How does cultural flipping work?

[ViterboKnight]

With Warlords, cultural flippings happened, well, not so often, but some times.
Since I started playing BTS, I've never been able to culturally flip an enemy city, neither has an AI.

I tried to set up a map in the editor, to see how this works. That's what's happened.
A huge city of mine, with plenty of culture, close to a newly found Size-1 enemy city, plus a great artist creating a culture boom in my city; time passed, some revolts occurred in the enemy city, but it resisted. I added a second city, to close his from two directions, and had another culture boom into this new one, reducing his land to the only city square. The enemy city continued to resist, what's more, gaining a couple of squares with its culture. I also sent several spies in the city, to incite revolts and to spread culture. No way. The city seems never to flip to me!!!


So, is it still possible to peacefully flip an enemy city? Maybe with BTS some things have been changed?

 

[Refar]

I seen cities flip in BTS 3.13, so it's possible. But i also sometimes see the behaviour you described - revolt after revolt, yet not flipping... No idea what the machanics are.
From experince you need constant pressure via (ridiculously) high /turn, rather than the short GA burst.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=225927 < here is a old thread that explains some - but not all - occurences. Also i read somewhere that the effect the GA-Bomb has on adjacent tiles was changed (nerfed ?) in BTS.

Overall flipping seems much to arbitrary to be a raliable strategic tool.

EDIT: PS.: There is also the "No Culture Flipping" chackbox in the "Custom Game" menu... If checked, no city will ever flip, obviously...

 

[JamesWolfpacker]

If there are enough troops in the city then they will keep the city from revolting or flipping due to culture. The AI in BTS probably realizes this better than before and stocks excess troops if available in a pressured city to keep it from flipping.

 

[ViterboKnight]

The city only had one warrior, and a very low production to build more units.
That map has been set up with the editor, so I'm sure about it.

 

[Shirastro]

They happen, but not as nearly as often as in vanilla or Civ 3.
I remember once, i was playing with French, and there was an English town i wanted to culturally take, yet it never flipped even thou it was size 2 (since my culture stole all the tiles around it).
I passed with my mouse over it to see the % of culture that tile belong to...it was 100% mine 0% English, yet nothing, it stayed in English possessions till the end of the game.

 

[ViterboKnight]

So, isn't the "Spread Culture" espionage mission nearly useless?
Or has it any other purpose, apart from culture flipping an enemy city?

 

[pxpdoo]

Culture-flipping cities is a main tactic of mine; being a Gandhi-monger
Generally the city will revolt once, maybe twice, then will ask to join. # of military units definitely make a difference...
As with the last poster, the spy "spread culture" mission: Does that spread MY culture in a city, or just culture in general? (Doesn't seem like the latter would make much sense...)

 

[Refar]

It does spread your culture in the city. However it gives you something like 5% of the culture you already has there... so unless you already applied some cultural pressure the mission is useless.

 

[pxpdoo]

I wonder how the spy spreads culture, maybe standing on a street corner handing out pro-me brochures? lol

 

[Refar]

I guess he opens a "insert_your_country_here"-restorant or store...

 

[Emperor Giulio]

It really helps if you are the leader in the apostolic palace election. You can culture flip a city much easier if you choose to assign it to your empire, although this has to be included on a resolution. As for culture flipping regularly, in a recent game, I made 2 surrounding cities flip due to a ridiculously cultured one I have, I play BTS so it is possible. GA is definitely good, but also you should take advantage of the great engineers to rush a World Wonder that will help produce more culture. Just keep at it; I am sure they will flip for you eventually.

 

[graves_09]

I had 3 cities flip while going for a cultural victory. I was Louis and 2 of 3 were near my cities going for ledgendary culture. i also used the AP to get one to flip. the others did it by itself. it was bts 0.13

 

[Thanny]

I seen cities flip in BTS 3.13, so it's possible. But i also sometimes see the behaviour you described - revolt after revolt, yet not flipping... No idea what the machanics are.
<snip>
EDIT: PS.: There is also the "No Culture Flipping" chackbox in the "Custom Game" menu... If checked, no city will ever flip, obviously...

Unless flipping is impossible, a city can only revolt once safely. After the second revolt, it flips.

If you see a city revolting over and over, then it won't flip because of the option you mention, or because it was "conquered", and you haven't enabled flipping after conquest. I use quotes because the same is true if you gift a city.

 

[Refar]

Great point Thanny. I completely forgot about this...

A question tho: Does every city, that is not in the hands of a civ who built it counts as 'conquered' in this context ? Or does the option only affect "Flipping-back" to the civ it was conquered from ?

For example:
I try to Flip a city that Shaka took from a third party... Is this a conquered city ?

 

[Thanny]

Great point Thanny. I completely forgot about this...

A question tho: Does every city, that is not in the hands of a civ who built it counts as 'conquered' in this context ? Or does the option only affect "Flipping-back" to the civ it was conquered from ?

For example:
I try to Flip a city that Shaka took from a third party... Is this a conquered city ?

It's only considered conquered to the former owner(s).