Deleting Communism

[chiefpaco]

I've decided that Communism is pretty well useless in my games. I can not make it work more efficiently than a Monarchy with a Forbidden Palace in place. The AI mishandles it largely in wartime, the self-destructing, poprushing, and the poor corruption model (well, maybe the AI gets more out of it with a poor FP location than I would...).

My main question is:
Would there be any adverse affects of taking it out of the game?

Then:
Would the AI switch to Monarchy when their Democracy gets so war wearied?

If the answers are "no" and "yes" to the above, then I think I will take it out. I see no advantage to keeping it in. I guess all I would have to do is delete the government in the editor on a mod. Maybe I would then move the police station to espionage or Nationalism, so as to streamline things a bit. Then just changing the preferred/shunned governments.

 

[chiefpaco]

By the way, I also considered changing the hurry method of Communism to cash rush. I wondered if anyone thought that might work as well.

 

[Lt. 'Killer' M.]

Geat ideas!

Give the cash rush a try, that might be the fix it needs, then come back and tell us how it works!

Aside from tha, make sure to give each civ that has Commie as favored or shunned other gov forms in the editor is you take Commie out!

 

[Graeme the mad]

No dont do cash rush - just make people worth more shields - thats what ive done (i think its 45 or something) which may be too high however communism is great and I've had no probs with the Ai handling it under my system

 

[chiefpaco]

I'm concerned the 40+shield poprush might be good for communism (try to rush a factory otherwise!) but it sounds overpowered for despotism to me. Most early buildings and units could be poprushed with 1 citizen without many turns of production, no?

If you could do that just for Communism, I may see your way.

 

[Cartouche Bee]

40 shields is too much. Too bad you couldn't blend population with cash rush to balance things out.

CB

 

[Graeme the mad]

Ive changed despotism so that it requires gold to build - i think its a fair trade off overall

 

[GoalieCivPi]

I don't know why you bother to take commie out (Granted it does need work) The Communism idea is great in theory, and would be ideal in a perfect world, but there were some communist advantages over free-market (remember communism started as an economic system turned government) Anyway, I'm just saying that Communism, while it needs a lot of work, it is a viable gov't. Unfortanatly, the editor doesn't allow you to change the bonuses that were really a communist advantage (i.e. production)

 

[MuddyOne]

I personally like to use communism for it's low culture cost while keeping citizens happy. Marketplace with 8 luxury+ 4 units= 20 happy pills at zero culture. Zero matainance cost if you have smith's as well. Though the lost production when compared to democracy makes the matainance costs a "false" savings.

If making metropolises, the culture savings is tremendous. A cathedral along with the Sisten chapel will still be needed during the 18-25 range of growth to keep everyone happy. 6 culture for the Chapel, and then 3 for each city with cathedral.

To get similar happiness under democracy, both temples and colusiums need to be built- at a cost of 4 additional culture with one less happiness.

Also, once to 100+ cities on a huge map, communism easily outproduces Monarchy. You won't have any cities that are great for making wonders- just a ton of cities that are good for making units. And since I am trying to avoid culture, build wonders isn't in my plans.

Additionally, with such a large force bolstering happiness- the AI won't consider attacking.

Sorry- had to point out some virtues of it

It is quite possible in your game it isn't useful though. Play styles vary a lot. I haven't seen the AI use any of the government type very well though. I often give Democracy to far away governments. Next time they demand something I refuse. 20 turns later, with their cities in an uproar they arrive on my shores and are defeated. They then request peace. I refuse. 5 turns later I arrive on their shores and liberate their revolting cities.

 

[Zouave]

Shouldn't Communism at some point go bankrupt and collapse as happened to the Soviet Union?

BTW, China today is not really "communist" as it has a virtual capitalist economy in many ways.

 

[Maple]

Communism didn't go bankrupt and died, the Soviet Union did.

It's like saying because the Roman Senate eventually died out, republics cannot exist anymore.

 

[TheEvilCheater]

Communism is great for large empire on 2 continets. But like someone else said building wonders under communism is hard and your science suffers alot

 

[chiefpaco]

Well, here were my old arguments about the theoretical & practical aspects of Communism, in the game, of course.

Anybody use Republic or Communism?

I'd be interested to see if my results differ with the new patch since they bumped up the power of courthouses & police stations. All my observations were with 1.17. I think it would just take a reload. Let me see....

 

[Pygzilla]

I use communism for espionage. It seems to make spy planting and cultivation easier

 

[planetfall]

If you really hate communism, all you need to do is go in the editor and increase negative value, like unit maintenance, etc. Then the AI's won't use it.

 

[dannyevilcat]

Originally posted by Zouave
Shouldn't Communism at some point go bankrupt and collapse as happened to the Soviet Union?

BTW, China today is not really "communist" as it has a virtual capitalist economy in many ways.

And most communists would say the Soviet Union wasn't really "communist" either. I say if there's a self-proclaimed "communist" party in power, call them communist, whether they are practicing or not.

For the record, I ALWAYS use the Communist government. It just makes me happy, though it does need tweeking.

 

[Tassadar]

You should see communism as a police state. So built courthouse and police station in every city you got, 2 defender and 2 attacker per city and then you can wage an eternal war. No war weariness, much lower corruption then monarchy.
When i reach modern era with german i like to go commi. reaserch slow down but i already got what i need; bomber, panzer, artillery,battlshipe and carrier. With that you can rule the world.

 

[ufftyuwe]

In my view

there is nothing that does not cost money!!

Thats why I put all cash rush for all gov's
and modified them a bit!

too long to write here...

but communism is pretty much a modern despotism in the game
like democracy a modern republic...

we wouldnt need need democracy then either, cuz we have republic...so if you delete communism, delete democracy as well

 

[DrSpike]

Yeah ditch commie; it's pointless and just serves to give the AI a gun to shoot itself in the foot with. Of course it shouldn't be that way, the govts should be more balanced, but that isn't the case and commie plays no useful role in the game.

 

[Sargon of Akkad]

I once played a game where the whole world was at war and everyone had switched to communism, except for me and the American AI who was at monarchy, which was strange considering how I was playing on v. 1.17f and the Americans would have more then likely got the communist tech from trading.