I think I finally have a favorite CIV...

[El Caballerion]

after playing around with the different CIVs for quite some time, I think I am going to go with SPAIN. Of course, it's a CIV that may require a few reloads while you wander around like Moses in the desert looking for a NW (the only downside), but once you find one, it opens up a whole new plethora of massive gameplay changes unlike any other CIV.

Currently, I reloaded a map (after about 4 reloads) and settled on a small island, founding my city next to Mt. FUJI (4 gold, 4 culture, 8 religion when doubled!). Because the mountain did not provide food, I couldn't work it until my city reached 3 pop. Once that happened, I was able to found the first pantheon (ultimately, the first religion), the gold bonuses kept me from going bankrupt early game, and the culture bonus enabled me to grab some well-needed SP. Even with the doubling bonus, it's never game breaking when you play the game on IMMORTAL. It merely puts you on par with the other (cheating) AIs.

That's why I love them. Each NW brings different perks to use in the game without becoming massively OP. I started a game next to KING SOLOMON's MINES once, immediately thinking that I was going to kick some major ass in building wonders asap. However, I started lacking behind in the technology race, so I was pretty much just playing rather mediocre in comparision. In another game, I started next to CERRO DE POTOSI, and while I was able to build a few key buildings, I was still suffering to found a religion and had limited population growth.

All in all, the NW doubling causes heavy one-sidedness without being overpowered. You will have an amazing comfortable early game. Plus, I like to turtle up (too many good wonders in the first few eras), and usually start my first wars around the Renaissance, which is when Spain's UUs come into play.

Anyone else feel got a touch of the Spanish flu?

 

[El Caballerion]

Another question... can Macchu Pichu be built on top of Mt. Fuji?

 

[aljung]

I also like them. Even if you don't spot any NWs first, you still get the double happiness (usually about 5) and 100g per NW discovered.

 

[Tachii]

Was going to make a Spanish flu thread.

They're remarkly apt to get a quick growth in the early game due to the extra 100gs and happiness. Usually for other civs I can only make 3 cities. With Spain, 4 is very easy - even if you don't find a Natural Wonder to settle near. The early gold + happiness is great.

But of course, if you do find a Natural Wonder near you (it seems to be about 50% I think when I reroll), the game can easily get broken real quick. Last game I ended up being near Lake Victoria. +12 food is lolzy.

 

[Kaigen]

Another question... can Macchu Pichu be built on top of Mt. Fuji?

From another thread, I believe that in order to build Machu Picchu you need a non-NW mountain within range, but sometimes the graphic for it will end up on the NW mountain anyway.

So the answer is "no," but if you can build it anyway because of another mountain, it might look like you are.

 

[Emstinson]

Once I have tried out every civ in the game/expansion I go to playing either random or picking Spain. They are the only civ I ever feel like playing enough to actually pick them outright. Mainly because of the equalization the doubling provides on the higher difficulties as you said. I just love being able to have a crazy good knight who can settle cities. I definitely have the Spanish Flu....

 

[pyroflare77]

Yeah, Spain's pretty good. The only problem is city-states seem to start next to natural wonders a lot.

 

[mrwho]

I've had two Spanish games where I've got Lake Victoria and another with The Fountain of Youth. They were good games!

 

[redwings1340]

I'm playing them right now, and my second and third cities were founded on faith bonus mountains. I had around 44 faith per turn by like 2000 BC. I'm well behind scientifically, but my religion dominated the continent pretty easily.

As a question: is wandering around to settle your capital on a natural wonder worth doing? I really want the experience of that, so I think I'm going to play on marathon next time so I can be absolutely sure that it is.

 

[Muskie]

Any strategy that requires you to restart multiple times until you get what you want, isn't a very good strategy at all.

 

[Csjbo08]

I remember finding and settling my first 2 non-capital cities next to Krakatoa (for once it wasn't out in the middle of the ocean) and the Great Barrier Reef, with all the early science that I got, it felt like I was on a completely different difficulty level than where I was at.

 

[troublmaker]

Any strategy that requires you to restart multiple times until you get what you want, isn't a very good strategy at all.

And thus not an amazing enough Civ to be called " a favorite."

 

[Matthew.]

Yeah, Spain's pretty good. The only problem is city-states seem to start next to natural wonders a lot.

As much hate as Honor gets, the free GG can actually be decent at stealing CS luxuries and NW's. Much of the time I actually prefer to use it to gain an additional luxury than to keep around for war--you get more soon enough anyway.

Of course you can just settle close and purchase the tiles, but that requires a gold investment up front which isn't always available. Especially in BNW where lump sum trades are harder to come by.

Then again, we are talking about Spain so discovering the NW is enough gold to support any tile purchase

Any strategy that requires you to restart multiple times until you get what you want, isn't a very good strategy at all.

Thankfully this thread is talking about how fun Spain can be to play and not how dependable their "strategy" is.

 

[kwidem]

.

 

[cambasonso]

In another game, I started next to CERRO DE POTOSI, and while I was able to build a few key buildings, I was still suffering to found a religion and had limited population growth.

That's because you didn't take the "One with Nature" pantheon which gives 8 faith per Natural Wonders. There's nothing prettier than to mouse over your NW tiles and see those beautiful numbers. My favorites the great barrier reefs: 4 foods, 2 hammers, 2 gold, 4 science, 8 faith and 10 culture (from world congress natural heritage sites!) multiplied by 2! Just amazing.

Every time I play Spain I know I will always be the first and strongest religion, easily getting 15 to 20 happiness from 1 per 2 cities following...

I never cared much about them in G&K but in BNW they are a favorite for the money factor mainly (even worst case scenario before turn 20 I'm able to buy a settler) and the religion power which is now so important. I always found Barcelona (second city) on a NW even if I have to cross the whole world, this is how good it is. It once took me 23 turns of walk to found it but the 20gpt and 8fpt kept me afloat during the whole game. Viva Espana!

 

[kb27787]

Spain with great barrier reef (and a few other NW close to the start point) is the only way I can beat deity (with a pre-saved map XD so I don't really count as a win)
Any NW though makes immortal less frustrating and more cruise-control.
Emperor? As long as you find them the +100 gold should be more than enough to push you over the top (that's almost a free 1000 gold throughout the whole game)

 

[Resipsa]

I agree to an extent, although however you look at it, even if Spain don't start next to anything, they still get the happiness bonuses, gold bonuses, and the Tercio and Conquisitador are not bad.

If you are unlucky and can't find any wonders first and can't put a new city near a NW
they are a bottom tier civ along with Denmark/Polynesia/Indonesia. If you get the bonus for finding first and can settling near a NW they are top tier civ. Incredibly luck dependent, I dislike them.

 

[kb27787]

That's because you didn't take the "One with Nature" pantheon which gives 8 faith per Natural Wonders. There's nothing prettier than to mouse over your NW tiles and see those beautiful numbers. My favorites the great barrier reefs: 4 foods, 2 hammers, 2 gold, 4 science, 8 faith and 10 culture (from world congress natural heritage sites!) multiplied by 2! Just amazing.

Every time I play Spain I know I will always be the first and strongest religion, easily getting 15 to 20 happiness from 1 per 2 cities following...

I never cared much about them in G&K but in BNW they are a favorite for the money factor mainly (even worst case scenario before turn 20 I'm able to buy a settler) and the religion power which is now so important. I always found Barcelona (second city) on a NW even if I have to cross the whole world, this is how good it is. It once took me 23 turns of walk to found it but the 20gpt and 8fpt kept me afloat during the whole game. Viva Espana!

I love all those mods Mt. Kilimanjaro early game is pretty sick too... (and who can forget lake Victoria (super food) or Uluru (food AND faith AND you can pick another pantheon and still get the 12 faith bonus)
El Dorado is a free 1000 gold which is nice...
Fountain of youth = found as many cities early game as you like. Others are less GB (but King's Solomons mines while probably give you 2-3 early wonders you wouldn't get on immortal, and all the early wonders you'd want to on Prince)

 

[Tachii]

You don't need to restart multiple times for Spain.

It's not necessary to have a city with a Natural Wonder for Spain to have a good game. It just makes games with a Natural Wonder insanely strong. Like said, the happiness/gold in the very early game is useful for fast growth. In most games you'd be finding 2 natural wonders which constitutes to +4 more happiness and +200-1000 gold before turn 100.

@redwings1340, not a good idea. Sometimes you won't be able to find a natural wonder for many, many turns. It's too much of a gamble.

 

[El Caballerion]

Thankfully this thread is talking about how fun Spain can be to play and not how dependable their "strategy" is.

Amen, brother.