deity

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