Founding city of a religion

[Enigma256]

how can i influence this?

i want to found a religion in my future commerce city, as to maximize its income.

i found that it is usually the last city founded, but sometimes it won't chose that one, why not?
does it have something to do with culture? and if so, how do i raise culture by other means than great people and buildings?

 

[NKVD]

I thought it was totally random...

 

[PMabey]

i've noticed a couple of things. If there are cities that currently have no religions then a new religion will be founded there and not in a city to which an existing religion has already spread. Also i have never had a religion founded in my capital unless its my only city. But its still a random process

 

[snipafist]

i've noticed a couple of things. If there are cities that currently have no religions then a new religion will be founded there and not in a city to which an existing religion has already spread. Also i have never had a religion founded in my capital unless its my only city. But its still a random process

I have the same experiences. It seems random, but will pick randomly from amongst your non-religious cities first, so if I was trying to set it up in a commerce city, I'd spread some other religions to every city but that one. Tricky, surely. But doable.

 

[Sisiutil]

It's somewhat random, but the game has some definite built-in preferences.

First off, yes, the game has been programmed with a strong preference for making a city with no existing religion into the holy city, which kind of makes sense.

Second, the game also has a strong disinclination to making your capital a holy city. Your capital will pretty much only become a holy city if it's the only city you have.

Aside from that, it's hard to control. The only time I've successfully forced a specific city to become the holy one is (a) when I've only had two cities or (b) when I had only one city with no religions. The best way to manipulate this would be to ensure that all cities have a religion except the one you want to be the shrine. Since a religion may spread there on its own, the best way to guarantee this would be to spread an existing religion to all existing cities and NOT FOUND THE HOLY CITY until the very turn before you finish researching the tech that gives you the religion.

 

[VoiceOfUnreason]

Link to an earlier discussion

 

[Calavente]

My experience is that until at least 5 cities, the holy city has a LOOOT of chance of going into to last build/captured city..

thus I had newly captured berlin become christian holy city and after that newly founded half loosy city became islam holy city.

in another game, 2 cities : both judaisme and confucianisme were founded in my 2nd city (not the capital) while my capitol didn't have any religion.

 

[cabert]

PMabey and sisiutil are right.

3 situations :
- you have many cities : random it is
- you have only 2 cities : not the capital
- you have only the capital : no choice, is there?

SO the only way to control it is to stop expanding!

If you have 3 cities and a religion, say Confucianism in the second city, you can send the missionary to the 3 rd city to have a chance of getting a second religion (christianism?) in the same city 2nd city, making it the obvious gold city.

 

[bathsheba666]

Can I add a question here?

Sorry to threadjack..but it might be partly related..

I set out to research Buddhism(Meditation?),
but part way along my scouts discovered Polytheism.

So my state religion is I think Hinduism in my capital city.

I discovered Buddhism, built a second and third city, all connected by rivers so I was expecting my state religion to spread.
If I press the Convert option, it seems to show that my second city is Buddhist, but my third ciy is Hindu, like the capital.

In the build options, it will let me build a Hindu or Buddhist temple in my first city.
It will only let me build a Buddhist temple in my second and third cities

Can anyone explain this?

 

[cabert]

I set out to research Buddhism(Meditation?),
but part way along my scouts discovered Polytheism.

So my state religion is I think Hinduism in my capital city.

I discovered Buddhism, built a second and third city, all connected by rivers so I was expecting my state religion to spread.
If I press the Convert option, it seems to show that my second city is Buddhist, but my third ciy is Hindu, like the capital.

In the build options, it will let me build a Hindu or Buddhist temple in my first city.
It will only let me build a Buddhist temple in my second and third cities

Can anyone explain this?

Obviously you failed to understand the game mechanics for religions.

You found a religion in one of your cities when you discover certain techs.
Meditation gives buddhism, polytheism gives hinduism, monotheism gives judaism...
Founding a religion doesn't necessarily mean you have it as a state religion.
You CAN switch to this religion as your state religion, since you have one city with the religion in it.
But it's not automatic.

Another aspect that doesn't seem familiar to you you is religion spreading.

First, you can have multiple religions in one city.
Second, when a city doesn't have a religion in it, one can spread to it automatically, with higher probability for a religion
- from a city connected through a trade route
- with temples/monasteries/shrine/cathedral.
Being state religion has no influence on the spreading, if you're not running theocracy.

Obviously, this happened to both your second and third city : buddhism spread to them automatically. Now that they have buddhism, no other religion will spread automatically in them. If you want hinduism there, you'll need to build hindu missionnaries in your capital (needing organized religion or a monastery) and send them there.

 

[Corporal Kindel]

Here's a slightly related religion question. I was playing a game, and at some point during the game I noticed that of the 6 AIs I'd discovered up to that point 5 of them were one religion (can't remember which now), and I was the odd-man out with a different religion. Needless, I wanted to change my state religion to the AIs religion (so I wouldn't get all the minuses for different religion & avoid the inevitable war which would come as a result), but the change state religion option in the Religious Advisor wouldn't let me change to the AI religion. Obviously, I had no religious buildings from the AI' religion, so there was no way I could convert to the AI religion.

Needless to say, I ended up getting massacred in wars with two or three AIs because there was no way I could change my state religion (that I could figure out).

So, how do you change state religion when you have no buildings or religious presence (by AI missionaries) in any of your cities for that particular religion?

 

[VoiceOfUnreason]

So, how do you change state religion when you have no buildings or religious presence (by AI missionaries) in any of your cities for that particular religion?

If you can't persuade the AI to convert one of your cities, you convert one of theirs. An axeman is just a missionary with city raider promotions

 

[Sir Janus]

So, how do you change state religion when you have no buildings or religious presence (by AI missionaries) in any of your cities for that particular religion?

You either need to build a new city in the hope that the correct religion spreads to it or wait until the AI sends a missionary to one of your cities (I think you will need open borders with the founder of the religion).

In the meantime go to no religion - they will not like you but at least they won't hate you. Unfortunately having no religion makes some of the more beneficial civics useless.

 

[Mind_worm]

Here's a slightly related religion question. I was playing a game, and at some point during the game I noticed that of the 6 AIs I'd discovered up to that point 5 of them were one religion (can't remember which now), and I was the odd-man out with a different religion. Needless, I wanted to change my state religion to the AIs religion (so I wouldn't get all the minuses for different religion & avoid the inevitable war which would come as a result), but the change state religion option in the Religious Advisor wouldn't let me change to the AI religion. Obviously, I had no religious buildings from the AI' religion, so there was no way I could convert to the AI religion.

Needless to say, I ended up getting massacred in wars with two or three AIs because there was no way I could change my state religion (that I could figure out).

So, how do you change state r
eligion when you have no buildings or religious presence (by AI missionaries) in any of your cities for that particular religion?

the buildings dont matter. You couldnt switch because you didnt have that religion.

I think I would be proactive there. Decalre war asap on your nearest neighbor and keep a city. Then you will have the religion and can switch (you can then make peace or continue on and conquer him). you will get -1 declare war on friend demerits but you will lose -1 to -4 negs for religion and gain +4 to +8 for religion

(p.s. choose the ai that founded the religion if you have the option, capturing the holy city here will help bunches)

 

[kcbrett5]

Obviously, this happened to both your second and third city : buddhism spread to them automatically. Now that they have buddhism, no other religion will spread automatically in them. If you want hinduism there, you'll need to build hindu missionnaries in your capital (needing organized religion or a monastery) and send them there.

Obviously you also fail to understand how religions spread ye hypocritical one.

Of course religion can automatically spread to a city that already has religion. I have never played in a game where I didn't have neighboring religions spread into my cities that already had other religions. Of course, sometimes your neighbors will send you missionaries which also helps spread the religion to your cities automatically.

 

[VoiceOfUnreason]

Of course religion can automatically spread to a city that already has religion. I have never played in a game where I didn't have neighboring religions spread into my cities that already had other religions.

CvCity::doReligion() [ CvCity.cpp ] says that you are full of it.

 

[Calavente]

I concure... I never have seen any foreign religion come into my place if all cities already have a religion :
@ kcbrett5 : no not make the mistake of thinking that choosing a state religion gives that religion to every city. do not misundertand city for civilisation..

 

[cabert]

Obviously you also fail to understand how religions spread ye hypocritical one.

Of course religion can automatically spread to a city that already has religion. I have never played in a game where I didn't have neighboring religions spread into my cities that already had other religions. Of course, sometimes your neighbors will send you missionaries which also helps spread the religion to your cities automatically.

2 persons just said you're wrong...
But i'm sure you know better than the SDK or than game experience from Cavalente and myself.

 

[Sisiutil]

Of course religion can automatically spread to a city that already has religion.

If you've seen this happening, it's because the AI sent a missionary to that city. Once the city has a religion, that is the only other way to horn another one in there.