G-Minor 46

[Denniz]

[img=right]http://www.civfanatics.net/methos/hof/staff/gauntlet.gif[/img]While the general Hall of Fame is an ongoing competition, we like to run time-definite competitions between updates that we call Gauntlets. Standard Hall of Fame rules (*) still apply, but any games meeting the settings will be counted towards the Gauntlet.

[size=+1](*) Please read the >> HOF rules << BEFORE playing!
[/size]​

Settings:

• Victory Condition: Religious (though all victory conditions must be enabled)
• Difficulty: Prince
• Starting Era: Ancient
• Map Size: Standard
• Map Type: Medium and Small
• Speed: Normal
• Civ: Holy Roman Empire (Charlemange)
• Opponents: Must include Arabia (Saladin), Aztec (Montezuma), Byzantium (Justinian), Egypt (Ramesses II), India (Asoka), Spain (Isabella)
• Version: 3.13.001
• Date: 25th June to 10th July 2008

Must not play as Inca.

The earliest finish date wins, with score as a tiebreaker

 

[Wahnfried]

A very nice task. I think, I will try to submit my first Prince game.
To play Charlemagne and the HRE will be interesting... I think it is impossible to get one of the earlier religions, but we shall see.

 

[Harbourboy]

What are the tips for this one? How do you race for religious victory whilst avoiding being stomped by Montezuma?

 

[bestje]

the problem with this one is that half the AIs are going to start on another land mass which means getting a theology beeline then an optics beeline, whilst defending yourself against the AIs who are all nutters

Charlemagne is Imp Pro both of which are useful in this game and starts with mysticism and hunting.

Best plan is perhaps a theology slingshot with the oracle then try not to spread christianity until you are ready

This looks like a cheesy self vote AP win will be out of the question

 

[ssjos]

Imp and Pro both seems like totally useless traits to me

 

[Mesix]

the problem with this one is that half the AIs are going to start on another land mass which means getting a theology beeline then an optics beeline, whilst defending yourself against the AIs who are all nutters

Charlemagne is Imp Pro both of which are useful in this game and starts with mysticism and hunting.

Best plan is perhaps a theology slingshot with the oracle then try not to spread christianity until you are ready

This looks like a cheesy self vote AP win will be out of the question

I plan to do a cheesy self vote AP win!

 

[HolyHandGrenade]

What are the tips for this one? How do you race for religious victory whilst avoiding being stomped by Montezuma?

From the BtS-Beta gauntlet I can give you
- low sea levels to avoid the need for Optics
- no religion until your AP-religion is spread to all opponents
- conquer and grow to finally self-vote

 

[WilliamOfOrange]

That sounds like a plan. I was thinking of adding a few zealot AIs to be friendlier ones and let them spread the religion to me while relying on Burger King's REXing to give me the pop to win, however this map might not let that happen.

Maybe not so on prince but could you not take Theology from a GP generated by Oracle and Stonehenge GPPs? You could use the free tech to get you out to see earlier.

I am planning for an ASAP rush to the nearest neighbor to allow me to expand the way the Burger King can. They don't call him the Whopper for nothing!

Does the AI start with Archery on Prince?

 

[ssjos]

From the BtS-Beta gauntlet I can give you
- low sea levels to avoid the need for Optics
- no religion until your AP-religion is spread to all opponents
- conquer and grow to finally self-vote

I tried a game with low sea levels, I ended up on a continent with saladin and there was absolutly no way to get to the other continent

Do you need loads of luck to make low sealevel connect the continents?
Do you need special type of continent setting? I think I had normal continents, other options were Snaky continents, Unpredictable and islands

 

[HolyHandGrenade]

That sounds like a plan. I was thinking of adding a few zealot AIs to be friendlier ones and let them spread the religion to me while relying on Burger King's REXing to give me the pop to win, however this map might not let that happen.

From what I remember this is not a good strategy, each additional civ requires one more missionary to be build and one more diplomatic opponent to calm.

Maybe not so on prince but could you not take Theology from a GP generated by Oracle and Stonehenge GPPs? You could use the free tech to get you out to see earlier.

I think I made CS slingshot and used a GP for Theology in the BtS-Beta

I am planning for an ASAP rush to the nearest neighbor to allow me to expand the way the Burger King can. They don't call him the Whopper for nothing!

If you plan a Axe-rush, this seems doable, warrior rush may be really difficult, normal speed and starting with a scout will not give enough turns to build a warrior and reach your nearest neighbor.

Does the AI start with Archery on Prince?

As far as I know, the AI won't have Archery at Prince (and I am pretty sure...)

 

[HolyHandGrenade]

Before everyone is asking - here is the helpful discussion of BtS-Beta 8

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=254134

 

[Mesix]

My first attempt did not go as well as I hoped. I finished in 1935n not a stellar time I know. I did not have enough population to self vote, but at least I was the only candidate. I had to butter up two AI players into voting for me too. Not an easy task since most of the AI players started on the other side of the world and all shared a religion that I did not have!

I will try low sea level next time. I will also try to REX more so that I have a high enough population to self vote.

 

[WilliamOfOrange]

Thanks for the link HHG.

You have been just as helpful to me in this thread as that one, even answering my same question twice!

 

[Harbourboy]

I do find Religion to be one of the more frustrating victory types, as sometimes you just have no control over religion spread. What if your opponents are on Theocracy or something by the time you get there?

 

[cabert]

I do find Religion to be one of the more frustrating victory types, as sometimes you just have no control over religion spread. What if your opponents are on Theocracy or something by the time you get there?

You do have few options :
option 1 : gift them a missionary
option 2 : take them down (and spread your religion to their cities). Having a vassal is also cool.
option 3 : build a settler and a missionary. Plant a worthless city right under their nose. You will be asked to "liberate" the city. Do it just after spreading the religion.

 

[Mesix]

You do have few options :
option 1 : gift them a missionary
option 2 : take them down (and spread your religion to their cities). Having a vassal is also cool.
option 3 : build a settler and a missionary. Plant a worthless city right under their nose. You will be asked to "liberate" the city. Do it just after spreading the religion.

I usually go for option 1. I might try option 3 in the future to limit their votes. Thanks for the advice.

 

[bestje]

Imp and Pro both seems like totally useless traits to me

Imp is useful as you can get your early cities up and running quickly. It also makes the settler missionary trick to give the AIs the exact number of votes to allow you to pull off the self vote exploit easier. But even without this borderline cheating more votes are better and Imp lets you get more cities out faster.

Pro is useful as it gets you cheap walls and better archers and you may well need them with Monty etc out there

From the BtS-Beta gauntlet I can give you
- low sea levels to avoid the need for Optics
- no religion until your AP-religion is spread to all opponents
- conquer and grow to finally self-vote

you need to be in a state religion whilst you build the AP, I think targeting a christian AP is probably the way to do this. as usually the AI will be in the other religions and once its built switch to the most popular religion, as the AP builder you don't need to be in its religion to win

 

[HolyHandGrenade]

Before everyone is asking - here is the helpful discussion of BtS-Beta 8

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=254134

Thanks for the link HHG.

You have been just as helpful to me in this thread as that one, even answering my same question twice!

yw - to prevent answering most questions several times I searched the link above. I think EVERYTHING is answered there. It was a very valuable discussion in that thread revealing all not visible backgrounds of religious victories.

Imp is useful as you can get your early cities up and running quickly. It also makes the settler missionary trick to give the AIs the exact number of votes to allow you to pull off the self vote exploit easier. But even without this borderline cheating more votes are better and Imp lets you get more cities out faster.

I think the starting position is more important in this task. Read the thread mentioned above and the really detailed walkthrough of Andrej and you will agree with me

Pro is useful as it gets you cheap walls and better archers and you may well need them with Monty etc out there

You don't need walls and Archers. My strategy will be:
- CS slingshot
- conquer the initial continent
- Theology with GP
- infiltrate each reamining civ with a Conf-missionary
- switch to Conf - build AP
- switch to NoReli - build HG until 1 turn to complete
- when vote comes in: switch to conf, complete HG

This is the theory - lets see what the reality reveals

you need to be in a state religion whilst you build the AP, I think targeting a christian AP is probably the way to do this. as usually the AI will be in the other religions and once its built switch to the most popular religion, as the AP builder you don't need to be in its religion to win

it is better let the non-AP-religions spread througout the world, and only infiltrate the smallest cities of your opponents with the AP-religion. With this strategy you can self-vote

 

[Mesix]

I'm in first place. That's what hapens when you are the only one to submit a game so far. I'm sure to have a better date than 1935 by the time other submission start coming in.

 

[HolyHandGrenade]

I'm in first place. That's what hapens when you are the only one to submit a game so far. I'm sure to have a better date than 1935 by the time other submission start coming in.

if it's BC you are the king - if it's AD you will keep your current last place