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GOTM 171 spoiler

Discussion in 'Civ2 - Game of the Month' started by lasingularidad, Nov 20, 2015.

  1. Ali Ardavan

    Ali Ardavan Mathematician Moderator Civ2 GOTM Staff

    Joined:
    May 29, 2002
    Messages:
    2,930
    Location:
    Michigan, USA
    Date Produced Tech achieved Other notables

    -4000 Settler move towards the river
    -3950 25g from hut.
    -3900 Russian, Japanese, French, Egyptian are in
    Beijing founded at 3 special (21,17) on river
    -3700 Warrior
    -3650 Bronze
    -3550 empty hut
    -3450 Bronze -> French (2) -> Burial
    -3350 Phalanx Pottery from hut. Colossus started.

    Status at -3000
    City Size: 2 Government: Despotism Gold: 61 Techs: 4 Trade routes: 0
    Structures:
    Wonders:
    Units: 1 None settler, 1 warrior, 1 phalanx
    Goals: Monarchy, Colossus, Marco?
    Russian: No contact
    Japanese: No contact
    French: No embassy
    Egyptian: No contact

    -2950 Code of Laws research on Monarchy started
    -2800 another empty hut!
    -2600 Beijing is size 3.
    -2550 None Archer from polar hut
    -2250 Monarchy Monarchy established. T3L0S7
    -2100 Monarchy -> Egyptian -> peace.

    Status at -2000
    City Size: 3 Government: Monarchy Gold: 102 Techs: 6 Trade routes: 0
    Structures:
    Wonders:
    Units: 1 None settler, 1 warrior, 1 phalanx, 1 none archer
    Goals: Colossus (2 turns), Marco?
    Russian: No contact
    Japanese: No contact
    French: No embassy
    Egyptian: No embassy

    -1900 Colossus Alphabet -> Russian (6) -> Mysticism
    -1700 Writing Beijing is size 4
    -1600 Library
    -1500 peace -> Japanese (4).
    My power dropped from Strong to moderate
    -1350 Temple Literacy
    -1150 Diplomat Beijing is size 5.
    -1100 Found Memphis; shares 2 tiles with Beijing
    -1050 Republic Republic established. T0L4S6
    Egyptian embassy established.
    -1000 Diplomat Beijing celebrates

    Status at -1000
    City Size: 5 Government: Republic Gold: 83 Techs: 10 Trade routes: 0
    Structures: Library, Temple
    Wonders: Colossus
    Units: 1 None settler, 1 warrior, 1 phalanx, 1 none archer, 1 diplomat
    Goals: Establishing embassies with rivals instead of Marco, Philosophy, Trade
    Russian: No embassy
    Japanese: No embassy
    French: No embassy
    Egyptian: 2 cities, 9 techs;

    -0975 Beijing is size 6. T0L5S5
    -0950 Beijing is size 7. Power climbed to Mighty
    -0925 Diplomat Beijing is size 8. Power climbed to Supreme
    French embassy established. T0L3S7
    -0900 Warrior disbanded
    Russian (5) demand 50g and declare war
    -0875 Diplomat Philosophy Literacy -> Egyptian (4) -> Mapmaking
    Currency Republic -> Egyptian (4) -> Masonry
    Philosophy -> Egyptian(4) -> maps
    T3L3S4
    -0850 Japanese demand 50g and declare war
    -0825 Japanese lose 2 warriors attacking me
    tech bombed hostile French to get their maps
    Thankfully I can also see Kyoto
    French & Egyptians reject offer of alliance
    reached peace with Russians
    tech bombed Russians to get their maps
    -0800 T4L2S4
    -0775 Marketplace Japanese archer dies in attack on mine.
    T0L2S8
    -0750 Reached cease fire with Japanese
    -0700 Barbarian horseman from hut
    Russian embassy established
    -0675 Barbarian walks away from my diplomat
    -0650 Construction T2L4S4
    -0625 Aqueduct Beijing celebrates
    -0600 Beijing is size 9 and unable to celebrate
    T2L2S6
    -0575 Construction, pottery -> Russian -> Iron W.
    Construction -> Egyptian ->Horseback riding
    French & Egyptians reject offer of alliance
    -0550 Diplomat Math from hut. T1L2S7
    -0525 Mysticism -> Egyptian -> Warrior Code

    Status at -0500
    City Size: 9 Government: Republic Gold: 48 Techs: 19 Trade routes: 0
    Structures: Library, Temple, Marketplace, Aqueduct
    Wonders: Colossus
    Units: 1 None settler, 1 phalanx, 1 none archer, 2 diplomats
    Goals: Trade, establishing Japanese embassy, reaching size 12
    Russian: 3 cities, 14 techs
    Japanese: No embassy
    French: 2 cities, 13 techs
    Egyptian: 3 cities, 16 techs;

    -0475 Japanese embassy established
    -0450 Legion
    -0425 Russian chariot steps in my city radius
    Beijing falls in disorder
    Russians declare war and I kill their chariot
    -0375 Egyptians build Pyramids. T1L3S6
    -0350 Trade Beijing is size 10 and still unable to celebrate
    T4L3S3
    -0325 Caravan
    -0275 Caravan
    -0225 Hides to Kyoto for 120 for the first route
    -0200 Caravan
    -0175 Egyptians build Hanging Gardens. T3L3S4
    Wine to Kyoto for 150 for the second route
    -0150 Russian warrior in my city border killed
    Legion turns vet
    -0125 Colosseum Bridge Building Beijing celebrates
    -0100 Caravan Beijing is size 11
    -0075 Caravan Beijing is size 12. Temple sold. T0L2S8
    Hides to Orleans for 132 for the third route

    Status at +1
    City Size: 12 Government: Republic Gold: 196 Techs: 21 Trade routes: 3
    Structures: Library, Marketplace, Aqueduct, Colosseum
    Wonders: Colossus
    Units: 1 None settler, 1 phalanx, 1 none archer, 1 legion, 1 diplomat, 2 vans
    Goals: Shakespeare, Copernicus, sanitation
    Russian: 3 cities, 16 techs; war with me
    Japanese: 3 cities, 17 techs; war with Egyptians
    French: 2 cities, 15 techs
    Egyptian: 3 cities, 17 techs; Pyramids, Hanging Gardens; war with Japanese
     
  2. Ali Ardavan

    Ali Ardavan Mathematician Moderator Civ2 GOTM Staff

    Joined:
    May 29, 2002
    Messages:
    2,930
    Location:
    Michigan, USA
    +0060 Medicine
    +0180 Hides to Thebes for 232
    +0200 Astronomy Hides to Thebes for 236
    +0280 Copernicus
    +0300 Caravan Wheel
    +0320 Caravan
    +0340 Caravan
    +0360 Caravan Japanese demand 50g and declare war
    +0380 Caravan Engineering Hides to Kyoto for 160
    +0400 Caravan
    +0420 Legion
    +0440 Sanitation Colosseum sold.
    +0480 Japanese lose a horse attacking my archer
    Trade, Sanitation -> French -> University\
    +0500 Sewer T0L3S7. Senate hands cease fire to Russians

    Status at +500
    City Size: 12 Government: Republic Gold: 43 Techs: 27 Trade routes: 3
    Structures: Library, Marketplace, Aqueduct, Sewer
    Wonders: Colossus, Copernicus
    Units: 1 None settler, 1 phalanx, 1 none archer, 2 legions, 1 diplomat, 5 vans
    Goals: Shakespeare (3 turns), University, Newton
    Russian: 3 cities, 17 techs; war with Egyptians
    Japanese: 3 cities, 19 techs; war with me
    French: 3 cities, 19 techs
    Egyptian: 4 cities, 20 techs; Pyramids, Hanging Gardens; war with Russians

    +0520 Beijing is size 13
    +0560 Shakespeare Beijing celebrates. Accepted Russian peace
    +0580 Theory of Gravity Beijing is size 14. T3L3S4
    Japanese horse dies in attack on me
    Sanitation -> Egyptian -> Seafaring, maps
    +0600 Beijing is size 15
    +0620 Harbor Beijing is size 16
    +0640 Beijing is size 17
    Russians raze Egyptian Alexanderia
    +0660 Beijing is size 18
    +0680 Beijing is size 19 and out of food. T3L0S7
    Agreed to Japanese peace
    +0720 University Banking
    +0740 Caravan
    +0780 Caravan
    +0800 Chemistry
    +0820 Caravan
    +0860 Caravan
    +0880 Invention T2L0S8
    +0900 Caravan
    +0920 Hides to Moscow for 138
    +0940 Caravan
    +0960 Economics French build Great Library
    +0980 Caravan Hides to St. Petersburg for 136
    +1000 Caravan Coal to Thebes for 172

    Status at +1000
    City Size: 19 Government: Republic Gold: 461 Techs: 33 Trade routes: 3
    Structures: Library, Marketplace, Aqueduct, Sewer, University, Harbor
    Wonders: Colossus, Copernicus, Shakespeare
    Units: 1 None settler, 1 phalanx, 1 none archer, 2 legions, 1 diplomat, 5 vans
    Goals: Explosives, refrigeration, railroad, Newton
    Russian: 3 cities, 19 techs; war with Egyptians
    Japanese: 3 cities, 22 techs;
    French: 4 cities, 21 techs; Great Library
    Egyptian: 6 cities, 25 techs; Pyramids, Hanging Gardens; war with Russians

    +1020 Caravan Gunpowder
    +1060 Caravan Hides to Pi-Ramses for 66
    +1100 Democracy Democracy established. T0L0S10
    Japanese demand money and declare war
    +1120 Japanese horse dies attacking me
    Japanese catapult killed
    +1140 Mountain top archer survives Jap crusader
    +1160 Newton Explosives Invention -> Egyptian (6) -> Polytheism
    T1L0S9. Vet phalanx disbanded
    +1180 Engineer
    +1220 Bank Navigation
    +1260 French steal seafaring; I preserve the peace
    +1280 Stock Exchange Metallurgy T0L0S10
    Japanese crusader killed
    +1300 Mountain top archer survives Jap catapult
    +1320 Cannon Mountain top archer survives Jap crusader
    +1340 Physics
    +1360 Explorer Cannon kills Japanese catapult and turns vet
    +1380 Japanese settler killed before making a fort
    +1400 Magnetism Cannon kills Japanese crusader
    +1420 Caravan Accepted Japanese peace offer
    +1460 Steam Engine T2L0S8
    +1480 Caravan

    Status at +1500
    City Size: 18 Government: Democracy Gold: 165 Techs: 42 Trade routes: 3
    Structures: Library, Marketplace, Aqueduct, Sewer, University, Harbor, Bank, Stock Exchange
    Wonders: Colossus, Copernicus, Shakespeare, Newton
    Units: 1 None settler, 1 Engineer, 1 none archer, 2 legions, 1 cannon, 1 diplomat, 2 vans, 1 explorer
    Goals: Railroad (2 turns), refrigeration
    Russian: 3 cities, 22 techs;
    Japanese: 3 cities, 23 techs; war with French and Egyptians
    French: 5 cities, 29 techs; Great Library; war with Japanese
    Egyptian: 6 cities, 30 techs; Pyramids, Hanging Gardens; war with Japanese

    +1510 Egyptians build Leo
    +1520 Caravan Railroad French sneak attack and kill a vet legion
    cannon kills 2 French units. T0L0S10
    +1540 Caravan cannon kills 2 French units.
    +1550 Electricity Accepted French peace offer. T2L0S8
    +1560 Caravan
    +1580 Caravan
    +1590 Refrigeration
    +1600 Supermarket
    +1620 Caravan Japanese demand Gunpowder & declare war
    +1630 Conscription Mountain top archer in fort survives 2 Japs
    +1640 Rifleman Egyptians build Marco
    Egyptians demand 150g and declare war
    Egyptian crux killed attacking settler in fort
    +1650 Mountain top archer in fort survives Jap crux
    +1660 Caravan Mountain top archer in fort survives Jap cat
    cannon kills Japanese pikeman on mountain
    +1670 Atomic Theory First pollution appears
    +1680 Rifleman Egyptians kill a caravan
    Rifleman kills 2 Egyptian units and turns vet
    Rifleman kills Egyptian diplomat
    +1700 Rifleman Rifleman kills Egyptian crux and turns vet
    Engineer transforms second hill into plains
    +1710 Industrialization Egyptian knight dies attacking my fort
    Rifleman kills Egyptian settler
    +1720 Caravan Egyptian knight dies attacking my fort
    Rifleman kills Egyptian catapult
    +1730 T1L0S9
    +1740 Caravan
    +1750 Steel Rifleman kills Egyptian diplomat
    Railroad -> Russian -> Chivalry

    Status at +1750
    City Size: 18 Government: Democracy Gold: 320 Techs: 50 Trade routes: 3
    Structures: Library, Marketplace, Aqueduct, Sewer, University, Harbor, Bank, Stock Exchange, supermarket
    Wonders: Colossus, Copernicus, Shakespeare, Newton
    Units: 1 None settler, 1 Engineer, 1 none archer, 1 legion, 3 riflemen, 1 cannon, 1 diplomat, 9 vans, 1 explorer
    Goals: Superhighways, Computers, Espionage, Mobile warfare
    Russian: 3 cities, 26 techs;
    Japanese: 3 cities, 24 techs; war with me
    French: 5 cities, 33 techs; Great Library;
    Egyptian: 6 cities, 34 techs; Pyramids, Hanging Gardens, Marco, Leo; war with me

    +1752 Caravan
    +1754 Accepted Egyptian offer of peace
    +1756 Caravan Accepted Japanese offer of 300g for peace
    +1758 Communism
    +1760 Caravan
    +1764 Caravan Barbarian ship emerges from nearby lake
    Barbarian crusader dies in attack on my fort
    +1766 Corporation T0L0S10
    +1770 Refining Power dropped to Strong!
    Tech cost went from 1976 to 1060!
    Cloth to Egyptian Minsk for a petty 88
    +1774 Combustion
    +1778 Automobile Japanese sneak attack and lose an archer
    T8L2S0
    +1780 Darwin Mass Production Beijing celebrates. T0L2S8
    Leadership Accepted Japanese peace offer
    +1782 Beijing is size 19
    +1784 Superhighways Electronics Beijing is size 20. Explorer disbanded
    +1786 Beijing is size 21. French build Sun Tzu
    +1788 Tactics Beijing is size 22. Coal to Thebes for 277
    +1790 Mass Transit Beijing is size 23.
    Power jumped back to Mighty again
    +1792 Beijing is size 24 and temporarily out of food
    T0L0S10
    +1794 Freight Espionage Gold to French Tours for 362.
    +1796 Cloth to Egyptian Minsk for 255
    +1798 Freight Machine Tools
    +1804 Recycling Egyptians build Suffrage. T0L2S8
    +1806 Beijing celebrates
    +1808 Beijing is size 25
    +1810 Recycling center Beijing is size 26
    +1812 Mini Beijing is size 27. Engineer disbanded
    +1814 Factory Beijing is size 28 and maxed out
    T0L0S10. Sewer sold
    +1816 Spy
    +1818 Computers Egyptians build Michelangelo.
    Diplomat disbanded
    +1820 Research Lab
    +1822 Mobile warfare
    +1824 Freight
    +1828 Freight Nuclear Fission Cloth to Egyptian Minsk for 250
    +1830 Egyptians build statue of Liberty
    +1832 Freight Nuclear Power T1L0S9
    +1836 Nuclear Plant
    +1838 Freight Laser
    +1840 Freight Barbarian rifleman dies in attack on my fort
    +1842 Freight
    +1844 Freight Robotics Conscription -> French -> Feudalism
    +1846 Freight
    +1848 Freight Egyptians build Magellan
    +1850 Freight Flight T0L0S10. Oil to Memphis for a petty 142
     
  3. Ali Ardavan

    Ali Ardavan Mathematician Moderator Civ2 GOTM Staff

    Joined:
    May 29, 2002
    Messages:
    2,930
    Location:
    Michigan, USA
    The end was quite exciting. Japanese and French repeatedly attacked me. Egyptians and Russians sent some forces my way but backed away when faced with stiff resistance. Right after launch a bunch of French diplomats sneaked in and destroyed 3 structures in my city.

    The launch took as long as I expected and then some. Main reason was slow research. I was Mighty all along and my research cost was well above 3K near the end. I was almost 100% science which drained my treasury. Trade was not much help either as payoffs were pretty low (typically less than 200g after Flight). In the end I went broke and could not produce one space ship part per turn.

    +1851 Freight
    +1852 Freight
    +1853 Freight Radio Cloth to Minsk for 130
    +1854 Freight
    +1855 Freight
    +1856 Freight Advanced Flight Oil to Memphis for 142
    +1857 Barracks French build Adam Smith. Legion disbanded
    +1858 Offshore platform Cannon disbanded
    +1859 Tank Amphibious Warfare Japs sneak attack and lose 2 units. T2L0S8
    +1860 Marine Japs lose another unit attacking me
    +1861 Japs lose a unit attacking me and I kill one
    +1862 Jap diplomat killed
    +1863 Manufacturing Pl. Rocketry Japs lose 2 units attacking me and I kill 3
    Aqueduct sold. T1L0S9
    +1865 Japs lose a unit attacking me and I kill 2
    +1866 Jap unit killed
    +1867 Space Flight 2 Jap units killed
    +1868 Apollo
    +1869 SS Structural
    +1870 SS Structural Accepted Japanese offer of 200g for peace
    +1871 SS Structural Environmentalism Egyptians build UN
    +1872 SS Structural
    +1873 SS Structural
    +1874 SS Structural
    +1875 SS Structural Guerrilla warfare
    +1876 SS Structural
    +1877 SS Structural
    +1878 SS Structural
    +1879 SS Structural Plastics
    +1880 SS Structural T0L0S10 to compensate for pollution
    +1881 SS Structural
    +1882 SS Structural
    +1883 SS Structural SuperConductor
    +1884 SS Component Japs lose 2 units attacking me and I kill 3
    +1885 Production lost: Japs step on my mountain
    3 Japanese units killed
    +1886 SS Module Japs lose a unit attacking me
    +1887 SS Component Labor Union
    +1888 SS Component Accepted Japanese offer of 200g for peace
    Without it I would have gone broke this turn
    +1889 SS Component
    +1890 SS Component Only 20g left. Library sold.
    +1891 Library Fusion Power T4L0S6
    +1893 SS Component
    +1894 SS Module
    +1895 Marketplace sold to raise funds
    +1896 SS Module 15s3c1m space ship launched.
    +1897 Marketplace French diplomats attack in bunch
    They destroy barracks, library, harbor
    Egyptians place diplomat in my city radius
    French Lyons attacked and 2 units killed
    +1898 Library Stealth French kill my tank. 2 French units killed
    Egyptian diplomats back off
    +1899 Stealth Fighter Again Egyptian diplomats back off
    2 French units killed. Lyons down to size 2
    +1900 Barracks 4 French units killed. St. fighter needs rest
    Lyons and Orleans are defenseless
    +1901 Tank Japanese diplomats back off
    +1902 Harbor 1 French unit killed
    +1903 Airport Pollution free for the first time in many years
    2 French units killed
    +1904 Mech Infantry Combined Arms Japanese declare war rather than move troops
    3 French and 2 Japanese units killed
    +1905 Mech Infantry Egyptians approach with a mass of diplomats built a wall of units in front of them
    +1906 Mech Infantry Egyptian diplomats withdraw
    3 Japanese diplomats killed
    +1907 Mech Infantry Russian catapult backs off
    +1908 French cannon killed
    +1909 Egyptians build Eiffel. 3 French units killed
    +1910 Lighthouse Future Tech 1 T0L10S0
    +1911 Space ship arrives
     
  4. lasingularidad

    lasingularidad Chieftain

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2015
    Messages:
    27
    Location:
    Spain
    Last part of my log. I had to stop playing after that so I didn't finished.

    1040 Leo Workshop.
    1060 Navigation -> Physics
    1080 Melbourne(44) south pole. Sydney(45) north pole.
    1010 Physics -> Theory of Gravity. Beads to moscow 96g. Gold domestic 219g.
    1100 Silver 75g.
    1140 Theory of Gravity -> Steam Engine
    1160 Revolution. 25 tribute. Attack moscow. 2 (vet) crusaders die
    attacking phallanx (probably vet, on river). 1 destroy legion. 2
    diplomats destroy granary and barrack, no one destroy almost
    built wall.
    1180 Barbarians chivarly near undefended
    Supercita. Caravel dies.
    1200 Steam Engine -> Railroad. Crusader dies attacking Elephant! Large
    city now undefended. Legion dies attacking settler. I never
    tought thing could go as bad. Silver 77g; Copper 76g.
    1220 Catapult in Moscow destroy my fortified musketeer.
    1240 Elephant in Moscow destroy crusader waiting on outside mountain.
    1260 Railroad -> Industrialization. I forgot to prepare for this and
    almost all cities in riot.
    1280 Finally took Moscow(45), 386g, but this was really painful and I
    think I lost about 10 turns doing this. How bad I was (also not
    much luck). Cease fire. The plan is now to go for eternal
    peace. My reputation is Atrocious but I hope enough tech gifting
    will make it.
    1300 Industrialization -> Magnetism
    1320 Piroto(46), Tebete(47) and Tarata(47) founded.
    1340 Magnetism -> Corporation. Domestic 30g. Tiriti(48) founded.
    1360 Build Adam's Smith
    1380 Corporation -> Electricity. Domestic 63g, 47g, 42g.
    1400 Domestic 55g, 43g, 120g, 32g, 37g, 35g, 44g, 61g, 45g, 137g
    1420 Domestic 53g, 48g, 53g
    1440 Genetic Engineering -> Refrigeration. Domestic: 50g, 66g, 50g
    1460 Domestic 77g
    1480 Refrigeration -> Steel. Domestic 55g, 50g, 45g. Tax: 4.1.5. Will
    slow down research but need to build more trade routes,
    supermarket and Cure for the Cancer asap.
    1500 Steel -> Refining. Barb crusader lands and destroy
    irigation. Destroyed using my single defense musketeer unit now
    that railroad is fully built. Domestic: 48g, 41g.

    Stats at 1500AD:
    pop.: 8.86M; Cities: 50; Techs: 52; Gold: 38; Gov.: demo.; Wonders: HG,PY,Mikes,Colossus,MPE,Shakespear,Copernicus,JSBach,Isac,Adam,Newton; TR: 27D/7F
    units: 42 engineers, 2 musketeer, 1 transport, 1 diplo, 1 freigth
    Goals: AC

    Russians: embassy, ceased-fire, cordial (1 size-2 city)

    1510 Food storage engineer lost (barb pillage). Domestic 21g, 41g,
    38g, 52g, 127g. Tax: 1.3.6.
    1520 Domestic 102g, 40g, 32g, 132g, 43g
    1530 Domestic 44g, 94g, 66g, 62g

    EMERGENCY FINISH :)

    1540 Cure for the Cancer built. All engineers used to build last minute cities. Tax: 0.10.0. Bribe last Russian city.
     
  5. lasingularidad

    lasingularidad Chieftain

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2015
    Messages:
    27
    Location:
    Spain
    But... Respawn in the middle of unreachable mountains... This is the
    first one in the whole game. Why now ? RB a lot of explorers and dips
    to cover the whole place. I though no respawn would arise after 1500AD
    ?

    1570 Build LH, ST and Richard Crusard. Bribe celtic settler. Respawn
    without unit ! I share maps, but can't see any unit anywhere.

    1580 Invisible celts change govt to republic and are destroyed by
    barbs ?? New roman settler, they declare war. Build Great
    Wall. Bribe that settler. New respawn, enraged romans that do not
    want to chat. It will never finish...

    1590 Roman destroyed by barbarians. END (?!?).
     
  6. Ali Ardavan

    Ali Ardavan Mathematician Moderator Civ2 GOTM Staff

    Joined:
    May 29, 2002
    Messages:
    2,930
    Location:
    Michigan, USA
    They are rare but not unheard of. Hope you finished.
     
  7. lasingularidad

    lasingularidad Chieftain

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2015
    Messages:
    27
    Location:
    Spain
    Yes, I did finish in 1590. The (?!?) meant I did not understood why, but I think I have the explanation now : when you bribe the only settler of a civ, the civ does not really die (and you can even chat with them), but is destroyed by Barbarians on next turn. Then a respawn may or not arise (which was the case in 1580 but not in 1590).

    I guess this is due to the manner computations are done : if you take a city, the program check wether the civ has no other left, but this is not done after killing/bribing a unit. But when that civ would play, nothing is available an the program deduce that the civ must have been killed by barbs.

    I guess this is either incorrect or well known :)
     
  8. Jokemaster

    Jokemaster Insert something here

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2010
    Messages:
    524
    IIRC it happened to me in GOTM119 as well, so it might be quote-unquote "intended" behaviour.
     
  9. Ali Ardavan

    Ali Ardavan Mathematician Moderator Civ2 GOTM Staff

    Joined:
    May 29, 2002
    Messages:
    2,930
    Location:
    Michigan, USA
    Now that I see your explanation, I recall the exact same thing. I think you are right on target lasingularidad.
     
  10. Autumn Leaf

    Autumn Leaf Since 1992

    Joined:
    May 9, 2016
    Messages:
    157
    Location:
    Melbourne, Australia
    What an excellent map! For practice only, I just played this game through twice, once conquest and once OCC, using these spoilers to help inform my play (since this GOTM is over).

    The conquest was accomplished in 950 BC. It would have been sooner but a Barbarian invasion delayed destruction of the Egyptians by a couple of turns. The AI kept respawning on the French site. In fact, when I destroyed the French, the Germans and the Vikings appeared there simultaneously and both talked to me. I left them alone and the Vikings eventually built Trondheim, but the two German Settlers just stood there until I got impatient and killed them.

    The OCC finished in 1983 with 10k colonists on AC, and I learned quite a bit from the exercise. It's actually a very nice map for an OCC beginner like me, because the small map constrained the growth of the AI civs a little so I had breathing space to try a few different things out. In the OCC game I ended up with ranked Mech Inf and Freight fortified in every square of my city (the latter doubled up in fortifications wherever my land overlapped with enemy cities so I couldn't use military units there) to keep enemy spies out. They couldn't steal anything spacey from me (having already stolen a low-level tech early in the game - a useful accident) but one time, after launching my spaceship I let them through, just to see what they would do (I wasn't playing it as a GOTM, remember, but just for practice, so I allowed myself reloads when I wanted to investigate multiple ways of doing things) and in one turn 10-15 Diplomats came in and sabotaged me almost to my knees! I reloaded and resolved not to do that again. I also neglected to do much terrain modification, except for turning one mountain into a hill. I maxed out at 26 pop, with 112 shields. If I had thought it through I would have sacrificed some shields (I only needed 80, enough to build SSS, as until I started building Mech Inf, all my military was bribed NONE units, originally cheap-to-buy low-level units that had been upgraded to Riflemen and Cavalry by the Workshop) for more people to make into Einsteins for faster research.
     
  11. Ali Ardavan

    Ali Ardavan Mathematician Moderator Civ2 GOTM Staff

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    2,930
    Location:
    Michigan, USA
    Really? I have never heard that before. I thought it is impossible to have two nations of the same color in the game at the same time. If you have a save, you should upload it. I bet others would like to investigate that as well.
    Glad to hear that. OCC takes some practice. Once you get the hang of it, it is a fun challenge.
    On the contrary this is a difficult map to play OCC on. While your observation about the growth of rivals is correct, their proximity to you is more of an issue near the end when they can easily overwhelm you with a lot of units. The AI is not smart about launching major long distance assaults. Furthermore, the small distances and lack of growth for rivals means much smaller payouts on deliveries which translates into much smaller growth for you. What makes OCC feasible, more than anything else, is speed. Given enough time, the rivals will overwhelm you; so it is crucial to get to the space launch quickly and deliveries are a big component of that.
     
  12. Autumn Leaf

    Autumn Leaf Since 1992

    Joined:
    May 9, 2016
    Messages:
    157
    Location:
    Melbourne, Australia
    I did continue playing the OCC game after my spaceship landed and things became very busy indeed. Having only one city, I could only build one unit per turn, but the AIs had a lot of cities and even though the kill-ratio favoured me (at least until they got Mech Inf of their own), they were able to kill my units faster than I could replace them. Short of breaking the one-city leaguer and capturing their nearer cities to create a moat, the most effective response I came up with was to nuke them till they glowed. Of course, that was unsustainable as the OCC location is land-based and just as vulnerable to global warming as the AI cities. Engineers cleaning up pollution without at least two Mech Infs to protect them didn't last long, and even with the Mech Infs they rarely got back alive. The only thing I haven't tried is sucking up to the AI and gifting them a bunch of techs. Maybe if I drop my power ranking far enough they will go back to killing each other instead of me!

    Regarding the French/German/Viking weirdness I thought I'd overwritten the conquest saves when playing OCC, but I just checked the Recycle bin of my games VM and found a deleted one that exhibits some of it on my machine. Open the attached 2550 BC save (GM_171_x.SAV) and capture Paris. It doesn't happen exactly the same way every time. Sometimes I get just the Germans or just the Vikings, but sometimes I do get both conducting diplomacy with me in the same turn.

    However I have been unable to replicate the strangest part of it, where after destroying Trondheim, I found two German Settlers standing frozen on the coast behind it. I have no save of that from before destroying Trondheim (my 2500 BC save was obliterated by the OCC one). I do however have a save from after I destroyed Trondheim (2450 BC, GM_171_y.SAV), with the two frozen Germans. My Chariot is standing on the site of Trondheim, which it has just destroyed. However when I check my new saves from 2450 BC, all the AI units I find now appear to belong to just one civ - although there are usually 3 or 4 Settlers wandering around the vicinity. I am guessing now that what actually happened is that these two Settlers just appeared there when I destroyed Trondheim, but it's odd how they are frozen. When I kill them the game tells me the Germans have been destroyed by Barbarians (the usual message when a civ is destroyed before it founds a city) and they don't get credited to me in the replay.

    I just realised, looking at that save now, that I actually destroyed Paris in 2550 BC. By then I had already destroyed the Japanese (who did not respawn) and the Russians (ditto). :sad: If I had known that all the others were dead, then after cleaning up the north-east I would have kept one Chariot up north to watch for re-spawns, but brought the other back, built up a Phalanx army down south, and marched on Egypt, who were just about to contact me (and build a city) near Moscow! Instead, not knowing where the new White and Green were, worried about the Egyptians, still unable to build any offensive units and having only those two precious Chariots, one of which had just almost died attacking Paris, I pulled back to defend my core territory, settling the empty lands around my capital to ensure nobody could ever threaten me. I didn't go after the Egyptians till I had Elephants. A thousand wasted years.
     

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