How Should Civics, Policies and Governments Work in Civ 7?

[Boris Gudenuf]

This. I completely agree. GP should play a major role in Tech research and Civic acquiring. They are the real backbone of Human Developpement. Many Inventions of Humanity can be lead back to individual Persons, which also made use of other Scholars' Works. So a rework of GP acquiring should also be considered. Maybe each District/Type would have a GPP Threshold that upom reaching it a GP can be acquired (Which will make the City lose a Specialist Citizen).

Agree that GP should have more general and specific in-game influence instead of 'generic' influence regardless of the game situation - would, for example, Thomas Edison have been as inventive if he lived in a rigid Theocracy? It can be argued either way.

On the other hand, precisely how important 'Great People' are has been hotly debated by historians for generations. The "Great Man" theory, as it was originally termed, holds that GPs Drive human progress and change. The other side is what I call the "When it's time to railroad, people will railroad", which holds that progress comes when events make it both possible and necessary, and which individual does the inventing is immaterial: Someone is going to do it when the time is right.

This being a game, we can pick which, or both, to simulate, and I think a combination would be the best bet: the exact influence a GP provides (except possibly those that provide Great Works) should vary according to whether 'it's time to railroad' - what kind of in-game situation the GP is thrust into. By the same token, it doesn't take a Great Person to build a Dam when you are getting flooded every other year, or develop better cavalry or infantry weapons if you are getting your butt kicked by more advanced opponents. Adversity and Need sharpen everybody's mind, not just a Leonardo's.

 

[Zegangani]

Agree that GP should have more general and specific in-game influence instead of 'generic' influence regardless of the game situation - would, for example, Thomas Edison have been as inventive if he lived in a rigid Theocracy? It can be argued either way.

On the other hand, precisely how important 'Great People' are has been hotly debated by historians for generations. The "Great Man" theory, as it was originally termed, holds that GPs Drive human progress and change. The other side is what I call the "When it's time to railroad, people will railroad", which holds that progress comes when events make it both possible and necessary, and which individual does the inventing is immaterial: Someone is going to do it when the time is right.

This being a game, we can pick which, or both, to simulate, and I think a combination would be the best bet: the exact influence a GP provides (except possibly those that provide Great Works) should vary according to whether 'it's time to railroad' - what kind of in-game situation the GP is thrust into. By the same token, it doesn't take a Great Person to build a Dam when you are getting flooded every other year, or develop better cavalry or infantry weapons if you are getting your butt kicked by more advanced opponents. Adversity and Need sharpen everybody's mind, not just a Leonardo's.

True. I can't see why we shouldn't have both Methodes. Developpement is mostly going pregressively, GP had major influence on it, but a lot (if not most) of things were invented just with Time and Events.

The way I see it, is we could keep The Tech research Systeme as is, with more emphasise on specialists, but exclude certain Techs/Inventions that can only be obtained via certain Events or GP. One doesn't need a GP to get to know how to use Wheels, but one certainly needs GP or Events to learn the use of Niter for Gunpowder. And That's why making a Universal Tech/Civic Tree for all Civs is not very reasonable.
The Unlocking of certain Techs/Civics and their respective Bonusses/Abilities could also be triggered by meeting and interacting with Civs that have them researched/unlocked. And Eurekas/Inspirations could also be triggered by certain Events, like fighting and winning a Combat/Battle against Units that use Gunpowder, would trigger the Gunpowder Tech Eureka and therefore make the Tech available for research (Great Scientists could unluck Techs immidiately), because your Scholars/GreatScientists would have something to research upon.

 

[Kouvb593kdnuewnd]

I think Civ V system was too permament, but Civ VI you have ton of cards but many of them feels pretty irrelevant and you can change them all the time meaning the long term planing element from Civ IV and V is largely gone. The governments themself is quite uninspired.

First I think there should be something called plans, it would work somewhat similar to world congress but just for your own civilization. Every X number of turns a planing secession would be held in which you would have to set a plan, plans would come in two parts, goals which give you a bonus if you accomplish them with the check would be the next planing secession an example could be to reduce your CO2 emission. The second part would be policies or something like that which would give you bonuses, but maybe also penalties, like heavy industry focus could give your factories more production but increase their CO2 production and reduce the amount of money you make, policies would also only last for the planing secession.

Then the semi permament part would be ideology, which I think should work something like it did in humankind. Ideology would not be directly set by the player but would be affected on which actions you pick, for example picking the heavy industry focus could move you one step towards explotation and picking the goal to reduce CO2 emission may put you one step towards nature and then accomplish the goal may move you one further step towards nature on an explotation vs nature scale. Being closer to nature would reduce your CO2 emission and probably give you various bonuses from natural terrain but at the same time reduce your industrial output while explotation would be the opposit.

Last would be the permament part which would be things like your civilization bonuses and maybe various achivements your civilization could get from accomplishing goals, like the reduce CO2 emission goal could give something like a permament bonus to diplomacy with other civilizations.